300 million year old pot found in coal

a reply to: Akragon

This is true, but an old oops artifacts find. Thank you

a reply to: Akragon

I found a couple of web pages that discuss this:
Iron Cup from Wilberton, Oklahoma
Alleged Iron Pot in Coal
It was supposedly found in 1912, but the first written witness account wasn't made until 1948.

As to the aspect of the account which could invalidate it even if the workers were not intentionally lying, let us consider the following. In a mining environment, it is common to find puddles saturated with particles of whatever material was being mined. If a man-made object falls into such a sediment-laden slurry, the sediment will often consolidate around it. Over a period of years this sediment can dry and harden considerably, forming a concretion like structure resembling a piece of the original formation.

As noted by Mark Isaac: "The cup appears to be cast iron, and cast iron technology began in the eighteenth century. Its design is much like pots used to hold molten metals and may have been used by a tinsmith, tinker, or person casting bullets... The cup was likely dropped by a worker either inside a coal mine or in a mine's surface workings. Mineralization is common in the coal and surrounding debris of coal mines because rainwater reacts with the newly exposed minerals and produces highly mineralized solutions. Coal, sediments, and rocks are commonly cemented together in just a few years. It could easily appear that a pot cemented in such a concretion could appear superficially as if it were encased in the original coal. Or small pieces of coal, including powder, could have been recompressed around the cup by weight (Isaac, 2005).

Thus, a person who broke open such a nodule might mistakenly conclude that it was part of the host formation, rather than a secondary product of the mining environment. This phenomena has been documented with objects as modern as soda bottles and World War II artifacts (Al-Aga, 1995; McKusick and Shinn, 1980), and thus cannot be used as anti-evolutionary evidence. One might object that we do not know that this was the case in regards to the iron pot in question. True, but more importantly, we don't know that it wasn't. In short, even if the workers were telling the truth as far as they knew it, we have no reliable evidence that the pot was actually part of the original coal formation.

a reply to: Klassified

The point is there is no need to explain it as it is not and can't be verified. It's like me telling you I was teleported to Mars, could breathe the air, and met Martians. Explain that if what they say about Mars is true?

It makes some people twist themselves into knots to explain it away.

The explanation is the same, it didn't happen. I didn't go to Mars, and that pot has not been there 300 million years. The need for an explanation is only as strong as the evidence. There is zero evidence, so zero need for explanations, no one will be twisting into a knot over this one. I have yet to see a single case of any oopart that stood up to scrutiny.

a reply to: Akragon

From the research of Michael Cremo

600 Mil BC (Other) – The presence of artistic metalwork in North America. (A bell shaped metallic vessel broken in two parts came from inside a blown-up rock of this age at Meeting House Hill, Boston-Dorchester area now called the Roxbury conglomerate)

320-260 Mil BC (estimated) (Other) – A small eight-carat gold chain about ten inches in length of skilled workmanship was found naturally imbedded inside a lump of Carboniferous coal from this age in Morrisonville, Illinois State, USA

65 Mil BC (Other) – Modern human footprint found amongst dinosaur prints at Poloski River excavations, Glenrose, Texas (rock art of humans and dinosaurs together were also found in Peru but the site was not dated)

55-2 Mil BC (Other) – Multiple suppressed evidence of modern human life from bones/skeletons, footprints, tools and spear points of which some are to sophisticated to be made by Lucy, Australopithecus, Homo Habilis and/or ape men (fossilized footprints at Laetoli, Tanzania – Sling and bola stones with a level of technological sophistication universally associated with modern Homo sapiens at Bramford near Ipswich, England – A modern human jaw, fossil human skull, tools, a small oval tablet of dark-colored slate with a melon and leaf carved on it and many more items in Table Mountain mines, Califoria – A nail embedded in a block of sandstone from the Kingoodie (Mylnfield) Quarry in Scotland – and plenty more )

5 Mil BC (Other) – Human artefacts was found in a deep gravel mine amongst gravel layers of around/or before this age in Oregon, USA

3 Mil BC (Other) – There were supposed to have been a great civilisation in which people were happier, taller, and got much older than today (Hindu literature not accepted by science)

2Mil BC (Other) – A small female human figure, skilfully formed in clay, was found in Nampa, Idaho at a depth of 320feet from a well while drilling. In the lower portion of the stratum from the Plio-Pleistocene boundary there were evidences of a buried land surface, over which there had been a slight accumulation of vegetable mould. It was from this point that the image in question came

1,840 Mil BC (Other) – A fossilized modern (Homo Sapiens) humanise finger bone was found at Alduvai Gorge, Tanzania (this is explained by science as “can’t be, must be some unidentified primate because it’s too old and humans didn’t exist at that time”)

900,000 BC (Other) – Human (Eskimo) footprints (but called “homo antrasis”) found on beach of Hapiesburg, east coast of England

So mankind was running around for over 299,995,000 without the wheel? So this is man's evolution?

It took over 299,995,000 years for the horse and buggy?

That makes man EXTREMELY DUMB!

This would make man to be at the bottom of the food chain, would it not?

Some people will do ANYTHING or say anything to get others to stop believing in God.

75% of this planet took an experimental drug and believe it to be a vaccine.

Yea, I guess mankind must be dumb....Monkey see....monkey do...

So I guess you come from a monkey......

