India to acquire 400 more T-90 tanks from Russia

1. Well stealth spy tell me the problems of the t-98???
Have you ever throught that the t-98 is not like the arjun that it is a lot better with out any major problems..

2. Why are you commenting on china.. your not chinese never been to china.. dont know the government. How did the chinese eradicate 40+ million of their own people in Nazi style ???

when was this how come its not in any western books??? how come your the only one that knows about it??


there is a bout already made about the t-98 in 1999. its calle ZTZ-98

link to a site about it

www.china-defense.com...

Not going to be tolerated anymore, Stealth Spy or Chinawhite.
Cease with your inuendos, belittlements, and name calling.

The formal "Notice" has been given.
Heed the advice given.



seekerof

You sure about that? There are plenty of people writing many bad things about China, they are all in Chinese, go check Wforums or some other Chinese military discussion forum. 40 million people in Nazi-style? Go on, show me some proof. The Indians killed 400 million people Neo-Con style

And oh, I'm not born in 1991, I don't know why my profile says that, I'm 20 now.

Originally posted by chinawhite

1. Well stealth spy tell me the problems of the t-98???
Have you ever throught that the t-98 is not like the arjun that it is a lot better with out any major problems..

2. Why are you commenting on china.. your not chinese never been to china.. dont know the government. How did the chinese eradicate 40+ million of their own people in Nazi style ???

when was this how come its not in any western books??? how come your the only one that knows about it??

I don't abt this 40 million bit but the T-90 is generally considered to be better than the T-98.. ask kozzy..

Arjun is not so good IMO.. its just a platform for tank buildnig experimentation

And about this dazzler on the T-98..
What laser does it use..What power?
What is the coherence..
How is it used in battle..
I don't thin kyou can just wave it around and hope to blind other tanks esp if the beam is coherent..
And well divergent beams are not lasers..
Why not use a really High powered flashlight and sweep it across ..
IF you trying to achieve blinding of a target then IMO thats much more logical and cost effective..
Really some one please tell me whats the deal with this dazzler...

and plz guys .. heed the mod's notice.. he ain't kidding..
Many a fruitful discussion have been scuttled due to stupid irrelevant statements..

40 million people in Nazi-style? Go on, show me some proof. The Indians killed 400 million people Neo-Con style

nice one.. :p

[edit on 14-5-2005 by Daedalus3]

About the laser on the Type-98, it is recieving this much attention more because it is the first time an "offensive" laser was mounted on a tank. Not much is known about this, but basically it fries a tanks optics and/or blinds the people targeted by the laser.

Then, about the T-90 being better than the Type-98, nobody knows for sure, I know Kozzy and his rankings are quite good, but then again, Stealth Spy believes that the Arjun is better than the T-90, and some Americans belive that the M1A2 is better than the Challenger 2. To me, they are all around the same level, nothing is known for sure, but I belive the T-90 was offered to China and China refused the offer.

Article on the Dazzler system:

The Type 98 features an JD-3 integrated laser rangefinder/warning/self-defence device. Unlike contemporary Russian active tank self-defense systems like Drozd, Drozd-2, and Arena, which launch projectiles to disable or "shoot-down" incoming anti-tank missiles and projectiles, the Chinese system apparently uses a high-powered laser to directly attack the enemy weapon's optics and gunner.

The system includes what appears to be a laser warning receiver (LWR - the dome-shaped device on the turret roof behind the commander's position), that warns the crew that their tank is being illuminated by an enemy range-finding or weapon-guidance laser. The turret of the tank can then be traversed to face the direction of the enemy threat, and the laser self-defence weapon ('___'W - the box-shaped device on the turret roof behind the gunner's position), can be employed against the source of the enemy laser.

The procedure of the laser weapon would first use a low-powered beam to locate the optics of the enemy weapon. Once the enemy weapon was located, the power level of the laser would be immediately and dramatically increased. Such an attack would disable the guidance optics of the enemy weapon and/or damage the eyesight of the enemy gunner.

The available photos of the Type 98 have also confirmed that the laser weapon can be elevated to a higher angle than the tank's main gun, indicating that the engagement of attack helicopters is possible. In addition, the laser device could also be used for communications between friend tanks.

the Chinese system apparently uses a high-powered laser to directly attack the enemy weapon's optics and gunner.

huh??

