The United Kingdom Will Begin Deploying Troops to the Ukraine vs Russia War Zone.

originally posted by: carewemust
Saturday, September, 30, 2023

This is NOT a positive development...

LONDON, Sept 30 (Reuters) - Britain's government wants to deploy military instructors to Ukraine, in addition to training Ukrainian armed forces in Britain or other Western countries as at present, British defence minister Grant Shapps said.

To date, Britain and its allies have avoided a formal military presence in Ukraine, to reduce the risk of a direct conflict with Russia.

Britain has provided five-week military training courses to around 20,000 Ukrainians over the past year, and intends to train a similar number going forward.

www.reuters.com...
Why send British troops to train Ukraine soldiers, instead of continuing to train Ukraine soldiers on British soil? Why take a HIGHER RISK route that accomplishes the same end result?

-CareWeMust

I just wanted to leave this 💰here and move on, but t&cs etc .

I concur this is not a good idea, Russia already hates the UK. Probably even more than they do the US. I mean is it common knowledge that the war started because NAYTO were taking the piss with expansion, right? Or It is that propaganda ?
Soz I'm a bit behind on this subject.

originally posted by: kennyb72
a reply to: AngryCymraeg

I'm sorry but none of the above makes the least bit of sense, unless you genuinely think that Russia is supported by a mythical deity that loves bloodshed.

God still loves you .. I struggle with that a bit!

I remain unconvinced about anything you said. Sorry.
Anyhoo. Russia's not winning anything, other than becoming a laughing stock. I'm glad we've established that.

a reply to: WingDingLuey

nato could have stopped the bs in ukraine in 48 hours

wonder why they didn't

How so? And how is NATO responsible for Ukraine, that would have invoked WW3 right on the spot. The true goal is not to make Ukraine sovereign, both the US and Russia want the country under control. Russia via force and the US via pressure and manipulation. Both costs lifes. Just look at the Arabic Spring and who started that.

It was never about Ukrainian people, they are crushed by both sides. One is openly hostile and the other acts like a friend with the dagger hidden in the sleeve. Just look at history.

originally posted by: carewemust
It's just a game.

As long as the taxpayers keep on keeping on.

As long as the elite don't see pitchforks, torches and nooses.

a reply to: carewemust

I do like the Star Trek reference, big fan.

But what Russian megalomaniac dictator did Kirk ever assassinate?

Kirk would simply have beamed Putin up and let Spock sort him out with a good tongue-lashing and then abandoned him on Ceti Alpha 4.

The idea of killing leaders on the other side in a conflict or political dispute is generally considered to be unethical and in violation of international law in this day of age carewemust.

And there are several reasons why they don't do things like that.

For instance, the problems that would arise were the likes of human rights, risk of escalation, and retaliation are concerned.

Not to mention the implications where the offending nation's public opinion and international image come into play.

There is the fact that if we were to start killing off one another's leaders diplomacy and future peace negotiations may be somewhat untenable and off the table.

Again if simply taking Putin out of the game would resolve the situation he would have had the top of his melon removed with a .50 round from about 2,100 yards away probably not that long after he chose to invade Ukraine.

Hasn't a few western countries like Great Britain, U.S.A. and other EU countries had Special Forces in the Ukraine doing a small amount of training for a while now?

originally posted by: gortex
a reply to: carewemust

Why send British troops to train Ukraine soldiers, instead of continuing to train Ukraine soldiers on British soil?

Because Grant Shapps is an idiot , many questioned his appointment to the defence secretary job because of that.

"I was talking about eventually getting the training brought closer and actually into Ukraine as well," Mr Shapps said.
news.sky.com...

Yup, he hasn't a clue about defence and it makes no sense to publicly announce future plans to an enemy/advisary and he's putting troops at increased risk for personal gain.

Wallace was terrible as a local MP but did an amazing job as defence sec due to his experience in the field.

Sunak has just announced Shapps was taking a load of BS but it'll take a lot to repair diplomatic ties.

originally posted by: AngryCymraeg
a reply to: Muldar

Well, Russia's sure as hell not winning the war. Clinging desperately on to trench lines as your navy flees Sevastopol is not advancing in any way, shape or form.
I think that all the RUSSIA STRONK! people need to realise that their idea of the Russian Army being invincible is a load of fetid dingoes kidneys. The Russians are paying a very heavy price for decades of corruption and horrific mismanagement. The fact that the only halfway effective troops that they had were the Wagner mercenaries says everything about the true state of the Russian Army right now.

It seems a lot of propaganda and misinformation to me and we can all guess why this happens. But anyway if you want to become a war analyst you have plenty to learn and it takes several years training.

originally posted by: TDDAgain
a reply to: WingDingLuey

nato could have stopped the bs in ukraine in 48 hours

wonder why they didn't

How so? And how is NATO responsible for Ukraine, that would have invoked WW3 right on the spot. The true goal is not to make Ukraine sovereign, both the US and Russia want the country under control. Russia via force and the US via pressure and manipulation. Both costs lifes. Just look at the Arabic Spring and who started that.

It was never about Ukrainian people, they are crushed by both sides. One is openly hostile and the other acts like a friend with the dagger hidden in the sleeve. Just look at history.

I agree with everything you say but there are other aspects to this conflict. There is the history and ethnicity connection between Russia and Ukraine. There are also some aspects vital to Russia's security, like Crimea or even just the potential of more NATO encroachment. I'm not saying that makes it right though.
Then we have the hand the US has and is playing, with nothing vital to its national security, history or ethnicity. We have all watched this play out and we know what drives The US and West's involvement. There is nothing 'right' about that either.

a reply to: midicon

I agree completely, just did not word it out.

