The Jesus of the Bible was a communist. If you aren't a communist, then you are anti-Christ.

a reply to: Butterfinger

Hi there. I think you've got me mixed up with the OP. I didn't post this 👇 He or she did -- in reply to me.

Not even close. To follow a religion, particularly the Christian one, it's EXTEREMELLY difficult...

originally posted by: ltrz2025
a reply to: ToneDeaf
When you read Acts . . .
“for all who were possessors of lands or houses sold them, ”
Just reading from the Bible.

Editing the Bible is a no no
Here is the full actual sentence :
"For from time to time those who owned land or houses sold them"
Changing the words changes the meaning
www.biblegateway.com...
Just reading and quoting from the bible.

Anyways . . . certain secs often bequeath their possessions
written in wills from time to time, that doesn't make
them 'communists'
Although you do have a point to some degree, as
some secs of cultural Judaism had and
still have Kibbutz run communes.
Then there are plenty, of food-banks that are
run by different religions.,
Keep in mind too, that for families with
children it would be very difficult without a home,
unless you lived the life of a nomadic sheep herder.
Again, the quote was mainly understood to be
directed at single males for a 'calling'
and to convert Jewish pharisees from their ill ways.

_______________________

originally posted by: ToneDeaf

originally posted by: ltrz2025
a reply to: ToneDeaf
When you read Acts . . .
“for all who were possessors of lands or houses sold them, ”
Just reading from the Bible.

Editing the Bible is a no no
Here is the full actual sentence :
"For from time to time those who owned land or houses sold them"
Changing the words changes the meaning
www.biblegateway.com...
Just reading and quoting from the bible.

You might want to apologize for falsely accusing me of "editing" the Bible.

I did no such thing.

I guess you don't know that there are different translations of the Bible. You are reading from the New International Version of the Bible. Probably the most controversial of the translations, since they changed quite a lot in that one.

99% of the other Bible translations say what I wrote down, or something very similar. Anyone can check this, simply google: "Acts 4:34-35 (KJV)" and check the different translations.

I'm reading directly from the KING JAMES BIBLE (KJV), which is the first and most well known translation of the Bible to English:

"Nor was there anyone among them who lacked; for all who were possessors of lands or houses sold them, and brought the proceeds of the things that were sold, and laid them at the apostles' feet; and they distributed to each as anyone had need."

Here the link to it, if anyone needs it:
www.bible.com...


P.S.: The fact that Kibbutz are a thing, it's irrelevant, it doesn't change what Jesus commanded and the way he lived according to the Bible. You don't like calling this "communism", ok, call it "having no private property, sharing the means of production in a classless society, and with no capital (wealth accumulation)". This is in fact, the basic description of the communist social organization, but well, I understand if you don't like it.

P.S. 2: I already contested your "interpretation", you think that this message was only for the pharisees, but as the bible describes, Jesus and his followers lived like that, so it was a law for everybody. Plus, read Matthew 19, you will see that after 19:21, Jesus tells his apostles that they had to do the same thing, to which they all reacted surprised.

a reply to: ltrz2025
Are you a Christian? No? Then you don't really have a say. Bye...

a reply to: ltrz2025

the new translations are heresy btw.

a reply to: yuppa

Ok... but I'm quoting directly from the KING JAMES BIBLE, which is the oldest version in English.

It was @ToneDeaf the one quoting from the new version, known as the New International Version. In this case, you are 100% right. Millions of Christians pointed out that this New International Version is completely manipulated and, therefore, heresy for them.

originally posted by: ltrz2025
You might want to apologize for falsely accusing me of "editing" the Bible. I did no such thing.
I guess you don't know that there are different translations of the Bible.
P.S.: The fact that Kibbutz are a thing, it's irrelevant, it doesn't change what
Jesus commanded and the way he lived according to the Bible.

Bible versions Lol now there is a red herring !
"Commandments of Jesus" now there is a new one Lol.
Say what you will, but this is exactly why
I highly respect the unchanged Quran (and I'm a baptized Christian)


____________________________

originally posted by: ltrz2025
P.S.: The fact that Kibbutz are a thing, it's irrelevant

It was a way of life for Jews during that time,
Of who Jesus was directing his teaching to.


__________________________

a reply to: AOx6179

This is a lie. Nothing has been determined yet. Ie. No ones been condemned as of this moment. Except the devil and some fallen angles.

You are loved, Ltrz2025...

That'll be good news for the OP, who could probably use a little love just now.

