Israeli hostages killed mistakenly in Gaza were holding white flag, official says

originally posted by: BrucellaOrchitis
Hmm...a simple mistake? It's easy to happen?

Yes.

It's not understandable, it is gross incompetence.

... says the guy who has never been in intense combat, never been continually shot at, never had to take care with every step in case of deadly booby traps, never had to clear underground tunnels of terrorists who were actively trying to kill you.

Pffft. You have no clue what you are talking about.

originally posted by: BrucellaOrchitis

originally posted by: quintessentone
The dehumanization has been going on between both sides for a very long time and the hostages were never a consideration for Netanyahu, his agenda is retaining power and ego based.

I found this interesting...

Hirschhorn said that in turn has had an important impact on Israeli politics with American settlers serving in key roles including chief of staff to prime ministers and top aides to members of the Israeli parliament.

“As much of Israeli politics has become increasingly Americanised, you see these figures making very significant appearances. So they certainly have an impact on Israeli domestic policy even if it’s not always as visible to everyone.”

www.theguardian.com...

I wonder, combined with the introduction of laws in the US that effectively criminalise as antisemitism any criticism of the state of Israeli what the end game of this could be other than the eradication of Palestinians?

I heard rumors of American boots on the ground in Gaza, is there any truth to that rumor?

a reply to: quintessentone

That information is well over my pay grade

But plenty of US and former US citizens, who seem to be engaged in state sponsored terrorism.

originally posted by: quintessentone
I heard rumors of American boots on the ground in Gaza, is there any truth to that rumor?

No.
Where exactly did you 'hear that rumor'??

originally posted by: BrucellaOrchitis
But plenty of US and former US citizens, who seem to be engaged in state sponsored terrorism.

There are no US citizens and former US citizens engaging in state sponsored terrorism in Gaza. That's idiotic. There are US citizens, and other citizens from other countries, in Gaza who were aid workers and who got stuck there when the borders closed. But your statement about them engaging in 'state sponsored terrorism' is ignorant.

a reply to: BrucellaOrchitis

It's likely the majority of HAMAS terrorists/fighters in GAZA would have surrendered soon after the October attack, if Netanyahu and Biden had kept their vow to destroy the 4 leaders/organizers at the top of HAMAS, ASAP...as priority #1.

These four: www.dailymail.co.uk...

Both Biden and "Bibi" must pay for their shortsightedness, fear, collusion, or whatever the hell kept them from fulfilling their vow, thereby enabling thousands of additional needless deaths of beautiful children (and adults).
😡😢

originally posted by: FlyersFan

originally posted by: quintessentone
I heard rumors of American boots on the ground in Gaza, is there any truth to that rumor?

No.
Where exactly did you 'hear that rumor'??

I listen to independent journalists who are actually at the war, so maybe from one of them. I can understand why the usual MSM news would not touch these types of rumors or truths, whichever it may be.

originally posted by: quintessentone
I listen to independent journalists who are actually at the war, ...

Links?

originally posted by: FlyersFan

originally posted by: quintessentone
I listen to independent journalists who are actually at the war, ...

Links?

I listen to multiple journalists so I can't recall which one put that rumor or truth forward. I was asking here if anyone else heard that rumor. If not, then there's my answer.

originally posted by: FlyersFan
Pffft. You have no clue what you are talking about.

Why because I haven't been indoctrinated into your belief system that war solves problems when it actually just amplifies them?

a reply to: FlyersFan

It would help if you read the article that I linked rather than just reply blindly without understanding what the conversation is about.

Hadar Susskind, president of Americans for Peace Now, said these settlers militias draw inspiration from two Americans infamous as the godfathers of the campaign of violence against ordinary Palestinians.

An American doctor from Brooklyn, Baruch Goldstein, murdered 29 Muslim worshippers in the West Bank city of Hebron in 1994. Goldstein was a follower of another American, Rabbi Meir Kahane, founder of the far-right religious Kach party that was eventually banned in Israel and the US under anti-terrorism laws.

“If you asked who are the most prominent examples of literally murderous violent settler extremism, the two answers are Goldstein and Kahane. Those people are the prophets of the settler movement,” said Susskind.

www.theguardian.com...

originally posted by: BrucellaOrchitis
Why because I haven't been indoctrinated into your belief system that war solves problems when it actually just amplifies them?

No.

