Indian Air Force : News, Pics and Discussion thread

Originally posted by paf thunder
Stealth: Any idea on what 126 indian MRCA will be? Ans when's the deadline for the IAF to pick their 126 MRCA's?

Read his sale brochure
The Rafale - As good as it can get. Stealth.Supercruise.Omnirole.

China-white ( )'s trolling efforts are noteworthy

Thunder & emile : The single most important factor IMHO is geopolitics. All the airplanes are very good ones and the IAF will be more than satisfied with any of them. However geopolitics and issues that have nothing to do with the quality of the airplanes seem to be the deciding factor.

With the India-US nuclear deal and the India-France nuke deal almost complete, i am inclined to believe that it will be from any one of these two countries.

The following issuse IMHO will play a very important role :

> US support to India's permanent Security Council seat bid (alredy supported by Russia, France, UK, Japan, Garmany, China and many more)

> Sucess of the nuke deal with the US

> Making up trade deficits

Personally if you ask me - i'll chose the customised Mig-35 over everything else. But alas!, procuring the same will make little geopolitical sense.

Originally posted by echoblade

Originally posted by R988
Actually the Rafale is 'proven in comabt', it participated in strikes on Afghanistan in 2001. Not much of a high threat environment, but it has dropped bombs in anger.

www.strategypage.com...

Well that source is wrong. As a matter of fact, the Rafale version that is currently in service is of a standard that doesn't allow air to ground missions. The Rafale did take part in CAPs with F/A-18s over the Afghanistan-Pakistan border but it's its more "combat" oriented action to date.
Actually its participation in strikes has been limited so far to refuelling Super Etendards, so technically speaking it did take part in the raid but claiming it would be slightly far-fetched...

taken from here:

www.abovetopsecret.com...

so Rafale is NOT multi role YET.

Originally posted by Harlequin
so Rafale is NOT multi role YET.

Yep, it will be next summer with the F2 standard entering service, and by then I'm not sure the Indian RFP is released.

Ahhh...oui!! ...
C'est vrai...
Mais je pense que l'avion Rafale n'a pas beacoup de chance avec les officiales Indiens.

Originally posted by Daedalus3
Ahhh...oui!! ...
C'est vrai...
Mais je pense que l'avion Rafale n'a pas beacoup de chance avec les officiales Indiens.

Why not? French fighters are quite popular in those parts of the world. They have bought Mirages in the past, so why wouldn't they want to buy Rafale's?
I think its more likely they will buy European fighters instead of American ones...

Originally posted by Stealth Spy
China-white (

)'s trolling efforts are noteworthy

Not everyone is a drone.

Take it easy it was a joke Drones can laugh to?

---------------------------------------------------------

EDIT::::...Wow Nice new layout

[edit on 2-3-2006 by chinawhite]

Originally posted by chinawhite
Not everyone is a drone.

Take it easy it was a joke

Drones can laugh to?

Who wouldn't laugh when the droniest of all drones is a self confessed 'china-white'....

Now getting on to things whose that are not as illegal as china-white ...

U.S. to boost arms sales to India
NEW DELHI, India (CNN) -- India will be able to buy more sophisticated fighter aircraft and other high-tech arms from the United States as part of a closer defense relationship between the two nations, the United States Department of Defense has said.

"It is our goal to help meet India's needs in the defense realm, and to provide important capabilities and technologies that India seeks. We are on a path to accomplish this," the statement said.

The defense decision comes as the U.S. and India signed a groundbreaking nuclear pact during a visit to New Delhi by U.S. President George W. Bush."Where only a few years ago, no one would have talked about the prospects for a major U.S.-India defense deal, today the prospects are promising, whether in the realm of combat aircraft, helicopters, maritime patrol aircraft or naval vessels," the department statement said.

"Our proposal will also address India's interest in technology transfer and indigenous co-production."

Under the nuclear deal announced Thursday, India pledges to open up its 14 civilian nuclear reactors to international inspectors and keep power generation separate from its military program. But India -- which first tested its nuclear weapons nearly eight years ago -- will keep eight sites for secret military purposes under the terms of the deal, reached after intense negotiation. The U.S. agreed to send nuclear fuel and expertise to India in exchange for New Delhi opening up its civilian nuclear reactors to international inspectors. Bush said the agreement would help to "make the world safer" and praised India for setting an example "for other nations to participate in civilian nuclear power in such a way as to address nonproliferation concerns." India has not signed the Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty. A richer India also could be a larger market for U.S. goods and Bush is anxious to help. India's economy is booming and requiring more power, and that demand is expected to continue to rise. India and the United States now say the nuclear pact is the centerpiece of what they call a "strategic partnership."

Full artcle at cnn.com

Wonder if the AESA super hornet will walk away with the contest ?

