‘Out of control’ fire aboard a massive car-carrier ship spotlights the calamitous consequences o

originally posted by: Arbitrageur
Interesting. Got any source links about that? I'd like to read more.
Wouldn't the insurance policy for the ship have a clause in it that says something to the effect that if you torpedo your own ship and sink it, the insurance company doesn't have to pay?

Nothing recent. I was doing some research for a former employer and found it. That was over six years ago, but, I haven't seen anything that makes me think that it's changed.

You have to weigh the cost of the ship versus the cost of damages from lawsuits brought by the Environmental Wacko Groups. Then there's the costs to your brand for being associated with this. Ask Bud Light.

originally posted by: Itisnowagain

They would be charged or had petrol put in before driving on to the ship, surely?

Some yes, no cxlue how much though, gas cars are easy...a few gallons at most.

originally posted by: TDDAgain

Yes, 8 min. 20-80% charge. 500+ miles range with that charge.

When the car replaced the horse there was a period before the car was better than a horse, and so at first it was just for show, now horses are just for show. The horse turned into an environmental disaster with mountains of manure where rats and fleas lived which was a true health concern. Then the car came along and fixed it but brought its own issues 100 years later. We will see that with EV too. It will fix the gas issues, but there are a lot of areas to overcome before it can even take over 30% much less 100%.

This above is a big step of many needed, though on the right path.

originally posted by: Arbitrageur

originally posted by: JIMC5499
a reply to: gortex

originally posted by: JIMC5499
As far as the ship is concerned, get the crew off and then torpedo it. That will take care of the fires and will probably do less damage to the environment than trying to fight the fires and save the ship.

Wouldn't the insurance policy for the ship have a clause in it that says something to the effect that if you torpedo your own ship and sink it, the insurance company doesn't have to pay?

It doesnt need to be a particular clause, in order for a claim to be valid, it has to be a claim against an unforseen incident, you cant insure against the sun coming up for instance and similarly you cant insure against the torpedo you launched hitting your ship

originally posted by: TDDAgain

There's a reason for this, go figure. He does not speak in absolutes and I know him to be a reasonable discussion partner.

My main point is that numbers are skewed so it is hard to figure out what is correct. Filling up a car can be dangerous just as charging batteries, the problem I see is the time involved where batteries could go unnoticed for many hours, where we would not see that with gas.

The big overall numbers were from 2020, so the last 3 years are some BIG growth years for EVs, so not sure what it is today. Looking at car fires in general in 1980 were 450k per year, holy shiot!!! Today there are like 175k per year, holy Shiot!!! lol

I don't believe that 1/3 of all car fires are EV, as that just doesn't make sense to suggest over 50K EVs burn up every year with barely 2 million on the road. IDK though as that is a strong statement from a university. That would be 2.5% per year or over 9 million gas cars if they were the same.

This is hard to believe too... I can't find links to the actual studies though both are cited over and over.

University of Tennessee Study: Electric car fires are more common than those in gasoline cars. “The study found that electric car fires occur in 3 out of every 1,000 starts, while internal combustion car fires occur in 1 out of every 10,000 starts.

So if you started your EV 3 times a day you got a good chance to lose it every year to a fire, just don't see it as it is saying you have 3 times the chance every year for a EV fire compared to 10 years with a gas car.

a reply to: Xtrozero

It's not really about whether they cause fires......it's that they can cause a lot of damage if they are in a fire. And release toxic chemicals.

Next time you park in an underground car park, check out where the exits are so you can escape if a load of them go off.

a reply to: Xtrozero

EV's have their uses. I have friends who have them because it fits their needs. I have no problem with that. I DO have a problem with the way that the Democrats are trying to shove them down our throats. The technology isn't there yet. The infrastructure isn't. Maybe down the road it will be possible. I was taught in 5th grade Science class that we were going to have all electric vehicles in the future. That was in 1976.

a reply to: Xtrozero

Yesterday, unbeknownst to the ones demanding sources from me, I already started a gradio interface and feeding data into it. Taking it a step further than just posting an article in hopes it will satisfy the two that requested. I also hope that these members will follow through on similar demands but I don't think that will happen. It takes time collecting the data and I also have a private life.

You are spot on when you say that the numbers from most articles are skewed. A lot of statistical trickery is done and I already noticed some data is not even available and needs to be extrapolated. I also expect the governments that want to push EV to weight the scales here, too.

This is hard to believe too... I can't find links to the actual studies though both are cited over and over.