However, it is a question that different sects of Christianity literally exist to fight over. Calvinists (the 'Reformed Church') and a few others believe that because God knows all things, the future was already predestined at the instant of Creation. God has long ago decided which souls are saved and which damned. This doctrine derives ultimately from St Augustine of Hippo, who taught that the damned are condemned to eternal punishment by God's will. Despite this endorsement from one of the greatest of the Church Fathers, Roman Catholics, Lutherans and others reject belief in predestination and believe all souls can attain salvation.

Calvinism and non-Methodist Arminianism, on the contrary, embrace it. What you do (or don't do) and what you experience on Earth are determined by whether you're one of the saved or one of the damned. No amount of faith or repentance can change that. Moreover, belief in predestination gets mixed up with the concept of 'election' -- the idea of a special group chosen by God for His own purposes, and incidentally for salvation, leaving most of humanity to go, literally, to the Devil. This leads to some interesting moral acrobatics: if you're poor or suffering, it must be because you are damned, so your misfortunes are in fact richly deserved. This strain of thinking underpins the politics of much of the Christian religious right and is on full display in this thread.

Very few Christians understand these particulars of belief, or realise how many variations of the Christian faith exist. They learn only the version promoted by their own church and take that for 'Christianity', as the OP has done here. Others, like you, devise their own versions of Christianity based on Scripture and personal taste. Either way, other interpretations are condemned as false and heretical.

Thus the various sects come into conflict with one another. Thence the various schisms of mediaeval Christianity, the terrifying religious wars of the sixteenth century and the secession of the Church of England, all of which helped shape the modern West as it exists today. Thence, too, the controversy and confusion of this thread.

originally posted by: ltrz2025
You are reading from the New International Version of the Bible
I'm reading directly from the KING JAMES BIBLE,
which is the most well known translation of the Bible to English.

So are you saying that the
Complete Jewish Bible is wrong ? ?
www.biblegateway.com...:33-35&version=CJB
" With great power the emissaries continued testifying to the resurrection of the Lord Yeshua, and they were all held in high regard. No one among them was poor, since those who owned lands or houses sold them and turned over the proceeds to the emissaries to distribute to each according to his need."
Em·is·sar·y
/ˈeməˌserē/
noun
1. a person sent on a special mission, usually as a diplomatic representative.
The verse is simply saying that people were donating what they could to the emissaries.

Why do you say that the King james bible is the official
original word of God ? Lol


______________________________

a reply to: ToneDeaf

You keep reading from the New International Version, which is VERY DIFFERENT and altered from the original versions of the Bible. This New International Version, even your Christian brother Yuppa, a few post above, told you that is considered heresy.

Feels like you are literally doing what you accuse me of doing: manipulating the bible, by reading the most controversial and modern of the translations. But well, if you prefer to read the New International Version, which is completely different to the original and is considered a heresy, suit yourself. Sounds like apostasy to me though.

a reply to: ltrz2025

Last post for you.

Yeah, I'm sure you wish. I am well aware I am a thorn in your side; I intend to be, as long as you continue to try and lead people astray from the truth.

I will continue to post, and there's nothing you can do about it.

It's impossible to discuss with you because you read the bible...

Yeah, I know you added the part about "my interpretation," but then again, you do the same with Jesus' words. I posted that entire conversation containing Mark 19:21 many, many pages back. It runs for several verses, and Jesus explains to His disciples quite clearly what he meant and intended. Yet, you ignore all that in favor of the one verse that you have fixated on. I believe the portion of your post I just quoted is the actual truth anyway. You find it impossible to discuss with me because I read the Bible and know better than to immediately accept your words.

Let me guess... you don't like it when someone truncates your statement. Why do you think it is OK for you to do so to Jesus, but not OK for me to do to you? Those are your words above, are they not? So you admit you cannot discuss with anyone who reads the Bible.

It's not my aim to discuss your personal opinions.

But it certainly seems you have no problem whatsoever discussing yours. Again, "rules for thee, none for me." Sorry hoss, that dog don't hunt.

TheRedneck

I'm just quoting from official patented Bibles
Here are just a few more of the exact sentence :
The first version is interesting since it is taken straight from the Complete Jewish Bible
www.biblegateway.com...
-those who owned lands
or houses sold them and turned over the proceeds to the emissaries
-From time to time people sold land
-those who had been affluent sold their houses
-for as many as were possessors
-for all who were owners


Just quoting from the Bibles
Anyways . . .
By all the donations, it would
say that the emissaries were NOT lacking funds.