[edit on 3-3-2006 by Stealth Spy]

Originally posted by Stealth Spy

Wonder if the AESA super hornet will walk away with the contest ?

I would hate for them to choose the worst out of the aircraft in the competition.

Everything else is newer


anyway - when will the usa `open up` any of its reactors to inspection

Originally posted by Stealth Spy
Who wouldn't laugh when the droniest of all drones is a self confessed 'china-white'....

Cheap shot my friend

Finally going back to your standard instead of pretending to be a rational person?.

droniest of all drones??. Come on is that the best you can come up with

And to over react with a joke . very low self esteem

[edit on 3-3-2006 by chinawhite]

Super hornet and F-16 formally offered..
I doubt the hornet will be chosen.. But the F-16 looks like a serious contender for a split deal.


I seriously you two should get over this petty squabbling..

[edit on 3-3-2006 by Daedalus3]

Originally posted by Daedalus3
I seriously you two should get over this petty squabbling..

While a joke is not to be taking seriously

joke as defined by dictionary.com
"Something not to be taken seriously; a triviality"

joke as defined by oxford
"something said or done to make people laugh"

joke as defined by dict.die.net...
"
1: a humorous anecdote or remark
2: activity characterized by good humor"


Dont you hate uptight people?. Did i mention anything offensive or anything about preious india?. And he went on talking about my name and a drug??.

And i quote from him " droniest of all drones" . wow how imaginative

[edit on 4-3-2006 by chinawhite]

Perhaps you might might want to check what china white means in that dictionary of yours as well ... and perhaps you might go check who started this "drone" name calling on the thread as well...

And to prevent the wasteage of a post on silly bickering, here are parts of a lenghty article that gives some new news and insights :

India’s quest for fighter could cost losers dearly
By Reuben F. Johnson / Asian Aerospace February 2006

[...]
... the requirement that any fighter participating in the competition be equipped with an active electronically scanning array (AESA) radar. “We are ninety-five percent or better confident that having an AESA onboard is going to be a make-or-break condition of bidding on this program–it is the price of admission,” said one Western industry representative familiar with the program.

[...]Lockheed Martin’s venerable F-16 is the most popular aircraft in the region, but as of today only one model of the aircraft is equipped with an AESA, the Northrop Grumman (NG) AN/APG-80 that was developed for the F-16E/F Block 60. If Lockheed Martin were to sell the new variant of the Block 60 to the IAF (called block 70) they would have to pay the United Arab Emirates (UAE) an approximate 7 percent per aircraft royalty, as the desert kingdom funded the development of this configuration and has resale commission rights. Another solution would be for Northrup Grumman to retrofit the AN/APG-80 to the F-16C/D Block 50, making it a “Block 50 double plus” variant, but this involves costs and engineering problems that are not tackled lightly–most notably adding a liquid-cooling system.

[...]
Gripen International officials told Aviation International News that they were briefed here at Changi this week by the visiting chief of the IAF as to the requirements of the soon-to-be-issued tender. Ericsson, which supplies most of the electronics for the JAS-39, is bidding the Not Only a Radar (or NORA) AESA radar, which is supposed to contain some 1,000 transmit/receive (T/R) modules.

[...]The MiG-35 is to be an ambitious leap. It takes the MiG-29 and redesigns its structure, giving the aircraft an all-new digital internal infrastructure, and engines with a 3D thrust-vector control package similar to that of the Su-30MKI. Press releases and public statements on the MiG-35 have also stated that the Russians will not be outdone and will offer an AESA. The dark horse candidate in this case is the Israel Aircraft Industries (IAI) Elta EL/M-2052. IAI is showing this radar for the first time at Changi and although its spokesman will not confirm that the company is bidding with MiG on the Indian tender, it does state that the MiG-29/35 is one of the more near-term possibilities. The model seen here at the airshow is set up for a liquid-cooling system like most other AESAs, but IAI engineers claim that a version of this radar for the MiG-29 would be a smaller array, small enough that it could use an air-cooling system. Liquid-cooling systems can be a maintenance headache, so this is not a small accomplishment on the Israeli’s part.

Read the full article

An American source reports ...

By Patrick Goodenough

Mar 4, 2006

As the relationship between the United States and India advances in the political, economic and energy fields, so too are military ties strengthening, to such an extent that U.S. firms will go head-to-head with Russians and Europeans to bid for one of the biggest fighter plane deals in more than a decade.

Now India wants to replace its aging Soviet-era MIG-21 fighter jets, hoping to buy at least 126 and possibly as up to 200 new multi-role combat aircraft, a contract worth at least $9 billion. In today's changed circumstances, among the possibilities under consideration for the lucrative Indian deal are two American planes, the F/A-18E/F built by Boeing Corp., and Lockheed Martin's F-16.