I worded such things out when the war started here on ATS. Since then the moods have been cooled down a bit but back then no matter how hard you tried to point out both sides, some side always took insult in it.

Since then I stopped arguing about it in high detail.

a reply to: kennyb72

Yep.

Excellent breakdown of the circumstances, and I might add that this was all perfectly predictable for thinking people.

The "Ukraine is winning" people are chasing their tails around like crazed dogs, lmao.

originally posted by: andy06shake
a reply to: carewemust

Facts are facts.

And the fact is there have indeed been military advisers from the UK in Ukraine regarding troop training for a while.

As to shame.....shame on Putin.

Freedom to Ukraine and down with the Russian war and invasion.

So what about freedom for the people in eastern Ukraine? You know rhe people who have been begging for Putin and Russia for help for a decade now? Or is it just freedom for Ukranians that are pro-NATO?

Why do you all pretend these people in eastern Ukraine don't exist? Why do you ignore the inhumane treatment they endure from their own government? You have aligned yourselves with the aggressors...

I feel 6 plus years of anti-Russian sentiment has preprogrammed you all to automatically hate anything and anyone Russian? Because that's certainly what it looks like from where I sit.

Personal I feel they should draft every person like yourself first. The people who have been beating the drums of war for the establishment since the start of this should be the first to sacrifice themselves for this cause.

I've always said this is our modern Spanish civil war just as Taiwan will be a modern Hongkong or Singapore for the usa..

we are as much on the road to war as if this was the period between 1936 and 39.. its inevitable at this point.

the only way this could have been avoided was if NATO put troops on Ukraine's border as Russia built up its military Prescence any other approach only delays the inevitable war.. it had to be met head on to stop it in its literal tracks, but the political class today are weak cowards only out for the next soundbite..

originally posted by: bobs_uruncle

originally posted by: NorthOfStuffx2
a reply to: carewemust

The Ukraine has been winning for AGES now.

I wonder why the Brits are going there…

Maybe for the victory celebration?

I almost fell off my chair at the legion laughing. Russia if they choose can squash the Ukraine like a bug. You're a funny guy lol

Cheers - Dave

Yeah, there’s got to be financial and power motives for Putin, to not have just obliterated Ukraine for a laugh. Stringing it along has to be benefiting him somehow.
Just like US politicians and the cartels. We could make them go “poof” in a 24-hour operation. But the money in human trafficking, drug selling, child selling, sex slaving, is too big on both sides of the border.

originally posted by: TDDAgain
a reply to: WingDingLuey

nato could have stopped the bs in ukraine in 48 hours

wonder why they didn't

How so? And how is NATO responsible for Ukraine, that would have invoked WW3 right on the spot. The true goal is not to make Ukraine sovereign, both the US and Russia want the country under control. Russia via force and the US via pressure and manipulation. Both costs lifes. Just look at the Arabic Spring and who started that.

It was never about Ukrainian people, they are crushed by both sides. One is openly hostile and the other acts like a friend with the dagger hidden in the sleeve. Just look at history.

Democrats / RINOs have killed more Ukrainian and Russian youth than Putin, by providing funding for a fake war that is just being used to siphon US taxpayer $ to select people and the defense industry.

Zelensky agreed to kill a whole generation of young Ukrainians to get his slice of the graft.

And the left loves him. Stupid on steroids.

Zelensky, Biden, Putin all own a third of the war crimes.

originally posted by: carewemust

originally posted by: loveguy
a reply to: carewemust
Canadians training the nasty Azov's followed by Nazi worship ricochet, first in Canada 🚩🔔 🚩 Britain wants to be included in the Nazi lover cult and embrace the ramifications?

Who are they gonna rise in ovation for?

You're deep. I don't know what an AZOV is. I thought it was Canada's Trudeau who worshipped Nazis. I know NUTHING.

1article of many

a reply to: Kreeate

Just because a side is "winning" does not mean that it doesn't require support.
Strategic support is often provided to the "winning" side in order to maintain that status.

Ytp I get that, couldn't agree more, but my post was a retort to the
context of winning not support. However I did fail to quote that context
so you weren't fully aware of that being from the previous page. Thanks
for being on topic.

a reply to: stevieray

The war in Ukraine is sure a head scratcher. Zelensky traveling the world like a rich beggar while at home his people die, he is at the Golden Globes giving speeches.

In the early days there were reports about teens and children provided with weapons. I back then already said how wrong that is and that it is hiding some elements of truth when fingers are pointed how Russians shoot children.

Well as soon as Zelensky weaponized them (there were pictures) he made them cannon fodder for war propaganda. Yes the Russians also attacked schools allegedly and are the attackers (the sad disclaimer I have to put here to prevent others from injecting and saying "*gasp* BUT the Russians are the invaders".)

Hell yes they are, nobody ever disputed that, is my answer. People demand to choose sides and it is not allowed to point out any discrepancies. War must be the one thing where people loose all their morals even in their armchairs.

a reply to: JAY1980

Oh yeah, it’s just a complete coincidence that Russia invaded Crimea in 2014 and then Ukraine just randomly decided to indiscriminately start attacking eastern Ukraine that exact same year.

Russia obviously instigated a proxy war there. If you can’t see that as clear as day, then your gullibility is beyond comprehension.

Maybe you should go live in Russia if you think there all perfect and innocent. Go down with the ship, back your own words up.

Anyway, Russia will lose this war. As they should… it’s nothing more than a modern day impoverished dictatorship, fighting like a drowning rat to remain relevant.

a reply to: carewemust

90 seconds to midnight