Israeli hostages killed mistakenly in Gaza were holding white flag, official says

a reply to: Daughter2v2

Whereas those lovely Hamas types couldn't give a monkeys about dead Palestinians. On the contrary, the more the merrier to fuel their sick propaganda that some seem to want to lap up.

From Human Rights watch.

First, these men and the other civilians abducted on October 7 should not have been in Gaza in the first place. Hamas and other Palestinian armed groups that are unlawfully detaining civilians and holding them as hostages are committing war crimes. They should immediately and unconditionally release all civilians still being held.

Second, civilians may never be attacked. Combatants expressing an intention to surrender, such as by waving a white flag, also cannot not be attacked. The improper use of a white flag to carry out an attack, called perfidy, is unlawful, but that clearly was not the case here. After a field investigation, Israel’s military chief of staff called the shootings “contrary to the rules of engagement.” Deliberately attacking civilians is a violation of the laws of war, and if those responsible acted with criminal intent, they could be prosecuted for war crimes.

Third, Israeli forces have in the past targeted Palestinian civilians in Gaza displaying or waving white flags when they were in plain view and posed no apparent threat. In 2009, Human Rights Watch documented seven incidents during hostilities in which Israeli soldiers unlawfully shot and killed 11 Palestinian civilians who were in groups carrying white flags. Among the victims were five women and four children. Human Rights Watch colleagues and I visited the site of each incident, interviewed at least three witnesses, gathered medical records, and inspected ballistic evidence. The Israeli military authorities declined to meet with us or answer our questions.

Finally, impunity fuels unlawful conduct. To our knowledge, the Israeli government has held no one to account for these and other grave abuses committed during the December 2008 to January 2009 hostilities. The Israeli rights group B’Tselem has called the Israeli military justice system a “whitewash mechanism,” after repeatedly filing well-documented complaints. Similarly, Hamas authorities have not held anyone to account for previously holding hostages or conducting unlawful attacks.
www.hrw.org...#:~:text=Second%2C%20civilians%20may%20never%20be,was%20not%20the%20case%20here .

I think the third point is on the money.

a reply to: Daughter2v2

The fact that this has came to light? And there will be consequences? To standards?

Vs? What would happen to the Hamas terrorists that specifically targeted civilians with murder, rape, torture, kidnapping, and being used as human shields from Oct 7th if Israel rolled over?

a reply to: gortex

And again. Israel isn’t directly attacking civilians. Israel is taking out valid terrorist targets being illegal shielded with humans.

The same questions. How do you take out active terrorist rocket attacks and manufacturing when neighborhoods and schools get turned into rocket bases, manufacturing and rocket storage. When Hamas has launched rockets into Israel in the thousands.

When Hamas misfired rockets cause the incident see at Al-Ahli Arab Hospital on Oct 17th.

How do you deal with terrorist operation centers when they use tunnels purposefully built under neighborhoods, schools, and hospitals.

a reply to: gortex

How big is Gaza? And there are 300 miles of terrorist tunnels under Gaza? Being actively used as command centers, rally points, weapons storage, and hide terrorists. Entry / exit points used to get rockets and weapons to the surface to launch terror attacks. How do you take out those tunnels that are used as sanctioned terrorist operations by the government of Gaza?

a reply to: Lazy88

And again. Israel isn’t directly attacking civilians. Israel is taking out valid terrorist targets being illegal shielded with humans.

From Vatican news , no Hamas no Human shields , not isolated cases.

The victims are Nahida and her daughter Samar who were shot and killed as they walked to the Sister's Convent. "One was killed as she tried to carry the other to safety," the statement said.

Seven more people were reportedly also shot and wounded as they tried to protect those inside the church compound. The Patriarchate's statement noted, "No warning was given, no notification was provided. They were shot in cold blood inside the premises of the Parish, where there are no belligerents."

Attack on Missionaries of Charity Convent

The statement also revealed that a rocket fired from an Israeli Defense Forces tank during the morning targeted and struck the Convent of the Sisters of Mother Theresa, destroying the building's generator - its only source of electricity - while a massive fire damaged the house.

"The Convent is home to over 54 disabled persons and is part of the church compound, which was signalled as a place of worship since the beginning of the war," it said.

The building was subsequently targeted by two more rockets rendering the home inhabitable: "The 54 disabled persons are currently displaced and without access to the respirators that some of them need to survive."
www.vaticannews.va...

originally posted by: Lazy88

How do you deal with terrorist operation centers when they use tunnels purposefully built under neighborhoods, schools, and hospitals.

The deal is when an individual does something like this because of the situation they are in going street to street where anyone could be a bad guy with seconds to make a decision people instantly apply it to the Government as policy. This guy or his squad messed up big time, we know that. Next time they hesitate and they are dead, so kind of a lose-lose situation. One in the middle of a war does not expect hostages to come out of nowhere, so not trying to make excuses but there are a lot of individuals trying to do their job right and stay alive at the same time, and for people here to take each one of these and say SEE it is policy is stupid.

a reply to: gortex

Do tanks normally fire rockets? Tanks are usually defined by having artillery pieces.

Anyway?

What is the actual evidence it was the IDF?