"We are aware of past Indian concerns about reliability of supply," it said. One of the key elements of the close partnership we have developed with India is a clearer understanding of converging strategic interests, and mutual respect of each other's priorities."The U.S. intended to be a reliable partner, the statement added.

"It is our goal to help meet India's needs in the defense realm, and to provide important capabilities and technologies that India seeks," it said, adding that it would also address the interest expressed by India in technology transfers and indigenous co-production.

Kurt Campbell, an international security analyst at the Center for Strategic and International Studies, recently called the Indian plan to replace its Soviet-era planes "the most important fighter program of the 21st century," and noted that U.S. companies would for the first time be actively involved in competing.

After problems in the past, he said, "now at a political level and in some sections of the [Indian] military there is a belief and understanding that the United States indeed can be more of a partner with India on security and defense fronts, not just in terms of operations and exercises, but as a military provider." Campbell said that while it would not perhaps get as much public attention as other elements of Indo-U.S. ties, the defense relationship was the "unstated foundation" of the overall relationship, and would likely grow substantially in the years to come.

In the defense field, the two countries are already working together more closely. The Pentagon cited cooperation in bringing aid to survivors of the Asian tsunami and more advanced joint military exercises. A naval exercise last September-October was the largest ever between the two militaries, and for the first time involved aircraft carriers, and company-strength army maneuvers in the Himalayan foothills in January were also the biggest ever. In other examples of mutual support, the two navies escorted vessels through the vulnerable Malacca Strait amid concerns of terrorism and piracy in 2002, the Indian Air Force airlifted aid supplies to the U.S. in the aftermath of Hurricane Katrina, and last January the U.S. Navy rescued Indian mariners off the Horn of Africa after their ship was hijacked by Somali pirates. The defense partnership aims to support the two countries' common interests in maintaining stability, "defeating terrorism and violent religious extremism," preventing proliferation of non-conventional weapons and technologies, and maritime security, especially protecting crucial sea lanes. Speaking in New Delhi Thursday, Bush spoke enthusiastically about the developing relationship with India, describing it as a partnership "to make the world safer."

Full Article >>


Its being called "the most important fighter program of the 21st century," ... your thoughts ???

Thoughts about American reliability as a defence supplier ?

Here is the Official US DoD release - www.defenselink.mil...

[edit on 4-3-2006 by Stealth Spy]

New news on the Kaveri :

28/02/06
Flight International

India’s Aeronautical Development Agency (ADA) plans to deliver a Kaveri K9 turbofan to Russia for flight tests by mid-year in the run-up to the engine’s installation in the Tejas light combat aircraft (LCA) by the end of 2006.

The long-awaited Kaveri test move comes as Snecma wins an ADA contract to assist in its final development phase. “It’s more of a peer review contract,” says ADA propulsion systems group director Swaminathan Ratnam, who adds the upcoming Russian tests are scheduled to run from June through September on an Ilyushin Il-76 testbed.

Following the completion of tests, the engine will be returned to Bangalore for the start of installation work on PV1 , one of four LCAs currently engaged in flight tests. The indigenously developed Kaveri, originally planned as the baseline engine for the LCA, will replace the General Electric F404-IN20, 11 of which have now been supplied to the indigenous Indian fighter programme.

The integration effort will involve replacing sections of the fuselage as well as an inlet design optimised for the Kaveri. Flight tests are not expected to start until well into 2007.

Meanwhile, the ADA displayed at Asian Aerospace a model of the naval version of LCA.

The N-LCA :

Article

The Kaveri was previously being tested on the Tu-16 testbed...wonder why its now an Il-76

Tejas light combat aircraft completes 500th flight test

'Tejas', the indigenous Light Combat Aircraft, completed its 500th flight test here today. The aircraft was successfuly test flown by Gp. Capt. N Harish, the Aeronautical Development Agency said in a statement.

The aircraft flew at 1.4 mach, 12 km altitude and the flight duration was 27 minutes. "This flight was part of the ongoing flight test programme towards operational clearance of Tejas aircraft," the statement said. The 500th flight of Tejas Prototype Vehicle, in IAF colours, was witnessed by Air Marshal A K Nagalia, Deputy Chief of Air Staff, IAF.

IAF has cleared induction of the first Tejas squadron into operational service. Formal Government approval for Tejas production programme is awaited, it added.

Full Article >>

Finally, both the Tejas and the Kaveri seem to be gathering much needed speed.

