The Ancient Egyptian Stones Were Perfectly Precise How is this Possible? Many Qs Little Answers

originally posted by: AlanBChrist
a reply to: Harte

To your frist question the answer is YES
To answer the next question were you state that you know severial different methods that would work
Well then tell us how one of these methods of construction could build a structre such as the great pyramid

You tell us how to get the mutipal ropes out from under the 20 or 30 blocks that are present in the
lower leves of the grand gallywalls ,. While being stacked on top of several other block
that form the walls at a 26 degree angle Remember this has to be done with no lifts or pulleys or
wheel and axle in other word no machines

This simlpe qestion will tell you if a method will work .
that is why the other methods never ask
The DDC can answer that question ,. but tell us your answer frist

Multiple exterior spiral ramps will work, as well as a single interior spiral ramp.
Regarding the exterior ramps, this has been studied by a world renowned engineering firm.
www.ekt.bme.hu...

Regarding ropes, tell us why you think ropes need to go under a stone being moved? Sounds crazy to me.

The Grand Gallery is itself a ramp. The theory is that this ramp was used to haul some of the stones (and the largest stones - granite ceilings in the relieving chambers above the King's Chamber) into place. Counterweights on the opposite side would have helped.

People that haven't first decided it can't be done that way (you know, like you,) have studied these methods and found them to be sufficient.

It is an established fact that ramps were used to build pyramids. Remains of ramps are be found at Giza and other pyramid sites. Some of these ramps still exist leading up the pyramids - they were integrated into the final design of a couple of Egyptian pyramids.

Harte

a reply to: Harte

Once again you are claiming to these kind of ramps will work . study long , study wrong,,.
Not one of the studies include the ability to build any of the chambers or grand gallery,.
this is becouse the know that there method would fall short so they simply avoid it all together
So there just blowing a lot of smoke ,.much like yourself

The reply on the ropes isn't is this ,,. Lift one end of a 30 ton block 26 degree
using your method of construction without putting a rope under it

The rest of your reply is just BLAA BLAA BLAA ,. YOU have not told us how to build what
will work You have sim;lpy reverted back to what was built

If you have ever taken a coke can and filled it with sand it becomes very hard
to crush yet you can poor the sand out like water. this is a part of how the grand gallery is built

The DDC is correct..

originally posted by: AlanBChrist
a reply to: Harte

Once again you are claiming to these kind of ramps will work . study long , study wrong,,.
Not one of the studies include the ability to build any of the chambers or grand gallery,.
this is becouse the know that there method would fall short so they simply avoid it all together
So there just blowing a lot of smoke ,.much like yourself

The reply on the ropes isn't is this ,,. Lift one end of a 30 ton block 26 degree
using your method of construction without putting a rope under it

The rest of your reply is just BLAA BLAA BLAA ,. YOU have not told us how to build what
will work You have sim;lpy reverted back to what was built

If you have ever taken a coke can and filled it with sand it becomes very hard
to crush yet you can poor the sand out like water. this is a part of how the grand gallery is built

The DDC is correct..

You are contradicting one of the largest and most successful Construction Engineering firms in the history of the world.
Guess who sane people will believe?

Please state any credentials you may possess which would lend any credibility at all you your hand-waving away an engineering study that you yourself asked for.

In view of the fact that you can't even realize that ropes can go around an object without going under that object, it's difficult to imagine that you might have any success regarding reclaiming your credibility.

Harte

originally posted by: AlanBChrist
a reply to: Hanslune

Yes I just told you were the majority of the qurry was
and yes there is a earth bound foundation care inside the pyramid
that is why I stated that they would have leveled a 1/8 mile area AROUND THE BASE OF THE PYRAMID
I said nothing about the base of the structure it'self

There is not a such a leveled area around the existing pyramids. Have you ever BEEN to Giza?





The ridge line was cut away from behind Khafre's and the second images shows the depth of that cut.

