Germany's Next Topmodel

originally posted by: mtnshredder

originally posted by: Annee

originally posted by: mtnshredder
Hmmm….the Adam’s Apple is definitely a deal breaker for me. I’m out.

Reason for early puberty blockers.

Still a dude and I’m really not down with the children’s puberty blockers. I think it’s child abuse on a whole other level, especially when I see the numbers for de-transitioning and the misery associated with it, not to mention almost half of the people that transition commit suicide. You’re okay with rolling that dice for a child and making that decision for a kid that isn’t close to being mentally fully developed?

An adult has to be morally bankrupt to allow or push this type of abuse on a child, it’s sick.

I read one advocate link the other day that stated:
"Puberty blockers are safe....."
Then in the next paragraph it stated:
"As of yet, the long term effects of puberty blockers can't be measured until the subjects get older"......
What the actual hell?
I will try and find the link and edit if I do.

Eta:
Not the same article but close enough.

“We have a lot of experience in pediatric endocrinology using pubertal blockers. And from all the evidence we have they are generally a very safe medication.”..............
However, the use of puberty blockers to treat transgender children is what’s considered an “off label” use of the medication — something that hasn’t been approved by the Food and Drug Administration. And doctors say their biggest concern is about how long children stay on the medication, because there isn’t enough research into the effects of stalling puberty at the age when children normally go through it.

www.pbs.org...

originally posted by: ketsuko

originally posted by: Annee

originally posted by: mtnshredder
Hmmm….the Adam’s Apple is definitely a deal breaker for me. I’m out.

Reason for early puberty blockers.

So a lack of Adam's apple is a reason to risk early onset osteoporosis, high blood pressure, blood clots, mood disturbances, permanent sterility due to a lack of proper development too long delayed, higher stroke risks, etc.

All of these are effects of a drug like Lupron. Lupron is the type of drug they give to cancer patients because the disease is clearly worse than the cure.

But an Adam's apple?

Not your decision to make for any one other than you and your family.

All meds have a side effect.

I had to make decisions for meds with my kids. I made that decision on what was best for them.

I had the most amazing Pediatrician. His #1 advice was Self Esteem. Kids need to feel right about themselves

So, absolutely, if the body is changing and they want puberty blockers -- to feel right about themselves. Yes.

originally posted by: ketsuko
a reply to: Annee

No Jazz is miserable because Jazz has said as much in recent interviews.

There are very real regrets over things, and you begin to wonder how much of how far Jazz has gone is because that's really who Jazz is and how much if because that's what Jazz's mother pushed Jazz to be for various reasons.

Jazz is arguably a top superstar, so being the bullied kid at school is not an excuse.

I know Jazz is having emotional issues -- but I think you're reading into it what you want to read into it.

I don't think her issue is being transgender.

To be continued.

originally posted by: Annee

originally posted by: ketsuko

originally posted by: Annee

originally posted by: mtnshredder
Hmmm….the Adam’s Apple is definitely a deal breaker for me. I’m out.

Reason for early puberty blockers.

So a lack of Adam's apple is a reason to risk early onset osteoporosis, high blood pressure, blood clots, mood disturbances, permanent sterility due to a lack of proper development too long delayed, higher stroke risks, etc.

All of these are effects of a drug like Lupron. Lupron is the type of drug they give to cancer patients because the disease is clearly worse than the cure.

But an Adam's apple?

Not your decision to make for any one other than you and your family.

All meds have a side effect.

I had to make decisions for meds with my kids. I made that decision on what was best for them.

I had the most amazing Pediatrician. His #1 advice was Self Esteem. Kids need to feel right about themselves

So, absolutely, if the body is changing and they want puberty blockers -- to feel right about themselves. Yes.

And if they still don't "feel right about themselves"?

Puberty blockers used to treat children aged 12 to 15 who have severe and persistent gender dysphoria had no significant effect on their psychological function, thoughts of self-harm, or body image, a study has found.1

www.bmj.com...


Anne,
You have told me in numerous abortion threads "I only care about living children".
Are you sure you don't care more about you political ideology?

originally posted by: Quadrivium
And if they still don't "feel right about themselves"?

Puberty blockers used to treat children aged 12 to 15 who have severe and persistent gender dysphoria had no significant effect on their psychological function, thoughts of self-harm, or body image, a study has found.1

www.bmj.com...

Puberty blockers aren't intended to have a significant effect on those things and a study showing they don't would be accurate. What GnRH agonists do do is prevent these these things from becoming worse in a child with severe and persistent gender dysphoria.

originally posted by: AdifferentOpinion

originally posted by: Quadrivium
And if they still don't "feel right about themselves"?

Puberty blockers used to treat children aged 12 to 15 who have severe and persistent gender dysphoria had no significant effect on their psychological function, thoughts of self-harm, or body image, a study has found.1

www.bmj.com...

Puberty blockers aren't intended to have a significant effect on those things and a study showing they don't would be accurate. What GnRH agonists do do is prevent these these things from becoming worse in a child with severe and persistent gender dysphoria.

Then why do advocates keep pushing them?

Because they do not care.
They only want to act.
Repercussions and long term consequences be damned.

So. if a child has epilepsy -- taking drugs to control that -- even if the drugs have serious side effects would be just fine.

Because that is something you accept.

originally posted by: Annee
So. if a child has epilepsy -- taking drugs to control that -- even if the drugs have serious side effects would be just fine.

Because that is something you accept.

Your post make no sense to me.
You have shown your true interest and priorities. Please move on.

I think Annee has a point and one that many here seem to disregard.

Puberty suppression isn't given to happy and healthy "normal" children... they are considered when a gender dysphoric child is highly distressed and usually dealing with depression, anxiety and most likely suicidal ideation.

