Near Death Experiences - 'The Void' vs 'Heaven' - what do you expect when you die?

a reply to: HeirHeart

"Ah, but a man’s reach should exceed his grasp,
Or what’s a heaven for?"

originally posted by: TrueAmerican
Hmm, familiar name there, OP- we used to have a FlyersFan around here, I remember the name. Same person- or?

Yes it's me. Couldn't get into my old account. There is a link in my signature to it. Started a new account.

originally posted by: UtIntusSicForis
a reply to: Quadlink

Given that he was materialist is it any surprise?

I have never heard that before, could you provide some info on how he was a materialist ?

All the best

a reply to: socialmediaclown

Searching for a Sinead O'connor cause of death probably has its implications.
Perhaps a recognition that you are now in Valhalla after Ragnarok.

a reply to: socialmediaclown

I've not told you anything that's not true socialmediaclown.

And its merely my own opinion combined with a few unrefutable facts.

As to the debate being futile, well if that's how you feel on the matter, i have to surmise that you're the one with the closed-off belief system.

Anyhoo you have yourself a good day.

a reply to: Quadlink

Haven't met many atheists that aren't...
At least of his particular type...
And given his quote it's pretty obvious.
But perhaps this'll help.

Materialism is a form of philosophical monism which holds that matter is the fundamental substance in nature, and that all things, including mental states and consciousness, are results of material interactions of material things. According to philosophical materialism, mind and consciousness are by-products or epiphenomena of material processes (such as the biochemistry of the human brain and nervous system), without which they cannot exist. Materialism directly contrasts with idealism, according to which consciousness is the fundamental substance of nature.

Steven Hawking was an atheist.

TIME MAGAZINE - Stephen Hawking Was an Atheist. Here’s What He Said About God, Heaven and His Own Death

a reply to: FlyersFan2

Steven hawking was also a doomsayer.

originally posted by: FlyersFan2
Steven Hawking was an atheist.

TIME MAGAZINE - Stephen Hawking Was an Atheist. Here’s What He Said About God, Heaven and His Own Death

I remember you. You’ve got quite the history with that old account.

Reach out to Djarums. He’s helped many people retrieve old accounts.

Earth News - Millions of Near Death Experiences Validated by New Study

The researchers observed comparable gamma activation signatures in the dying brains of both animals and humans following oxygen deprivation caused by cardiac arrest.

Near-death experiences have long captivated our imagination, with stories of white light, encounters with deceased loved ones, and hearing voices being deeply ingrained in our cultural fabric. The consistent elements in these experiences have led scientists to ponder whether they reveal a form of consciousness that persists even after the heart has stopped beating.

A groundbreaking study, published in the Proceedings of the National Academy of Science, provides some preliminary evidence of increased brain activity associated with consciousness in the moments leading up to death.

The study, spearheaded by Dr. Jimo Borjigin, is a continuation of animal research conducted nearly a decade ago in collaboration with Dr. George Mashour, the founding director of the Michigan Center for Consciousness Science.

The researchers observed comparable gamma activation signatures in the dying brains of both animals and humans following oxygen deprivation caused by cardiac arrest.

Dr. Mashour stated that “how vivid experience can emerge from a dysfunctional brain during the process of dying is a neuroscientific paradox. Dr. Borjigin has led an important study that helps shed light on the underlying neurophysiological mechanisms.”

The research team identified four patients who died from cardiac arrest while being monitored by an EEG in the hospital. All four were comatose and unresponsive, and with the consent of their families, removed from life support after being deemed beyond medical help.

Upon withdrawal of ventilator support, two of the patients exhibited an increase in heart rate accompanied by a surge of gamma wave activity – known as the fastest brain activity and linked to consciousness.

The surge of activity was observed in the “hot zone” of neural correlates of consciousness in the brain, located at the junction between the temporal, parietal, and occipital lobes. This region has been associated with dreaming, visual hallucinations in epilepsy, and altered states of consciousness in previous studies.

Dr. Nusha Mihaylova explained that these two patients had a history of seizures, but experienced none during the hour before their deaths. The other two patients displayed neither an increase in heart rate upon removal from life support nor heightened brain activity.

AND there are some who say that Near Death Experiences are just the dying brain on '___'.

Near Death Experiences and '___'

That's one link. But you guys can easily google NDE and '___' and read up. Tons of information and speculation.

a reply to: andy06shake

My belief encompasses yours. It makes room for yours and validates it as true. Your belief does the opposite. It blocks mine, refutes it and seeks to debunk it.

Debate is useful if your goal is to win an argument. Or if you're trying to convince someone to accept your theory over their own because your data is fact based while theirs is unsubstantiated or disproven.

