Supreme Court Justice Sonia Sotomayor says a FETUS is the same as a BRAIN-DEAD Person.

a reply to: DBCowboy

If you have a houseguest in your home eating you out of house and home, leaving holes in your walls, annoying neighbors to the point where you are getting nightly visits from the cops....
Do you think your right to protect your property superceded their right to live there? Would you really even care much if he had another place to go?

Well, it is the women's body that is giving shelter to the baby, she should have just as much right to protect her bodily integrity especially if the pregnancy is doing life long damage to it... to say otherwise is slavery!!

a reply to: mamabeth

There is more black babies aborted because there is more poverty in the black community.

originally posted by: mamabeth
a reply to: Ghostsdogood

If her brain was injured and she had a chance for recovery,
that is a different story.Her brain was gone,only a small part
was still alive,she wasn't coming back.
I don't think the member I was replying to really understood
what he was spewing.Thank-you for your kind words.

I'm not sure I understand the details either.

And have no need to.

I already know that it's not ok to say things like that, especially when an ATS family member is already experiencing so much pain.

I also doubt that any user intentionally said anything hurtful to you today.

At least I hope not.

TIL Pregnancy to term is slavery.


Anything to degrade babies into guilt free tumors

originally posted by: dawnstar
a reply to: mamabeth

There is more black babies aborted because there is more poverty in the black community.

Are you speaking for all black mothers?

Do you think that is appropriate?

I don't.

I also don't think your claim is factually accurate, but not going to debate a post as stupid and offensive as this one.

a reply to: Ghostsdogood


So Do Not View It . Others Might be Interested in it's Intellectual Commentary Pertaining to this Threads Topic that is Obviously Over your Head............

a reply to: mamabeth

How do you balance the rights of the mother and the rights of the life she is harboring within her when their interests conflict? They have already stripped some women of liberty as I previously pointed out.
They have already stripped her right to decided the kind of healthcare she gets, allowed surgeries she didn't want to be done on her... killed one matter of fact so that women had her right to life stripped from her... and, in the end, the baby didn't survive either..

If you want to say women don't have these constitutional rights, go on and say it.. but, no one will because it is better to strip those imaginary rights away slowly, so no one notices too soon.

a reply to: Ghostsdogood
Ok...
There is more poverty in black communities...
Could there be a link between that and the fact that they opt for abortions more often?
If so, maybe trying to address the lack of healthcare, the lack of adequate food, maybe address the problems the poverty presents might be more productive than just eliminating their access to abortion?

originally posted by: Imperator2

originally posted by: mamabeth
I am a mother of a woman recently declared brain dead.
After several strokes and seizures, she was left with very
little brain activity.We were told that she would never wake
up again.
I don't remember how soon after conception that an unborn
baby has brain waves and a heartbeat.I do know that medical
professionals use brain waves and heartbeats to determine if
a patient is still alive.
I will ask this... is there any real difference here between the two?

www.healthline.com...#:~:text=Hearing%20a%20baby's%20heartbeat%20for,to%206%20weeks%20after%20 gestation.

You can detect a heart beat at as low as 5 weeks. Which is why many states want to add in a heart beat law / protection for the unborn.

A heartbeat is an absolutely meaningless question.

You can induce a heartbeat to a cadaver by giving it a pace maker.

You can also install an artificial heart to an adult while they are alive. So if "heartbeat" = alive and has rights, some people you work with might not be considered "people" by that standard.

originally posted by: Sookiechacha
a reply to: Imperator2

Do you believe that actions have consequences and that people should take responsibility for their actions - even limited responsibility?

Do you believe that children are a punishment for having sex? If women who find themselves in a position of having an unwanted pregnancy are irresponsible people, why do you think they should be forced into parenthood? Do you think that their sense of responsibility will somehow kick in if they're forced into parenthood?

Why don't you see a woman opting for an abortion as a woman taking responsibility for their actions, and making the responsible choice NOT to become a parent.

Agreed! Indeed it is a "punishment for having sex".

But the person being punished isn't the adult. It's the child who comes into the world unwanted.

originally posted by: marg6043
The whole legislation on women body parts in this instance the uterus as a vessel of procreation is a way of control, nobody should be legislating over any human body parts, but for some reason is some hell bound on one specific body part and that is the reproductive organs of females.

No of males but females, is ridiculous that an uterus should be debated in a court of law and even making laws on it.

If you do not want abortions do not have one, is your choice is your body, mind your own business.

I really do not give a crap what a women does with her private parts or a male for the same reason, is not my business.

This have never been about fetuses or babies is always been about control of human parts and it will not end with this court clown circus is will become more than that.

And banning abortions will not stop them either, but will put more women at risk of dead.

If we're talking about after 21 weeks, when the fetus has a mind, then the woman's "right to choose" about her body now runs into conflict with the fetus' "right to choose" about its body.

