How many men have no clue

a reply to: AugustusMasonicus

With the other poster, which you interjected yourself and your confusion about homicide into.

I don't remember mentioning "homicide" in this thread. I said abortion is the premeditated killing of a human, just like the other poster. You brought up homicide and murder.

the other poster clearly said the 'premeditated killing of another human being' which is the absolute legal definition of murder one.

No, it's not. On August 22, 2019, Gary Bowles was executed by the State of Florida for the murders of six men. Gary Bowles was not murdered by the State of Florida, yet his death was premeditated and executed. No one was charged with murder for his death.

First Degree Murder is defined as the unlawful premeditated killing of a human. Abortion is the premeditated killing of an unborn human, whether it is legal or not. All the words in the definition matter, not just the ones you want to matter.

TheRedneck

a reply to: AugustusMasonicus

Viability outside the mother, somewhere in the 20 week range. I might even be fine with slightly less than that but there needs to be caveats for rape and incest and also one for the entire term for the mother's health.

Nice position, but I didn't ask for that. I asked if what you considered "reasonable" and what others consider "reasonable" can be different.

TheRedneck

originally posted by: TheRedneck
I don't remember mentioning "homicide" in this thread.

Did you interject yourself into a conversation where that was the topic? Yeah?

originally posted by: TheRedneck
Nice position, but I didn't ask for that. I asked if what you considered "reasonable" and what others consider "reasonable" can be different.

Ask them, you have my answer.

a reply to: AugustusMasonicus

Strange... according to the title of the thread, the topic is "How Many men Have No Clue?"

TheRedneck

a reply to: AugustusMasonicus


As I said, you lack any and all comprehension of why your backwards thinking is, as you put it, "Scumbaggery".
You are so stuck on 'being human' that you fail to realize what a human being actually is.

I can honestly imagine slavers thought the same thing about slaves. As I said before, you and them have the same thought process, just about a different group of humans.

The constitution does not say "human beings and are not afforded any rights since they are not born."
It says "persons".

How many pages have we been going at this? During all of my replies, where have you seen me type out the word "person"?
There is a HUGE difference in the terms "person" and "human being".

While the term "Person" aka "being human" is based in philosophy and religion, the term "human being" is based in Science.

The exact same behavior that you described as "scumbaggery" is the very behavior you are championing. You actually believe that one human beings life is more valuable than an others, because you consider the other to be a 'less than' and a form of property.

Basic Human Rights transcend the US Constitution. Like slavery, one day the premeditated killing of humans will be illegal.
Then we can finally add the word 'unlawful' to the incomplete definition and call it what it actually is.
Until then, we have to say that abortion is the premeditated killing of another human being.

a reply to: AugustusMasonicus

The only answer I have is to a question I did not ask.

How about answering the question I asked?

TheRedneck

a reply to: Quadrivium

An interesting corollary to that is that slavery was excused using the same DNA argument that is used here. Slaves at the time were not considered human, but rather a less advanced species only similar to humans. That's why black slavery took off... it was difficult to hold that argument when the "sub-human species" looked exactly like the slavers did. Never mind that black folk have the same characteristics in every detail as white folk, save the color of their skin; black folk had to be deemed "not human" over economic needs.

If course, no one knew about DNA back then, but they did know about different species of animals.

Now we know about DNA of course, and we know that humans come in many skin colors. But the argument being advanced is eerily similar... despite the unborn being obviously human and even knowing they have separate and unique DNA sequences that separate them from the mother, those who promote abortion refuse to accept that they are, indeed, human beings. Just like the slavers of old refused to accept that black slaves were as human as they were.

The more things change, the more they stay the same. Only now, instead of working them for the sole benefit of not dying, we just kill them off because they're inconvenient.

TheRedneck

Hi JagStorm, great, thought provoking question.

I have some instances to share that are relevant.

One involves a guy who graduated from the same grade school. He found out that he had a 16 year old daughter when he was about 45. My understanding, through the grapevine, is that he was getting to know her. I believe it may have been a saving grace for him. He never married. I know one of his girlfriends had an abortion. Also, a side note, his mother left her body when he was about 17. Karma is so...interesting. I don't know how it progressed but I hope he has grandchildren...as a career, he worked at a zoo😁🐅🐘🦘🦌🦜

The next is much more personal. Somehow, after reading an article about the first abortions in the US, NY specifically, in Cosmo mag, printed early 1980s, I pieced together the unfortunate fact that my mother had an abortion between sib three and four. I have heard this in other families before while my Aunt is Mormon and had as many children as her poor body could put out despite c-sections and warnings.

About the article; service included airfare, limo service, overnight accommodations. I remember my mother being gone for one night, it was very strange. But, the person most affected was sib 4. While sitting in a restaurant waiting for mother with aunt and sib 4, I said something about the abortion. My aunt's eyeballs almost popped out as she exclaimed, "how did you know about that?" and sib 4 blurted out, "wait, mom had an abortion before me!?" She was distressed. Not one of my more diplomatic moments.

I knew of a couple of girls who got pregnant very early - senior year - to "catch" a guy. I had more than one abortion with the first sex "boyfriend." He was pretty cold hearted. It would have been nice if my parents would have looked after me, but alas, this is the karma.

Humanity has a ways to go and there's no reason we can't evolve to a place where life is sacred and sex is also considered something more then a bang, booty call or hook up. I'm thinking mothers have the power to get this ship upright but it's going to come with a lot of sea sickness, maybe a few folks flung overboard.