Thursday, Feb. 09, 2006,BALASORE: India on Wednesday tested an advanced version of the home-grown pilot-less plane Lakshya from a defence base in Orissa, officials said here. The unmanned aerial vehicle was test flown at 11.48am from the integrated test range at Chandipur in the coastal district of Balasore. This was its second test since Monday.
Lakshya is a subsonic reusable aerial target system that is remote-controlled from the ground and is designed to impart training to both pilots and air defence personnel in engaging targets, IANS reported.

Wednesday's trial was undertaken with an improved engine and other sub-systems developed by the Defence Research and Development Organisation (DRDO) to check the viability of the improved engine, officials said.

Lakshya has a flight duration of 30 to 35 minutes. It drops down with the help of a parachute and is later retrieved by a helicopter. Officials said the six-foot micro-aircraft was designed and developed by the Aeronautical Development Establishment in Bangalore and Bharat Dynamics Limited in Hyderabad developed its engine.

Article >>

Govt approves more Prithvis for IAF

NEW DELHI: Continuing with big spending on new military acquisitions and stepping up the country's indigenous missile production, the Cabinet Committee on Security (CCS) on Thursday night finalised purchase of over Rs 1000 crores worth of new missiles, and acquisition of new training jets and interceptor boats. Defence minister Pranab Mukherjee said the CCS has approved 54 Prithvi missiles for the Indian Air Force from Hyderbad-based Bharat Dynamics Limited. The missiles would cost Rs 1114 crores and would be the biggest acquisition of the indigenous missile for IAF.

The CCS also approved 12 Intermediate Jet Trainers for the IAF worth Rs 486.82 crores. The trainers are made by the Hindustan Aeronautics Limited and meant for pilots in the initial stage of flying before they graduate to Advanced Jet Trainers and then to fighters. The CCS also approved purchase of 11 interceptor boats for Coast Guard at a cost of over Rs 200 crores.

The Prithvi-II is a surface-to-surface missile with a range of 250 km and is capable of carrying up to 750-kg payload. The missile is a dual engine, road-mobile, liquid fuel missile. Sources say the payload is being increased to 1000-kg. Prithvi is an indigenously developed missile that is in service with the Army and also has a naval version. It was also India's first ballistic missile until the much longer ranged Agni came into service. The missile order, coupled with the newly created facility for Brahmos cruise missile manufacturing in Hyderabad would result in a significant jump in the number of missiles produced within India, sources said. Prithvi would be used only for conventional roles-to launch pre-fragmented explosives, cluster munitions etc against critical enemy installations.

Full Article >>

Long range maritime recon tender

NEW DELHI, MAR 8 The Government today said a request for proposal to procure Long Range Maritime Reconnaissance Anti-Submarine Warfare aircraft has been issued to vendors all over the world.

The vendors include manufacturers of P3C Orion aircraft and Navy International Programme Office, USA, Defence Minister Pranab Mukherjee informed the Rajya Sabha. In a written reply, he informed the House that Boeing P8A is a futuristic platform which is under development and at a conceptual stage.

With regard to setting up of a National Defence University and National Institute of Nano-Technology in Punjab, Mukherjee said the Committee on National Defence University has recommended setting up of the university.

So the P8 is unlikely....so that leaves the P-3 pitted against the Nimrod and the Russian types....perhaps the Nimrod will be a better buy

A part of the article in Force mag. on the Typhoon and the MRCA tender ...

The latest entrant in the race is the European consortium EADS with its Eurofighter-Typhoon. The Typhoon is a single-seat, twin-engine, agile combat aircraft and can be used in the air-to-air, air-to-ground and tactical reconnaissance roles. The aircraft comes with a long range radar and Infra Red Search and Track (IRST) system, advanced medium and short range air-to-air missiles and a comprehensive electronic warfare suite to enhance weapon system effectiveness and survivability. The airframe is built of about 50 per cent composite materials by weight and about 70 per cent by surface area, with substantial use of Titanium and lithium-aluminum alloys elsewhere. Use of stealth technology is incorporated throughout the aircraft’s basic design. The advanced construction techniques also reduce the parts count of the airframe, with the Typhoon having about 16,000 structural elements.

The EADS is hopeful that Indian can take advantage of the latest technology at a cheaper price. Talking about cooperating with the Indian companies, Guillaume GASPARRI, country head of the EADS in India said, “We are sure that if the deal goes through, we would be able to produce the Typhoon in India only”. EADS is even reported to have offered to take India on board its fifth generation fighter aircraft development project. The Typhoon has formally entered service with the Italian Air Force. The company expects the Initial Operational Capability to be declared by Germany, Spain and the United Kingdom in 2006. The UK intends to procure 232 aircraft to replace the Tornado F3 and the Jaguar.

Now would anyone care to tell me which this "fifth generation fighter aircraft development project." is ???

First I've heard of it stealth spy, don't know if its real or paper talk. I tend to think the latter.