The procedure of the laser weapon would first use a low-powered beam to locate the optics of the enemy weapon

How does it do that??

.

Once the enemy weapon was located, the power level of the laser would be immediately and dramatically increased. Such an attack would disable the guidance optics of the enemy weapon and/or damage the eyesight of the enemy gunner.

wow I'd like to see a demo!1
Not taht I don't believe it( sounds plausible)
but it sure is very hi-fi!! ( not hi -fidelity!! )

Perhaps the most interesting characteristic of the Type 98 is the addition of what appears to be a previously unknown active self-defense system. Unlike contemporary Russian active tank self-defense systems like Drozd, Drozd-2, and Arena, which launch projectiles to disable or "shoot-down" incoming anti-tank missiles and projectiles, the Chinese system apparently uses a high-powered laser to directly attack the enemy weapon's optics and gunner. The system includes what appears to be a laser warning receiver (LWR - the dome-shaped device on the turret roof behind the commander's position), that warns the crew that their tank is being illuminated by an enemy range-finding or weapon-guidance laser. The turret of the tank can then be traversed to face the direction of the enemy threat, and the laser self-defense weapon ('___'W - the box-shaped device on the turret roof behind the gunner's position), can be employed against the source of the enemy laser.


While the engagement procedure of the Type 98's self-defense laser is unknown, published reports concerning similar weapons describe a procedure where the laser weapon would first use a low-powered beam to locate the optics of the enemy weapon. Once the enemy weapon was located, the power level of the laser would be immediately and dramatically increased. Such an attack would disable the guidance optics of the enemy weapon and/or damage the eyesight of the enemy gunner.

The turret-mounted system carried by the Type 98 is very similar to a tripod-mounted laser weapon that was seen for the first time at an arms exhibition in Manila in 1995. Identified at the exhibition as the "Laser Interference Device," it matched the description of a known Chinese laser weapon called the ZM-87. According to its promotional information, one of the ZM-87's major uses is to "injure or dizzy targeted individuals." The ZM-87 can reportedly injure the human eye at 2-3 kms, this rising to over 5 kms using a 7-power magnification device. Additionally, short-term "flaring blind-ness" can be inflicted on the human eye at up to 10 kms. The ZM-87 and the laser weapon carried by the Type 98 should not be confused with electro-optical "dazzlers" like those turret-mounted de-vices used by the Iraqis during Operation Desert Storm. Those Iraqi devices (some of which are believed to have been supplied by the Chinese), are designed to confuse the tracking systems of Western/NATO anti-tank guided missiles (ATGMs), without directly attacking the controlling optics or the eyesight of the weapon's gunner. The available photos of the Type 96 have also confirmed that the laser weapon can be elevated to a higher angle than the tank's main gun, indicating that the engagement of attack helicopters is possible.

this is the ZM-87

The Type-98 MBTs are fitted with a JD-3 integrated laser rangefinder/warning/self-defense device – also called a "dazzler" – which uses a high-powered laser to directly attack the enemy weapon's optics and gunner.

At least one source indicated to the magazine Russia has supplied some of the technology for the Chinese project in exchange for foreign currency to fund its own tank programs.

Russia, meanwhile, is upgrading its MBT to the T-95 version, which is so secret public photos have yet to be released, according to an analysis by the American Foreign Policy Center.

AFPC said China is believed to be the first country to use such active laser defense devices on its tanks.

Source

can someone tell me what that part in chinese/japanese reads, cause i think it has some info on the Type-98 being a more advanced, slightly cosmetically tweaked t-72

And about the american tanks, well the American Abrams M1A1 tank's armour is not as good as advertised .



^^American Abrams M1A1 tank (serial # L13170) in Baghdad, after being hit by an 8-mm speed-of-light man portable gas plasma weapon. Plasma ball entered through skirt armor covering right track, cut through main hull armor (right side), then grazed rear of gunner's seat and control panel before gouging a 2" deep hole in main hull armor (left side). Just like sliding a hot knife through soft butter. Sadly for America, Los Alamos hasn't got anything even remotely like it

source

When America invested billions in the development of the Abrams battle tank, the Russians started to look for a more economical way of killing it without bothering to build an opposition tank of their own. To this end, they duplicated the American armor and tested different methods of penetrating it with lightweight economical weapons. Long before America invaded Russian ally Iraq in 2003, they had already found the answer.