Indeed..

University of Tennessee Study: Electric car fires are more common than those in gasoline cars. “The study found that electric car fires occur in 3 out of every 1,000 starts, while internal combustion car fires occur in 1 out of every 10,000 starts.


So if you started your EV 3 times a day you got a good chance to lose it every year to a fire, just don't see it as it is saying you have 3 times the chance every year for a EV fire compared to 10 years with a gas car.

Ah a real life example where I can provide data. I started my EV 6-10 times a day when my shop was booming, to collect hardware, drive to appointments etc. It became less since I got sick and even less since we live in the city. Now it may be 1x per day on average. I got it in beginning 2021, so it is 2.5 years.

That's around 5k-7k starts but I would have to check the car to see if it gives me this statistic. The EV had at least 200 0-200 launches, one time I did over 30 in a row just to see if the battery does the TESLA and goes thermal overload. It did not.

I see all these comments online from people that probably have never used an EV. People that utter things but all they know is EV have dangerous lithium battery, when this is already outdated tech and replaced. This year mass production of the next gen sodium-ion batteries start... And can not help rolling my eyes about the uninformed opinions that are based on 10 year old data. Just like the horse people, you neatly described that in your other post above.

originally posted by: JIMC5499

EV's have their uses. I have friends who have them because it fits their needs. I have no problem with that. I DO have a problem with the way that the Democrats are trying to shove them down our throats. The technology isn't there yet. The infrastructure isn't. Maybe down the road it will be possible. I was taught in 5th grade Science class that we were going to have all electric vehicles in the future. That was in 1976.

That is the issue in we do not have the infrastructure to support EVs yet, and how do you replace 300 million gas cars...even with the tech growing at a massive pace. I will have one in about 5 years and it will be nothing like the ones today. I really see the ones today as a version of the old Throttle-Body that kind of worked, but wasn't good.

Back to my horse analogy, the first car was 1885 and the horse was fully replaced in the 1920s, so what if in 1900 they just up and shot every horse? This is how I see the liberals trying to replace the gas car before it is the right time to do so, and not just let technology drive that change.

As TDD said, safer batteries, 8 min charges, 500 miles per charge, lower costs (need to get below 35k), and as this all happens the gas car will be replaced with zero effort on the part of the liberals.

originally posted by: TDDAgain
Service wise my EV beats all the ICEs I own and owned. Nothing broke yet, unlike with many ICE cars I had myself and was "honored" to repair. The EV "just" works.

My 26 year old car is exactly the same, and it's greener and retro cool.😎

It's rather silly to boast of nothing breaking on a 2.5 year old car. Get back to me in 20 years!

Will any EVs last two decades? Surely it would be beneficial to the environment for EVs to last 20-30 years before needing to be replaced. The worst NPCs are those that chop in perfectly serviceable 1-3 year old cars and have to have a brand new one made. That's a lot of resources being consumed and emissions being produced just to cart their arse around in a slightly newer box.

a reply to: baggy7981

Ha if you only knew how I bash that car around on roads and race tracks as well

The worst NPCs are those that chop in perfectly serviceable 1-3 year old cars and have to have a brand new one made. That's a lot of resources being consumed and emissions being produced just to cart their arse around in a slightly newer box.

That's kind of short sighted. Because once they sell these cars that they bought new, they loose a lot of value. This is good for people with smaller purses who then are able to buy these cars. It's not like the 1-3 year old cars are trashed, you know?

My EV is rated for 20 years no battery exchange. I don't know about yours, oh wait, you don't have one so you have 0 experience other than what you get told.

Too bad.

originally posted by: TDDAgain

My EV is rated for 20 years no battery exchange. I don't know about yours, oh wait, you don't have one so you have 0 experience other than what you get told.

Too bad.

Can you prove that your car won't require a battery change for 20 years?

I mean...... really you have zero experience in that actually being true......you simply believe what you have been told!

Most manufacturers have a five to eight-year warranty on their battery. However, the current prediction is that an electric car battery will last from 10 – 20 years before they need to be replaced.

If your battery has a warranty for 5 - 8 years then wouldn't it be best for you if it fails before the end of the warranty .........you could save yourself upto 10 grand.

Best breakdown I have seen on the situation:



Imagine this happening on a ferry full of passengers.

a reply to: Itisnowagain
No, of course not.

Just like you can't know if your ICE needs an engine change sometimes down the road because of neglect, wrong use or simply production failure.