Because you called the soldiers guilty of 'gross incompetence' when in fact they are not. Their reaction to men moving in front of them in the tunnels can be explained. As I said you have never been in intense combat, never been continually shot at, never had to take care with every step in case of deadly booby traps, never had to clear underground tunnels of terrorists who were actively trying to kill you. Their reaction in an intense combat situation is understandable. Tragic. But understandable.

And your false statement that "plenty of US and former US citizens, who seem to be engaged in state sponsored terrorism" is also says that you have no idea what you are talking about.

Oh ... and war against Nazi Germany did indeed solve the Hitler/Nazi problem. So yes, war does solve problems at times. That statement of yours is also wrong.

a reply to: BrucellaOrchitis
That article has nothing to do with the IDF soldiers making a mistake in combat which is the topic of this thread. That article does not back your claim that there are "plenty of US and former US citizens, who seem to be engaged in state sponsored terrorism"

a reply to: FlyersFan

I don't know, I think 15% is plenty enough but it is more the US influence on creating the conditions that have led to the current conflict.

Americans account for only about 15% of the total settler population in the West Bank and East Jerusalem but their influence outweighs their numbers.

...which when combined with the laws in the US which criminalise criticism of the Israeli state, and the fevered support by yourself of their indiscriminate killing of civilians while justifing the killing of three visibly unarmed hostages carrying a white flag, seems to indicate that factions in the US are giving direction and impetus to the assault on Gaza while doing everything in their power to suppress reasoned discussion.

originally posted by: FlyersFan
Oh ... and war against Nazi Germany did indeed solve the Hitler/Nazi problem. So yes, war does solve problems at times. That statement of yours is also wrong.

I think Hitler solved the Hitler problem himself. The Nazis, the ones that were let off, not the ones that were hung in the show trials, went on with their business for their new allied masters.

originally posted by: BrucellaOrchitis
a reply to: FlyersFan

I don't know, I think 15% is plenty enough but it is more the US influence on creating the conditions that have led to the current conflict.

Americans account for only about 15% of the total settler population in the West Bank and East Jerusalem but their influence outweighs their numbers.

...which when combined with the laws in the US which criminalise criticism of the Israeli state, and the fevered support by yourself of their indiscriminate killing of civilians while justifing the killing of three visibly unarmed hostages carrying a white flag, seems to indicate that factions in the US are giving direction and impetus to the assault on Gaza while doing everything in their power to suppress reasoned discussion.

That is what it looks like to me. The US's has their own agenda to fulfill and needs Israel to achieve it. War will be eternal.

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: DBCowboy
a reply to: BrucellaOrchitis

Oh I get it.

Israeli's have to be perfect 100% of the time, piss sunshine and rainbows and only use harsh language.

Do you still smell your hubris in your ivory tower?

Or in addition to their 'shoot at everything' they also have orders to 'take no prisoners'?

Have you ever been in war?

originally posted by: DBCowboy

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: DBCowboy
a reply to: BrucellaOrchitis

Oh I get it.

Israeli's have to be perfect 100% of the time, piss sunshine and rainbows and only use harsh language.

Do you still smell your hubris in your ivory tower?

Or in addition to their 'shoot at everything' they also have orders to 'take no prisoners'?

Have you ever been in war?

Off topic.

originally posted by: BrucellaOrchitis

originally posted by: DBCowboy
Oh I get it.

Nah, you don't. Not even close.

Both side have committed atrocities. I have absolutely no difficulty in seeing that.

Some of us don't have a side or consider this a debate where we have to stick to that side like our lives depend upon it. You seemingly do. I assume it's your programming but don't really care, I simply classify you in my dull pile. But carry on, I think others find you amusing which has the added benefit of saving me time on the sift.

Enlist, serve, then lecture me about war.

originally posted by: DBCowboy

originally posted by: BrucellaOrchitis

originally posted by: DBCowboy
Oh I get it.

Nah, you don't. Not even close.

Both side have committed atrocities. I have absolutely no difficulty in seeing that.

Some of us don't have a side or consider this a debate where we have to stick to that side like our lives depend upon it. You seemingly do. I assume it's your programming but don't really care, I simply classify you in my dull pile. But carry on, I think others find you amusing which has the added benefit of saving me time on the sift.

Enlist, serve, then lecture me about war.

Nobody is lecturing you, we are having a discussion and this war is not like all the others.