Trump fraud case just fell apart

originally posted by: Mahogany

originally posted by: JinMI
a reply to: Mahogany

Beating a dead horse here arguing that there was no fraud. Fraud has already been determined, Trump has appealed, but he really has nothing to go on. But we'll see. It is possible he retains some of the business licenses, anything is possible.

In any case, he already lost on fraud, if anyone wants to understand better how that case went, don't take it from me, go read the ruling.

How exactly was that done again?

In the Manhattan Supreme Court.

So there was an adversarial process right?

Facing accusors, evidenciary hearing, discovery and say a jury??

a reply to: Mahogany

Wait...WHAT????

So basically your logic is, even though the banks agreed to the loans, and Trump paid them back, that the banks were entitled to even more money (than they agreed to). Key point...THEY agreed to this, BEFORE lending him the money.

So, when I sell you a a pair of shoes for $50 dollars today, if someone 10 years from now determines those shoes were really worth $100, then you have committed fraud against me because I was really entitled to $50 dollars more????

Wow...I remember a truck I sold to a guy back in 1980 for $1500 bucks which would become a classic collector vehicle 10 years later. That truck is worth over $100,000 now (even in way worse condition)...so I've been DEFRAUDED!! I'm a VICTIM!! Dammit...gimme' my money!!!

Oh yeah, this concept is gonna' end well! Fraud "victims" are going to be coming out of the woodwork here!

a reply to: Flyingclaydisk

Not my logic, buddy.

That is how the law works. Based on this law, he was found to have committed fraud.

He lied on financial documents, conspired with others in his company to do so, gotten loans he shouldn't have qualified for, swindled the banks for more favorable rates, essentially taking money from them, put others at risk and then got caught for it.

Don't believe me? Matters not.

The so-called "Classified Documents" case is unraveling too.

Judge says Prosecutors are scumbags (my interpretation): federalnewsnetwork.com... ase/

originally posted by: carewemust
The so-called "Classified Documents" case is unraveling too.

Judge says Prosecutors are scumbags (my interpretation): federalnewsnetwork.com... ase/

From your link;

“I admonish the government for wasting the court’s time,” U.S. District Judge Aileen Cannon told prosecutors, saying they had presented arguments during Thursday’s hearing that had not been properly raised in earlier court filings.

Is there hope?
As usual, great find carewemust!

a reply to: Mahogany

Yeah, okay...buddy.

Enjoy your smug, and side of rainbows. This ain't over.

And that's the part you're missing. Just because some judge ruled on something which has mammoth implications (which you just happen to agree with, for a variety of reasons, I'm sure) doesn't mean you can just camp out on it and continually regurgitate the same line. Furthermore, the implications of this ruling are so wide ranging that no higher court will allow this precedent to stand simply because of the avalanche of "Me TOO!!" suits which will certainly follow from about every direction imaginable. But you kinda' missed that point, didn't you. Nope, they got your evil Trump...and that's all that matters to you. The rest of the World could burn down and you'd be happy.

Let's examine your "It's the law" statement. Yes, there are fraud laws, but what you're missing here is a judge has wrongly applied this law and made an erroneous legal determination which will almost certainly be overturned based on lack of merit.

So, enjoy it while you can.

ETA -And 'Avalanche' doesn't even begin to describe it...more like TIDAL WAVE is more like it!!

a reply to: Flyingclaydisk

Liberals defending a big bank's right to make even more money... and the Bank isn't even asking them too.

If I had been asleep the last 10 years and woke up to this bizarre flip in ideology I wouldn't believe my own eyes.

a reply to: dandandat2

LOLOL!! I know! If that don't beat all, huh!!

MY GAWD!! The irony is just mind blowing!! Talk about switching sides when the discussion suits you! Holy COW!

originally posted by: fringeofthefringe

originally posted by: carewemust
The so-called "Classified Documents" case is unraveling too.

Judge says Prosecutors are scumbags (my interpretation): federalnewsnetwork.com... ase/

From your link;

“I admonish the government for wasting the court’s time,” U.S. District Judge Aileen Cannon told prosecutors, saying they had presented arguments during Thursday’s hearing that had not been properly raised in earlier court filings.

Is there hope?
As usual, great find carewemust!

EVERYTHING THAT IS HAPPENING WITH TRUMP's CASES IS IN DISARRAY (Just like the House Speakership). I need to start a generalized thread on it, because "experts" have been saying that Trump will not be found guilty for anything. But woe on these bastards, come 1/20/2025, when the "Season of Retribution Hell" kicks in!

originally posted by: Mahogany
The $250m that the state is asking for is not a penalty, it's a reimbursement for moneys stolen. Here is how the judge explains it and also explains why this case has no jury:

Who gets the $250M? The state of New York, the bank, the judge?

originally posted by: Mahogany
a reply to: Flyingclaydisk

Not my logic, buddy.

That is how the law works. Based on this law, he was found to have committed fraud.

He lied on financial documents, conspired with others in his company to do so, gotten loans he shouldn't have qualified for, swindled the banks for more favorable rates, essentially taking money from them, put others at risk and then got caught for it.