Or is this like the false accusations of an Israel Air Strike at Al-Ahli Arab Hospital parking lot? Or Salah-al-Din street convey attack?

a reply to: gortex

And you still don’t answer the question how you fight Hamas that uses neighborhoods as bases of operation.

originally posted by: gortex
From Vatican news , ...

Dude .. the Vatican KNOWS NOTHING. They are just parroting the dhimmi Patriarch of Jerusalem and his claims. The same Patriarch that has LIED in the past and falsely blamed Israel for things that Hamas did. The same Patriarch who, to this day, claims Israel air bombed a hospital in Gaza and killed 500 people.

The Patriarch may be right that IDF shot the two women. But he equally may be wrong and it was Hamas who shot the women and blamed it on Israel. Hamas has done that a lot - killed Palestinians and blamed Israel. The Vatican is just regurgitating what the dhimmi Patriarch claimed. Nothing more.

a reply to: gortex

Didn’t you get caught up in the lie Israel helicopters fired on their own people on Oct 7th?

a reply to: Lazy88

The Israeli military has released drone footage showing hundreds of scorched and damaged cars moved from the Nova music festival, providing further evidence that Israeli forces likely killed many of their own during the start of Operation Al-Aqsa Flood on 7 October, RT reported on 6 November

new.thecradle.co...

drone footage..

twitter.com...

Got the actually drone footage of the attack too.. Can upload that morrow..np

a reply to: FlyersFan

Rachel Corrie's Parents Call for Justice in Palestine on 10th Anniversary of Death

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Just remember IDF have no problem killing innocents.. might put a few more threads up for you


bumped :-)

originally posted by: purplemer
a reply to: Lazy88

The Israeli military has released drone footage showing hundreds of scorched and damaged cars moved from the Nova music festival, providing further evidence that Israeli forces likely killed many of their own during the start of Operation Al-Aqsa Flood on 7 October, RT reported on 6 November

new.thecradle.co...

drone footage..

twitter.com...

Got the actually drone footage of the attack too.. Can upload that morrow..np

Israel attacking its own citizens on Oct 7th has long been debunked. It’s not opinion, there is no evidence.

So? You only have, what? Twitter propaganda? Abs a propaganda site. That you can even provide an actual quote.

a reply to: purplemer

Fact Check: Does Video Show Israel Helicopter Shoot Festival Goers?

www.newsweek.com...


However, the footage is not of Israeli Apache helicopters firing on civilians at the Supernova music festival. It was posted on October 9, 2023, by the Israel Defense Forces, two days after the attack at the Supernova festival.

A translation of the post states "Throughout the last day, Air Force planes have been carrying out extensive attacks along the length and breadth of the Gaza Strip, wreaking havoc on Hamas terrorists.

From the same article

Accounts from the survivors of the attack and recollections pieced together from footage posted online do not show evidence of airstrikes at the time of the Hamas invasion. A quote attached to the post on X with the video, describing Israeli pilots as being unable to distinguish between civilian and military targets, cites no sources or evidence.

Others have provided compelling evidence demonstrating the claim's flaws. In a post on X from November 10, 2023, viewed 2.5 million times, OSINT investigators GeoConfirmed and contributors provided a series of coordinates, images, and map printouts that it said corresponded with locations in the film.

The locations it cited were near the Gaza border fence, three miles from the festival site, which matches reporting of where the IDF response was concentrated following Hamas' attack.

Furthermore, it makes no sense that the Israel Defense Forces would put out a film showing their murdering of fellow citizens, let alone two days after the deaths.


www.newsweek.com...

Can you match landmarks in the video with landmarks at the site of the actual festival. Sad your using actually debunked accusation void of actual evidence.

a reply to: Lazy88

Look, according to some, Jews are bad.

Regardless.

a reply to: purplemer

Rachel Corrie's Parents Call for Justice in Palestine on 10th Anniversary of Death

Rachel Corrie flew from America to the other side of the world, went into a war zone, and stood in front of a moving bulldozer and got herself crushed to death. She died because she did something STUPID.

originally posted by: BrucellaOrchitis
a reply to: orbhunter

So the only difference between the IDF and HAMAS is that one side wear uniforms? That's what I am learning. A professional soldier should be able to recognise that three half naked men carrying a white flag, aren't a threat, especially after their commander orders a cease fire, even a trained conscript surely.

Plus, I am also learning that it's really convenient having the authority to label your enemies as terrorist organisations. Not saying it's not a justified label, just that it applies equally to Israel's behaviour in the months leading up to 7th October.

I look forward to both sides being held accountable for their actions. Assuming anyone is left standing in Palestine to answer for those crimes, I suppose there will still be the leadership in their office in Qatar though.

Professional soldiers don’t dress as civilians and ambush soldiers using the false pretence of surrender to draw them in.

Like Hamas has done numerous times in the past.

originally posted by: Oldcarpy2
a reply to: Daughter2v2

Whereas those lovely Hamas types couldn't give a monkeys about dead Palestinians. On the contrary, the more the merrier to fuel their sick propaganda that some seem to want to lap up.

Here’s their propaganda at work.
Towards the end of the video we learn the goal of the propaganda.



“Destroy the enemies of Islam and annihilate the heretics and the atheists”