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a reply to: AOx6179

That was a powerful testimony, brother. My story is similar. I suspect many are.

Just wanted to give you some kudos for posting that.


TheRedneck

a reply to: ltrz2025

That particular user calls everyone he or she disagrees with a liar. Don't take it too hard -- or them too seriously.

You've done brilliantly for your first (it is your first, isn't it?) thread on ATS. Twenty-one pages and counting! You've defended your position staunchly and -- on the whole -- courteously in the face of almost unanimous opposition. Brave work; I salute you.

This thread reminds me of a famous poem by Matthew Arnold. Just substitute 'for the world' in Line 2 below with 'ATS' and it applies perfectly. Scans perfectly, too.

Ah, love, let us be true
To one another! for the world, which seems
To lie before us like a land of dreams,
So various, so beautiful, so new,
Hath really neither joy, nor love, nor light,
Nor certitude, nor peace, nor help for pain;
And we are here as on a darkling plain
Swept with confused alarms of struggle and flight,
Where ignorant armies clash by night.

-- Matthew Arnold, 'Dover Beach'

a reply to: Astyanax

LOL, thanks for the morale buddy. But well,all good really. After so many years of looking for the truth, I've grown used to swim against the tide. It is necessary for me. I actually love this, one of my fav hobbies (crazy as it sounds). But well, thanks for the kind words. Yes, it was my first thread here in ATS.

Okay, so... Mods really didn't like the way I bounced up outta here. Lol it was worth it, Dont tread on me.........always treadin on me. Lol. You're cool, we're cool. I get it. 💪

Anywho...
So I'd like to "politely say" goodbye to this conversation once and for all. It's been an honor sharing my love for God here. I judge no one. I love all as equal. I have no hate in my heart for anyone, and I certainly find no comfort in any human being to ever "burn in hell." And inq my love for all, I "literally" ask God to forgive us all for all that we do. Especially being ugly to one another, and even more especially over something that is so beautiful. I promise one thing. They didn't call it "The Good News" cause everyone was going to hell except the "perfect." That I can assure you with all that I AM.

I hope the very best for you, ltrz2025. May you find what you seek, may your cup be always overflowing, and may the Lord bless you and your entire family with all the abundance of love, peace, joy, mercy, and treasures from the kingdom of all that is good, reign down and bless you in all that you do, my brother.
I apologize it got heated, and I apologize if I hurt you in any way. It was not my intention...






My final thought for this topic is a "props" to the ladies of the Bible.
1 Soon afterward he went on through cities and villages, proclaiming and bringing the good news of the kingdom of God. And the twelve were with him, 2 and also some women who had been healed of evil spirits and infirmities: Mary, called Magdalene, from whom seven demons had gone out, 3 and Joanna, the wife of Chuza, Herod's household manager, and Susanna, and many others, who provided for them out of their means. (Luke 8:1-3, ESV)

a reply to: ltrz2025

When you read Acts, and you find the description of how Jesus and his followers lived, you can see that he lived like a communist hippie with his buddies:

Honestly, this sounds like an argument you got from a communist hippie college professor, who likely lived as a hippie looking for Utopia. Goodness knows there are enough of them in circulation.

a reply to: ltrz2025

You don't like calling this "communism", ok, call it "having no private property, sharing the means of production in a classless society, and with no capital (wealth accumulation)".

I really like how you even threw in the old Marxist “”classless society”…. But wait you say “sharing the means of production”…

Communism, also known as a command system, is an economic system where the government owns most of the factors of production and decides the allocation of resources and what products and services will be provided.

Communist countries, particularly Russia and China, decided on a centrally planned economy (aka command economy). The centrally planned economy had the following major attributes: The government owns all means of production, which is managed by employees of the state.

thismatter.com...


So, was that what you meant by “sharing the means of production!” Or is is this the happy Utopia that hippie communes try to emulate but nowhere is it put into action by massive numbers of people? Is this the hoped for goal but China snd Russia just got it wrong? Oh, by the way communist China is now instituting a brand new “social credit securing” method of totalitarianism.
Oh the kibbutz stuff, yes I read that the pioneers who went to the newly formed State of Israel formed communistic Kibbutzes there. But then, some of the early proponents of the State of Israel were Labor Zionists who had the communist thing going. Perhaps they just dragged it from their Khazarian roots.

I can be just as outlandish and claim Jesus was a Fascist. Sounds like you really missed the over all message he was teaching.