Statements from civilians in Popasnaya-Bakhmut-Luhhansk, Ukraine

a reply to: Grimpachi

In fact, one has stated openly that he is here just to shut down conversation that isn't pro-Ukraine.

So who's that now?

originally posted by: Grimpachi
a reply to: Oldcarpy2

No, that is how I feel about 1 maybe 2 people. People who "NEVER" watch the videos or address the content of the OP.

In fact, one has stated openly that he is here just to shut down conversation that isn't pro-Ukraine.

There are a fair amount of trolls as well but they will at least discuss the subject matter to a degree.

No.

One person is providing a rebuttal from reality every time you post fake russian propaganda videos or make absurd russian propaganda claims.

While you are just upset cuz your russian propaganda videos are repeatedly debunked, most recently by tass airing an editing error that included lancaster faking an 'under fire' scene.

Does no one find it odd that the label propaganda has become an unquestionable statement of fact?

What does propaganda mean to each person? Does it mean false, lie, skewed, or something else?

When the US government says they have reason to believe that there are mass graves in Mariupol from satellite images. The same satellite that was used to detect IEDs buried in Afghanistan dirt roads. Then that news is spread on every major network as if it is fact.

Does that qualify as propaganda?

originally posted by: Grimpachi
Does no one find it odd that the label propaganda has become an unquestionable statement of fact?

What does propaganda mean to each person? Does it mean false, lie, skewed, or something else?

When the US government says they have reason to believe that there are mass graves in Mariupol from satellite images. The same satellite image that was used to detect IEDs buried in Afghanistan dirt roads. Then that news is spread on every major network as if it is fact.

Does that qualify as propaganda?

Are you trying to claim that we can't clearly see the freshly dug dirt?

Are you unaware that we can watch russians filling those holes with bodies from far away?

Are you unaware that the same holes dug in areas where russian forces have been defeated have already been dug up and international groups found they were filled with handcuffed civilians who were shot in the back of the head?



What kind of absurd claim are you even trying to make?

That we don't find every hole fast enough?

a reply to: PatriotGames4u

Are you trying to claim that we can't clearly see the freshly dug dirt?

No. The very opposite of that claim. I have read that our satellites can determine even minute changes in topography down to a centimeter.

To be very clear, what I am saying is our government would absolutely be able to determine if there were mass graves.

The term mass grave has been defined. There is specific imagery people recall when the term is used.

When you look up the term mass grave this is one of the first things you will see.







Eva Bartlett is a Canadian independent journalist. She has spent years on the ground covering conflict zones in the Middle East, especially in Syria and Palestine.

This is her report on the "mass grave" site.

a reply to: Grimpachi


We take constant measurements of some locations down to a small fraction of a millimeter, but we obviously don't constantly measure every grain of dirt on the planet.

We also haven't published any of our government's high resolution satelite imagery, or even publicly discussed what they show, though there are some low res commercial images available online.



Now, you wanna discuss all those handcuffed civilians that Amnesty International. Red Cross, Doctors Without Borders, and other international groups have found in those russian holes, each with a hole in their head?

a reply to: PatriotGames4u

Are you claiming the term mass grave and the claim mass graves were dug isn't a lie? Ar you claiming it wasn't propaganda?

originally posted by: Grimpachi
a reply to: PatriotGames4u

Are you claiming the term mass grave and the claim mass graves were dug isn't a lie? Ar you claiming it wasn't propaganda?

I don't understand your phrasing.

There are many proven mass graves in Ukraine.

Some were already well known as locations where Ukraine buried civilians killed by russians, and others were discovered after russia was beaten back from areas they had previously occupied.

Those holes almost exclusively contained hand cuffed civilians with newly ventilated skulls.

a reply to: PatriotGames4u

I will be absolutely clear.

Are you claiming that the cemetery where people are being respectfully buried with markers is a mass grave?

Let's start there.

Also here is an excerpt from the Washington Post on the very site the video was taken.

The Mariupol City Council said in a statement on Telegram that officials believe up to 9,000 civilians could be buried in the mass grave, where authorities said Russians forces “dug new trenches and filled them with corpses every day throughout April.”

www.washingtonpost.com...

originally posted by: Grimpachi
a reply to: PatriotGames4u

I will be absolutely clear.