There are natural ways to induce miscarriage and herbs to heal the body. Big pharma has taken all medical knowledge, and power, away from women. Whether witches, shaman or healers, anyone with women's knowledge has been demeaned for about 70 years and remedies replaced by pharmaceuticals. The myth of the modern woman, the woman who lives in the more populated cities in the US, is such a small portion of the population yet most women on this plane of existence, live a much more meager existence. TPTB have destroyed family values with the flow of propaganda oozing from LA and NY.

In my opinion, women must return to their senses. Where there are women, there is civilization. The wild west was softened by the women who ventured west. Man prefers to be rather uncivil but will get cleaned up for women if we're nice to them. Women who are strong with a sweet demeanor are few and far between in my observation. There's an awful lot of whining, cattiness, drama-loving, attention needing, selfishness among the females of our kind and it's disrupting the species.

I don't think abortion should be legal. My life would have been very different with children, much harder - especially if the ectopic pregnancies had been healthy...i'd of had a baseball team, ha... My mom took me for the first one, put me on the pill and never said another word to me about much. She had me when she was 18 and she has been resentful ever since. Karma, I'm not supposed to have a fabulous mother but any children likely would not have made it either, as likelihood of miscarriage increased and was high from the get go due to life style; there was a lot of drinking going on. Thank the good Lord, I am sane and in one piece.

Hope you find this interesting.

originally posted by: TheRedneck
Strange... according to the title of the thread, the topic is "How Many men Have No Clue?"

Exactly. You were not following the conversation I was having when you interjected.

originally posted by: Quadrivium
You are so stuck on 'being human' that you fail to realize what a human being actually is.

I agree with the Constitution. Don't you? Why don't you like it?

originally posted by: TheRedneck
The only answer I have is to a question I did not ask.

I answered it in the other thread in a conversation we have a few weeks ago, if you forgot already reread the thread.

I know getting my DNA results showed me I was not from the ancestry I thought I was, but that is neither here nor there.

The fact of the matter is that the girls/women had to shoulder the burden themselves and did so within their human and legal rights. Who thinks others have the right to make that difficult and life-altering decision for that person? God is the only one to judge - not any of us. It stands to reason that young men starting out in life (young pregnant girls too) would not have the where-with-all nor means to raise and support a child - finding out later in life that they fathered a child and most likely being life-seasoned and well established, well that's a whole other scenario.

Bringing up a child is one of the most difficult jobs of all and many will fail at it in many ways without the right help.

I am not a U.S. citizen and, yes, other countries do think the removing the human rights of women is backward and still the services and programs in your country are still lacking for women should they want to bring a child into the world - solo. If women had the right supports to carry a child to term and affordable housing and childcare thereafter, while still pursuing their education and/or life's dreams, I am positive most women would not choose abortion. But there are no such supports and women's basic human rights are stripped away at the whim of those that have their own agenda.

Your country is experiencing low birth rates and that will spell trouble in the future, it's time we all around the world make sweeping changes for the better of humanity and that includes most of all women and children's needs. We all prosper when all of us prosper.

originally posted by: AugustusMasonicus

originally posted by: Quadrivium
You are so stuck on 'being human' that you fail to realize what a human being actually is.

I agree with the Constitution. Don't you? Why don't you like it?

You agree with the constitution and deny science because you think in backs up your "scumbaggery".

The problem with so many people (like you) is that they fail to understand the Constitution does not give/grant rights.
It was written to protect our natural rights.....from an over reaching government and others that would infringe on those rights.
Human rights transcend the Constitution.
The first of which is the right to life.
Without that first right, all others are meaningless.

"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness".

a reply to: Quadrivium

Isn't the pursuit of happiness and liberty in the constitution too? But not for women it appears.

originally posted by: Quadrivium
You agree with the constitution...

Yes, yes I do. You keep trying to butter your bread on both sides. The Supreme Court ruled on this matter and I don't disagree with them because I agree with the Constitution. If you don't like the Constitution that's on you.

originally posted by: AugustusMasonicus

originally posted by: Quadrivium
You agree with the constitution...

Yes, yes I do. You keep trying to butter your bread on both sides. The Supreme Court ruled on this matter and I don't disagree with them because I agree with the Constitution. If you don't like the Constitution that's on you.

You left out:

and deny science because you think in backs up your "scumbaggery".[/qoute]

originally posted by: quintessentone
a reply to: Quadrivium

Isn't the pursuit of happiness and liberty in the constitution too? But not for women it appears.

Of course it does. Why do you think it does't?

originally posted by: Quadrivium
...and deny science...

There's no science denial, there's only your Constitution denial since you didn't even know it actually described the definition of a citizen.

"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness".

That's the Declaration of Independence, bro. FFS, you don't know your Founding Documents at all.

a reply to: AugustusMasonicus

There's no science denial, there's only your Constitution denial since you didn't even know it actually described the definition of a citizen.

You can't be serious..
I knew the exact wording and I knew exactly what you were referring to. You don't read or seriously lack reading comprehension skills.
You said it mentioned "Human Beings". I told you that the term "Human being" was not in the wording of the constitution.
The only way to make some people see is to let them see they are wrong on their own. BUT, you don't.....
Even with your very first comment to me on this thread, you were confusing 'being human' with 'human being'.
I have let you go on for pages and pages and you still don't see it.
Remember all those comments about your reading comprehension?
That's what I was referring to.

That's the Declaration of Independence, bro. FFS, you don't know your Founding Documents at all.

Something is seriously wrong with your brain.....
Did I say I was quoting the Constitution?
I was talking about Human rights and how they Transcend the constitution.