Don't believe me? Matters not.

At least youre consistent. Ill give you that.


Yet I regret to inform you that your consistency is on the grounds of removal of due process.

Now, when a right denied to one American citizen, do you think the concluding logic is that it can then be applied to any American? Specifically you or someone you may know?


Just seeing how consistent you can be....

originally posted by: Mahogany
a reply to: Flyingclaydisk

Not my logic, buddy.

That is how the law works. Based on this law, he was found to have committed fraud.

He lied on financial documents, conspired with others in his company to do so, gotten loans he shouldn't have qualified for, swindled the banks for more favorable rates, essentially taking money from them, put others at risk and then got caught for it.

Don't believe me? Matters not.

So who is the A G representing, the banks that said everything was good or New York who would have charged him with a crime of tax evasion with fines and possible jail time.

So this judge can make a criminal ruling in a civil court, that will hold up, especially not allowing a jury.

Judge, jury and executioner.

a reply to: JinMI

Jeezus! Throw that line of thought in the trash! There is NO way this person is dealing with a "balanced" or "objective" point of view!!

it's almost shocking, but R-77 said it best...it's "ASTONISHING!!!"

The 'change-up' is nothing short of...astonishing. These people could have a Union Pacific locomotive headed directly for their car, erm...mini-van...and they will gladly sacrifice everything they love for just one victory on the "Trump" front. These people honestly hate this man soooooooo badly, they would willingly sacrifice everything valuable to them to see him in bondage!

How utterly...ASTONISHING!!!!

Sounds like Weisselberg may be in trouble.

During his testimony yesterday prosecutors questioned him about his severance package that was contingent on Weisselberg not cooperating with investigators and just so happened to be for the exact amount he owed in fines from his own criminal conviction. Weisselberg said it was just a coincidence. Mind you, Weisselberg was given a lesser punishment in exchange for his cooperation in this case.

Fast forward to today and Weisselberg's testimony continued. When the court broke for lunch, prosecutors made it sound like they had every intention of continuing with Weisselberg's testimony. However, when court resumed after lunch the prosecution stated they were done with Weisselberg for now.

What changed? Forbes publishing an article about Weisselberg comitting perjury. If the AG is able to corroborate Forbes' article, well, Weisselberg is probably going away for the rest of his life.

If the AG finds out Weisselberg committed perjury on the order of the Trump Organization in exchange for his severance Trump's going to have a new criminal indictment coming his way.

Trump’s Longtime CFO Lied, Under Oath, About Trump Tower Penthouse

a reply to: Flyingclaydisk

Heya FCD!!



These people don't have thoughts of their own nor any values, principals or ethics to draw from for reference.

It's just regurgitated media talking points.

As we see how when held up to any kind of scrutiny or pushback on their own logic, they disappear.

I value my 3/5ths acre property at $1T because of the irreplaceable memories raising my family here. The tax man thankfully disagreed, the banks disagreed, the insurance companies disagreed.

None of them filed with the police for attempted fraud once I paid my taxes AT THE VALUATION THEY SET, PAID INTEREST ON A HOME EQUITY ACCOUNT ON THE VALUATION THEY SET OR PAID INSURANCE PREMIUMS ON THE VALUATION THEY SET.

The only fraud is the DA filing charges for Trump.

originally posted by: Threadbare
Trump's going to have a new criminal indictment coming his way.

Well of course he will. In fact, they're probably about to break down the doors at Mara Lago again. This time, they're checking all the mattresses to see of Donald Trump ripped the labels off!

a reply to: LogicalGraphitti

There were only a handful of people at Trump Organization above Weisselberg. All of them have the last name Trump. So, if Weisselberg's severance package is contingent on committing perjury in order to protect the Trump Organization you can be sure that was a decision made by a Trump.

And last time I checked, witness intimidation and conspiracy were pretty serious crimes.

If Trump tries to throw Junior or Eric under the bus, do you think they'll go along with it and do jail time for Dear Papa?

originally posted by: Threadbare
a reply to: LogicalGraphitti

There were only a handful of people at Trump Organization above Weisselberg. All of them have the last name Trump. So, if Weisselberg's severance package is contingent on committing perjury in order to protect the Trump Organization you can be sure that was a decision made by a Trump.

And last time I checked, witness intimidation and conspiracy were pretty serious crimes.

If Trump tries to throw Junior or Eric under the bus, do you think they'll go along with it and do jail time for Dear Papa?

Say what you want, I really can't take this seriously anymore. For a segment of our population to be so driven by hate for a single person is just insane. Investigation into Trump has become a career goal for people who want to make a name for themselves. I made a joke about the mattress tags but there's probably an AG somewhere who has considered it.

PS: It really isn't illegal to remove the tag after you buy the mattress. But wait, what if Trump didn't buy the mattress? What if someone gifted to him? That would mean, in a court of law, it could be argued he really isn't the "owner" and therefore, a missing tag is clearly a prosecutable offense. Woohoo, we go him now!