Are you claiming that the cemetery where people are being respectfully buried with markers is a mass grave?

Let's start there.

Also here is an excerpt from the Washington Post on the very site the video was taken.

The Mariupol City Council said in a statement on Telegram that officials believe up to 9,000 civilians could be buried in the mass grave, where authorities said Russians forces “dug new trenches and filled them with corpses every day throughout April.”

www.washingtonpost.com...

There are many locations where folks are discussing mass graves, and I already made clear that not all mass graves are the same.



Now, you wanna discuss all those handcuffed civilians that Amnesty International. Red Cross, Doctors Without Borders, and other international groups have found in those russian holes, each with a hole in their head?

a reply to: Grimpachi

Does no one find it odd that the label propaganda has become an unquestionable statement of fact?

Its worked well for the past 6 years or so.
Laptops
Diaries
Kenosha kid
Covington kids
Smollett
Etc etc.

What does propaganda mean to each person? Does it mean false, lie, skewed, or something else?

The current definition works for me.

2: the spreading of ideas, information, or rumor for the purpose of helping or injuring an institution, a cause, or a person

3: ideas, facts, or allegations spread deliberately to further one's cause or to damage an opposing cause

Using the "fog of war" to spend billions protecting a corrupt cesspool thats also an elites piggybank, is f'ed up.

a reply to: JinMI

I 100% agree with the definitions you supplied.

Unfortunately, I think most people on here think the term propaganda is interchangeable with lie.

a reply to: Grimpachi

Well, some of us arent here to push agendas.

Some of us here are wanting facts as we alwqys have.

Even the uncomfortable ones.

Im not sure why there is this concerted effort to silence any conflicting information from the MSM narrative.

originally posted by: Grimpachi
a reply to: JinMI

I 100% agree with the definitions you supplied.

Unfortunately, I think most people on here think the term propaganda is interchangeable with lie.

So you think 'propaganda' is 'truthful'?

Splains a lot.



Was the weapons lab propaganda truthful?

Was the nuke factory propaganda truthful?

Is russia's KIA count propaganda 'truthful'?



Want me to go on?

originally posted by: JinMI
a reply to: Grimpachi

Well, some of us arent here to push agendas.

Some of us here are wanting facts as we alwqys have.

Even the uncomfortable ones.

Im not sure why there is this concerted effort to silence any conflicting information from the MSM narrative.

Because many of those 'conflicting' 'reports' contain absolute lies poorly disguised as propaganda.

Or are you claiming that russia found those imaginary weapons labs?

a reply to: PatriotGames4u

Why should I answer you on any of those?

You will not even admit to an easy one about the claim of about the mass grave.

Deny Ignorance

a reply to: JinMI

It has been years in the making. Russian bots determining the election. Russsian hacking. Russia and specifically Putin has become the boogie man.

Then there is the fear some people have that their country will be next. They are afraid so they are perfectly fine nazis fighting for them. They will support the nazis or look the other way and deny their role.

About a month or two before the war there were 15 neo nazis protesting on the side of the road in my state.

That was national news. They ran the story right up to the war with all kinds of articles about how the country is infested with white nationalist and nazis. The governor was a white nationalist because he didn't denounce them enough. It was a circus.

But they are very quiet about NAzi organizations in Ukraine being armed and trained for years by our government, They call them heroes. All of the sudden in the US the stories about white nationalists and nazis went away.

It is surreal.

originally posted by: Grimpachi
a reply to: PatriotGames4u

Why should I answer you on any of those?

You will not even admit to an easy one about the claim of about the mass grave.

Deny Ignorance

What didn't I answer?

Mass graves can exist due to many different reasons.

Meanwhile ...


Now, you wanna discuss all those handcuffed civilians that Amnesty International. Red Cross, Doctors Without Borders, and other international groups have found in those russian holes, each with a hole in their head?

a reply to: Grimpachi

The conditioning and dumbing down has worked well.

So well that a derivation from the tactic would be foolish.