I don't.....




a reply to: Akragon

a reply to: DeathSlayer

Yes most of man kind is dumb... i mean there are people that believe the earth is flat and that we came from monkeys

i think that speaks for itself

Yet in the last 250 years we went from horse and buggy, train, cars and planes, land on the moon....but sit on our ass for 299,999,750 years on our ass?

I don't buy it.....technology within 200 years ....yet mankind was around for 300 million years?

I am calling BS....


a reply to: Akragon

There probably have been many more advanced civilizations on this world over the last hundreds of millions of years. Most metal things probably got turned to crystal and break apart. This one made it. There were other things found buried way down in the coal too, for some reason the coal seems to preserve metal things.

I am sure that metal things found over the millenniums were melted down to make tools or weapons, a surf might also turn one into a knife or just use a pot found buried or in a cave. To believe that modern humans were the only intelligent beings on this planet since it was formed is idiotic, heck, teenage kids seventy years ago weren't really that much different than kids today. I was fooled into believing in the generation gap, but once I got in my forties and started talking about things with my uncles and older friends, I found that not much had changed, hormones drove society of the young back then just like today.

a reply to: Akragon

Who’s timeline, who said it takes 300 million years for coal to form. Date the rocks by the fossils and fossils by the rocks, circular reasoning

secularmoralatheist.wordpress.com...

This isn’t a recent discovery

a reply to: Raggedyman

its pretty much a consensus across the board...

approx 300 million years give or take...

but what do i know

a reply to: Akragon

The sleeping prophet edgar cayce believed humanity was millions of years old.

a reply to: Akragon

300 million year old pot found in coal

Wouldn't that be "pout found in 300 million year old coal"?

The coal might have formed long ago, but the pot could have become embedded in any later point - it's coal, not solid granit, and it has been on the move literally since its formation.

a reply to: Akragon

....i mean there are people that believe the earth is flat and that we came from monkeys

Just for clarity - and not that I'm going to derail the thread by discussing it here - are you liking flat earthers and adherents to the Theory of Evolution together?
I've always got the impression that most flat earthers are also Creationists....maybe I'm wrong?

a reply to: Freeborn

No i added that last bit just for the poster i was replying to...

Flat earthers are in their own class... but ya all of them are Creationists... mostly young earth

which is why they're always on about the "firmament"

a reply to: Akragon

Thanks for the clarification....I really should have known better than to think you might have been.

Ooparts are fascinating.
I'm sure some are just frauds of one sort or another.
I'm also certain that there are perfectly reasonable explanations for other examples.
But then there's those that just don't appear to have any rational explanation that fits in with our current understanding of things....we still have much to learn.

a reply to: Freeborn

im actually inclined to believe pthena's post... 300 million years old?

while far fetched, i think pretty much anything is possible... and in any case very very cool

i personally don't believe we're the only advanced civilization/species that has lived on this planet... when you look at megalithic structures all around the world that we can't recreate... i just don't find it possible

some say they're just lost technologies... but i don't buy it for a second

this particular item found in coal, IF real... would destroy the current time line of intelligent species on this planet... even IF its from a past iron age

but who knows...

a reply to: Akragon

I'm calling hoax on this one.

Coal forms under intense heat and pressure. No way that pot would survive that.

At best it would be crushed into a hunk of metal.

Nothing man made would remotely resemble its former self after that amount of time. Even stone tools.

originally posted by: rickymouse
There probably have been many more advanced civilizations on this world over the last hundreds of millions of years. Most metal things probably got turned to crystal and break apart. This one made it. There were other things found buried way down in the coal too, for some reason the coal seems to preserve metal things.

I am sure that metal things found over the millenniums were melted down to make tools or weapons, a surf might also turn one into a knife or just use a pot found buried or in a cave. To believe that modern humans were the only intelligent beings on this planet since it was formed is idiotic, heck, teenage kids seventy years ago weren't really that much different than kids today. I was fooled into believing in the generation gap, but once I got in my forties and started talking about things with my uncles and older friends, I found that not much had changed, hormones drove society of the young back then just like today.

Wouldn’t time travel be a more likely explanation? The pot may only have been there a short amount of time, maybe even only a couple of hundred year.

It could have been teleported there recently, but from another time.

originally posted by: AaarghZombies
a reply to: Akragon

I'm calling hoax on this one.

Coal forms under intense heat and pressure. No way that pot would survive that.

At best it would be crushed into a hunk of metal.

Nothing man made would remotely resemble its former self after that amount of time. Even stone tools.

fair enough...

Im not so sure... iron is pretty strong, and coal was originally organic matter

Im more inclined to believe its a mistake rather then a hoax...

but it could be real... who knows

time travel though... i just don't believe thats possible

originally posted by: Akragon

originally posted by: AaarghZombies
a reply to: Akragon

I'm calling hoax on this one.

Coal forms under intense heat and pressure. No way that pot would survive that.

At best it would be crushed into a hunk of metal.

Nothing man made would remotely resemble its former self after that amount of time. Even stone tools.

fair enough...

Im not so sure... iron is pretty strong, and coal was originally organic matter

Im more inclined to believe its a mistake rather then a hoax...

but it could be real... who knows

time travel though... i just don't believe thats possible

The kind of pressure at that depth is enough to turn a laptop into a laminated sheet a couple of mm thick. And it's hot enough to melt iron.