If it has a mind, it very likely also has a preference about what should happen to its body.

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04
a reply to: carewemust

Can you terminate a brain dead person that you know will have a full return of brain function starting within months?

A person who once had cognition, but doesn't now, but will later?

At the last moment they were cognitive, they probably had a preference about how their body should be treated, right?

So destroying their body would run against the wishes of a cognitive individual, about how they want their body treated, right?


A fetus prior to 21 weeks, however, has never formed a thought in its entire existence. Consequently has not formed any preferences about how its body should be treated, or whether it wants to be born.

No victim. No crime.

originally posted by: dawnstar
a reply to: DBCowboy

If you have a houseguest in your home eating you out of house and home, leaving holes in your walls, annoying neighbors to the point where you are getting nightly visits from the cops....
Do you think your right to protect your property superceded their right to live there? Would you really even care much if he had another place to go?

Well, it is the women's body that is giving shelter to the baby, she should have just as much right to protect her bodily integrity especially if the pregnancy is doing life long damage to it... to say otherwise is slavery!!

I don't have the right to end the life of any individual that annoys me.

originally posted by: dawnstar
a reply to: mamabeth

There is more black babies aborted because there is more poverty in the black community.

The lefts position is that we can open our borders and allow millions into our country to use our system to their benefit.

Your argument on poverty is invalid.

originally posted by: Zanti Misfit
a reply to: Ghostsdogood


So Do Not View It . Others Might be Interested in it's Intellectual Commentary Pertaining to this Threads Topic that is Obviously Over your Head............

I didn't view it, as you suggested.

And also ridiculed your belief that any kind of cartoon would be appropriate in this discussion.

Also my choice.

Apparently that annoyed you for some reason?

a reply to: bloodymarvelous

Good point, if kids can determine their own gender, then they should be able to choose life.

"A fetus/newborn deciding anything?!" You say?

Its the same as a 5 year old deciding on puberty blockers, they have no concept or ability to express any opinion on the matter.

Youre rights end when someone else's begins.

a reply to: carewemust

Did you forget to quote the conclusion of her statement? Someone suggested that response to stimulus proves that a fetus is a human. The judge disagrees.

So I don't think that a response to -[stimulus]- by a fetus necessarily proves that there's a sensation of pain or that there's consciousness."

a reply to: DBCowboy

You kick them out to face the cruel winter cold... they froze to death...

Women decides she doesn't want to be pregnant anymore at 15 weeks, she has labor induced and the baby is delivered alive but soon dies...

Both are having their property damaged by the unwanted guest...
So, what is the difference?

originally posted by: dawnstar
a reply to: mamabeth

How do you balance the rights of the mother and the rights of the life she is harboring within her when their interests conflict? They have already stripped some women of liberty as I previously pointed out.
They have already stripped her right to decided the kind of healthcare she gets, allowed surgeries she didn't want to be done on her... killed one matter of fact so that women had her right to life stripped from her... and, in the end, the baby didn't survive either..

If you want to say women don't have these constitutional rights, go on and say it.. but, no one will because it is better to strip those imaginary rights away slowly, so no one notices too soon.

Your first and last parts are pretty good.

I'll just ignore the mushy middle.



NOBODY is trying to take rights away from any mother.

The ONLY issue at hand is the point at which a baby has those same rights.

a reply to: Ghostsdogood

The poverty rate among the Black population is about twice the national average. Meanwhile, 61% of unintended pregnancies end in abortion and those below the poverty line are three times more likely to have an unintended pregnancy than someone in the middle class.

In fact, those below the poverty line account for nearly 50% of all abortions.

originally posted by: dawnstar
a reply to: DBCowboy

If you have a houseguest in your home eating you out of house and home, leaving holes in your walls, annoying neighbors to the point where you are getting nightly visits from the cops....
Do you think your right to protect your property superceded their right to live there? Would you really even care much if he had another place to go?

Well, it is the women's body that is giving shelter to the baby, she should have just as much right to protect her bodily integrity especially if the pregnancy is doing life long damage to it... to say otherwise is slavery!!

In most states there are rules about eviction. Especially early eviction.

If you agreed to let someone stay in your home for 9 months, such as by a lease, you aren't allowed to simply change your mind. Their right as a tenant will, in that case supercede your right as a land owner.

Unless the fetus' behavior falls outside the expected range of tenants of their sort, even the "holes in the walls" thing would be irrelevant.

In cases of medical danger, abortion laws usually have exceptions made.

a reply to: dawnstar


Planned parenthood was started

I just got a call,my mom just passed away.

a reply to: DBCowboy

And, the rights position is that we can separate the kids from the parents, lose them, and just keep them to adopt, or abuse, god only knows why they wanted those kids so badly.