As I've said, all probabilities exist. Probabilities are infinite just like numbers are infinite. That means the truth of your belief is equally valid with mine. You validate it by believing it. Your awareness of it confirms it as truth. I see the truth of your perspective. I also see the truth of my own. From my vantage point, there's nothing to refute. And I don't need to convince you that I'm right in order to feel validated.

a reply to: socialmediaclown

I'm not looking for you to convince me of anything mate.

I did not realise anyone was arguing persay.

And i agree perspective is indeed the ticket.

Ile quite happily entertain all possibilities where the topics being discussed are concerned.

But it won't change the fact of the matter that we are all products of society, where geography and social circumstance, play a big part in the possibilities we have available in life.

One man's truth can be another man's lie depending on where he is standing, again that's all down to perspective.

a reply to: andy06shake

I'm not looking for you to convince me

It appears that you are the one attempting to convince me that:

"We are all products of society and there is no escaping the human condition

The fact is geography and social circumstances generally dictate ones station in life a lot more than free will does or ever could"


Obviously this is true for many people. I'd say it's true for the majority of people on this planet. But again, it's a choice. Either chosen consciously or unconsciously.... doesn't really matter. The outcome is the same either way.

You decide your own limitations. You can believe yourself to be limited or limitless. Your brain is capable of "wiring" itself for either potential.

originally posted by: UtIntusSicForis
a reply to: Quadlink

Haven't met many atheists that aren't...
At least of his particular type...
And given his quote it's pretty obvious.
But perhaps this'll help.

Materialism is a form of philosophical monism which holds that matter is the fundamental substance in nature, and that all things, including mental states and consciousness, are results of material interactions of material things. According to philosophical materialism, mind and consciousness are by-products or epiphenomena of material processes (such as the biochemistry of the human brain and nervous system), without which they cannot exist. Materialism directly contrasts with idealism, according to which consciousness is the fundamental substance of nature.

wow .. i am trying to get my head around all that, something i did not know about, heavy stuff indeed.

Thankyou

All the best

a reply to: socialmediaclown

Its a fact that we are all products of society and there is no escaping the human condition.....to date anyroad aside from death.

As to geography and social circumstances generally dictating one's station in life, that's true more often than not, especially in other nations of the third world sorts, but there are obvious exceptions to the rule.

Where one's limitations are concerned well lack of knowledge can be a limit to many things, and not everyone on the globe is privity to education, or even clean water sources for that matter.

Plenty of things decide our limitations, lack of funds for instance being something that generally donates what you can do, or where you can go.

People are not equal socialmediaclown and the world is far from a fair place to exist.

That doesn't mean we should not strive towards a modicum of equality for all however, even if it is somewhat of a pipedream.

a reply to: Quadlink

One lives to serve...

a reply to: andy06shake

Are you aware that every action you take, down to the most miniscule motion of your body---the way you carry yourself, your gestures, your breath rate, even your eye movements-- are all rooted (consciously or subconsciously) in a belief or some concept you have of the world...your ideology? Any alteration to your proproception... even something as seemingly insignificant as straightening your posture when you walk, can have a very significant impact on the trajectory of the potential future outcome of your life. You might call this the Butterfly Effect.

You say there is no escape from the human condition. I'll just add a small caveat to that. The only perception regarding the human condition that you have total access to is your own. Through your own observation, you see that there is no escape. But that conclusion is drawn only through your own experiences. You don't know the totality of what other humans have experienced. There are things we don't know. There are things we don't know that we don't know. Therefore, there is no escape from the human condition...that you are aware of.

This life is not fair and it's not equal, on that I agree. We are born into this world with a predetermined set of conditions and circumstances that lead down a predetermined path. This will happen repeatedly as long as people are willing to accept limitation. Most people become so trapped by their restrictive state of mind that they are never able to unlock their own true potential. They are not even aware that there is a lock or a key or a door that opens up to a whole new set of probabilities. So they stay imprisoned by their own mindset for the entirety of their lives. An inflexible mindset that is passed down from generation to generation.

The truth is, humanity has yet to discover, unlock and unleash its true potential. What that potential is remains to be seen.

from what i read most people do not experience a void but an amazing world of love and peace in heaven. Some experience a void but then eventually move up to heaven. most people that go to heaven never want to return to earth and get depressed when they do.a reply to: FlyersFan2

a reply to: FlyersFan2

I am late to this thread, and I don't really know what to expect.

But ... I do know what would not surprise me: to be told that I accomplished / did not accomplish what I was intended to do in this simulation, and that I would either need to move on / go back and try it again.

I would anticipate being afforded options and choices on how next to proceed in developing my 'soul' / 'self'.

Crazy?

Hah ... no more crazy than anything anyone else has said here so far hahahah