No, puberty blockers aren't perfect and may carry some risks, however, those risks are weighed against the damage and emotional trauma being done to a gender dysphoric child facing the prospect of an unwanted puberty.

originally posted by: Peeple
But the feeling you've been cheated out of the life you were supposed to have...

Isn't taking puberty blockers cheating the body out of what it was supposed to blossom into?

She's not all that adorable, pretty plain really. Doesn't score high on the fapability scale. I'm guessing this topmodel thing is a competition to be a catwalk model or supermodel? There's not much femininity in those circles dude, most are ironing boards with a face.

Doesn't she deserve happiness? Wouldn't you agree her parents' decision to fulfill her her wish was the right one?

Yeah, as long as her happiness doesn't displace women's happiness, and doesn't want to cancel/kill people.

a reply to: AdifferentOpinion
And according to the article I posted they change nothing.
These kids are still depressed and suicidal.

So (correct me if I am wrong),
It is OK to cause mental stress and confusion on All children, to help a few.
It is OK to give off label meds to children, that have been shown not to work and no research on the long term affects.
It is OK to mutilate children, that may be gay or be confused (for what actually, the greater good?).
It is OK to advocate for these things even though we have no actual evidence of anything, but at least we are doing something, regardless of who it harms.

Yeah, thanks, but hell no.
Leave kids ALONE. Try loving them and accepting them.
Try teaching them to accept themselves by accepting them the way they are.

Whatever happened to coping skills?

Why is the almighty pill the miraculous solution for everything under the sun?

I remember puberty, it was VERY awkward.

I guess I'm lucky my parents taught me how to toughen up and push through it with positive lessons.

I feel nothing but empathy for these ultrasensitive kids, but as harsh as it sounds, you can't save everyone, no matter what lengths and extremes to try to go through. Life isn't a cake walk, it takes a degree of toughness to deal with it's challenges, and it's difficult to navigate without extra sensitivities.

Suicide is always a sad ending, I just wish there were more efforts to combat these dysphoric feelings than through drugs and surgery.

My heart goes out to these kids.

a reply to: Quadrivium
All I have to hope for is that you never have to deal with a child of your own with gender dysphoria but maybe I should hope for that only to see how fast you do a 180 when it's your own kid involved.

That's usually what it takes to convince people but I only said it like that as an example. I wouldn't wish GD on anyone.

originally posted by: AdifferentOpinion
a reply to: Quadrivium
All I have to hope for is that you never have to deal with a child of your own with gender dysphoria but maybe I should hope for that only to see how fast you do a 180 when it's your own kid involved.

That's usually what it takes to convince people but I only said it like that as an example. I wouldn't wish GD on anyone.

And once more.

My life is my own and none of your damn business.

You have NO idea what I have been through.

You see the abuse of children as collateral damage.

I see it as child abuse.

originally posted by: GENERAL EYES
Whatever happened to coping skills?

Why is the almighty pill the miraculous solution for everything under the sun?

I remember puberty, it was VERY awkward.

I guess I'm lucky my parents taught me how to toughen up and push through it with positive lessons.

I feel nothing but empathy for these ultrasensitive kids, but as harsh as it sounds, you can't save everyone, no matter what lengths and extremes to try to go through. Life isn't a cake walk, it takes a degree of toughness to deal with it's challenges, and it's difficult to navigate without extra sensitivities.

Suicide is always a sad ending, I just wish there were more efforts to combat these dysphoric feelings than through drugs and surgery.

My heart goes out to these kids.

You have won my heart.
Thank you.

a reply to: Quadrivium

Hit a nerve there, did I?

And likewise, you have no damn idea what I have been through either.

Being negligent toward and ignorant of the needs gender dysphoric children and doing nothing is abuse. You see what you want to see and I'll see what I know.

originally posted by: AdifferentOpinion
a reply to: Quadrivium

Hit a nerve there, did I?

Well, you condone child abuse so, yeah.....

And likewise, you have no damn idea what I have been through either.

Two major differences, I didn't assume OR ask.

Being negligent toward and ignorant of the needs gender dysphoric children and doing nothing is abuse. You see what you want to see and I'll see what I know.

I see advocates pushing things that they do not understand.
I see advocates acting when they should be learning.
I see people abusing children and happy about it because it sates THEIR selfish feelz.

You are nothing special.
You are just another advocate, pushing child abuse.

originally posted by: Quadrivium
You are nothing special.
You are just another advocate, pushing child abuse.

I have my reasons for not explaining why you are wrong because it's none of your damn business but just as certain you are in your beliefs, as am I in mine with the difference being, what I know to be true is not something I learned from watching Matt Walsh et.al.

This is not a a debate or a discussion, it seems to be more of a pissing match and I have better things to do.

Cheers!

originally posted by: AdifferentOpinion

originally posted by: Quadrivium
You are nothing special.
You are just another advocate, pushing child abuse.

I have my reasons for not explaining why you are wrong because it's none of your damn business

Again, I am not the one that assumed or asked.

but just as certain you are in your beliefs, as am I in mine with the difference being, what I know to be true is not something I learned from watching Matt Walsh et.al.

Who?
This is why you're wrong.
You know nothing.
You assume everything.
I don't watch TV, maybe you should try it.

This is not a a debate or a discussion, it seems to be more of a pissing match and I have better things to do.

On this we agree.
I have agreed with you several times, throughout this thread.
You, on the other hand, won't even speak out against or deny the abuse of children happening because of what you support.
You only care about you and your feelz, or that's the way it seems atleast.
Again, nothing special, just another advocate, in favor of abusing children.



Eta:
oh, Matt Walsh, honestly I think you and him are more alike.
Your political ideologies come before anything else. You both are stuck in your tribal mentalities.

Wrong thread.