Before America crossed the border from Kuwait into Iraq, Russia discreetly supplied the Republican Guard with more than 1,000 "Kornet" anti-tank missiles. Each of these and its launcher can easily be handled by a team of three men, and be fired from a simple hole in the desert. Kornet is a laser-guided Mach 3 nightmare with a double warhead guaranteed to finish off at Abrams from 5,000 yards away. In other words, completely out of sight of the American tank crew until missile impact. These missiles have already accounted for more than 60 Abrams tanks in Iraq, and will unquestionably account for a lot more in the future.

Source

I've seen that T-72-T-98 pic soo many places before..
wonder what the real purpose is of showing em' together..
Is it really to show the similarities or is it something else?
Anyone translate the chinese text?

if anything it's to show the two tanks are nothing alike...

Look how much larger the Type-98 chassis is for a start

Originally posted by Daedalus3
I've seen that T-72-T-98 pic soo many places before..
wonder what the real purpose is of showing em' together..
Is it really to show the similarities or is it something else?
Anyone translate the chinese text?

It's because China uses alot of T-72's so a comparison is normal to show you the difference between the latest tanks and the main one in China's arsenal.

Originally posted by Stealth Spy

The Type-98 MBTs are fitted with a JD-3 integrated laser rangefinder/warning/self-defense device – also called a "dazzler" – which uses a high-powered laser to directly attack the enemy weapon's optics and gunner.

At least one source indicated to the magazine Russia has supplied some of the technology for the Chinese project in exchange for foreign currency to fund its own tank programs.

Russia, meanwhile, is upgrading its MBT to the T-95 version, which is so secret public photos have yet to be released, according to an analysis by the American Foreign Policy Center.

AFPC said China is believed to be the first country to use such active laser defense devices on its tanks.

Source

stealth spy learn to read. the tech transfer wasn't about the laser... Jesus ur dumb

first of all when sinodefence says based hull it means use it as a starting place to devlop there own hull. there is a difference between BASED and IS

if you can see the wheels on the t-98 are spaced out and the hull is longer. you would need a different drive machanism to move them. and differnt engine

it you want to compare looks





leopard 2
external image


well stealth spy if we're going by how tanks look the arjun is a copy of the leopard 2


EDIT: Image didn't show
RE-EDIT: image re-edit
RE-EDIT again: image re-edit
RE-EDIT again: image was sqused

[edit on 14-5-2005 by chinawhite]

[edit on 14-5-2005 by chinawhite]

[edit on 14-5-2005 by chinawhite]

[edit on 14-5-2005 by chinawhite]

[edit on 14-5-2005 by chinawhite]

The Russian help was obviously there, but not with the laser. I bet Arjun also had some Russian help


The Type-98 chassis is totally different from the T-72 chassis. Funny that people are pasting that to show that its different while you post it to say that they are the same. I'm not even going to point out the differences for you.

And yes, Arjun also looks like the Leopard 2, while the Type-98 looks nothing like the T-72. If the Type-98 uses the chassis of the T-72 then the Arjun is a direct copy of the Leopard 2.

[edit on 14/5/05 by W4rl0rD]

[sarcasm]Arjun is nothing more than a copy of the Leopard 2!!! India can only copy and cannot design anything on their own!!11!! [/sarcasm]

Leo 2:



Arjun:

Sorry,ignore this post.

[edit on 15/5/05 by W4rl0rD]

holy crap nice find

the hull of these two look almost identical on the outside even the space between the wheels are the same

good link to more pics of leopard 2

www.fprado.com...

LEOPARD 2A6 MAIN BATTLE TANK - SPECIFICATIONS

Weight 62 metric tons
Length 7.7 m
Width 3.7 m
Height 3.0 m
Maximum speed 72 km/hr
Maximum range 500 km

Arjun specs

Weight 59 tons
Length (gun forwards)10.19m
Width (over tracks) 3.5m
Height 3.025
maximum speed 72-70 kph

arjun side view
external image

and leopard 2




[edit on 15-5-2005 by chinawhite]

[edit on 15-5-2005 by chinawhite]

[edit on 15-5-2005 by chinawhite]