I have also stated that this method is for the FIRST HALF of the pyramid,,now that that is understood take a look at the at the frist picture in your reply ,,. by the way 23% would be a low estiment ,, mor like 35%..
Go to pyramids in the picture and chop off the top half of the structure..and from that point on the page draw a level line WEST to EAST all the way across the page,..
that would be close to the origanal elevation of that small part of the plateau..

However, you are simply making that up. What evidence do you have to support that? Again where is the 300 million tons of rock that was removed, and why would they they take the rock that was left and cut it all it to smaller blocks and then stack it? Doesn't make a lot of sense does it?

Since you can not raise the earth bound core from the elevation of were thje base of the pyramid sits today,.. there is only only one logical way the care would have been built

Say it go on say it,.. thats right by excavating down to the requriered depth in order to leave a large core to build apon

Or just use the ridge line as found incorporate the existing ridge for a small part of the pyramid and dig the rest of the needed frock from plateau no need to move hundreds of millions of rock for no reason.

It will not matter all logical questions can be anwered by the DDC,
PS. Besides everything that you said in your reply,.
only tells me what has BEEN BUILT,, NOT HOW IT WAS BUILT

As noted the "DDC" link doesn't work therefore nothing has been answered by it.

originally posted by: Harte

originally posted by: AlanBChrist
a reply to: Harte

Once again you are claiming to these kind of ramps will work . study long , study wrong,,.
Not one of the studies include the ability to build any of the chambers or grand gallery,.
this is becouse the know that there method would fall short so they simply avoid it all together
So there just blowing a lot of smoke ,.much like yourself

The reply on the ropes isn't is this ,,. Lift one end of a 30 ton block 26 degree
using your method of construction without putting a rope under it

The rest of your reply is just BLAA BLAA BLAA ,. YOU have not told us how to build what
will work You have sim;lpy reverted back to what was built

If you have ever taken a coke can and filled it with sand it becomes very hard
to crush yet you can poor the sand out like water. this is a part of how the grand gallery is built

The DDC is correct..

You are contradicting one of the largest and most successful Construction Engineering firms in the history of the world.
Guess who sane people will believe?

Please state any credentials you may possess which would lend any credibility at all you your hand-waving away an engineering study that you yourself asked for.

In view of the fact that you can't even realize that ropes can go around an object without going under that object, it's difficult to imagine that you might have any success regarding reclaiming your credibility.

Harte

That and the stones were probably placed on a sled and moved to the building site.

These folks in Indonesia seemed to use that sled idea - as did other heavy rock movers in history

i.imgur.com...

i.imgur.com...

i.imgur.com...

i.imgur.com...

etc., moving rocks with ropes on a sled seemed to have worked and was still working up until 1915

originally posted by: Hanslune

originally posted by: Harte

originally posted by: AlanBChrist
a reply to: Harte

Once again you are claiming to these kind of ramps will work . study long , study wrong,,.
Not one of the studies include the ability to build any of the chambers or grand gallery,.
this is becouse the know that there method would fall short so they simply avoid it all together
So there just blowing a lot of smoke ,.much like yourself

The reply on the ropes isn't is this ,,. Lift one end of a 30 ton block 26 degree
using your method of construction without putting a rope under it

The rest of your reply is just BLAA BLAA BLAA ,. YOU have not told us how to build what
will work You have sim;lpy reverted back to what was built

If you have ever taken a coke can and filled it with sand it becomes very hard
to crush yet you can poor the sand out like water. this is a part of how the grand gallery is built

The DDC is correct..

You are contradicting one of the largest and most successful Construction Engineering firms in the history of the world.
Guess who sane people will believe?

Please state any credentials you may possess which would lend any credibility at all you your hand-waving away an engineering study that you yourself asked for.

In view of the fact that you can't even realize that ropes can go around an object without going under that object, it's difficult to imagine that you might have any success regarding reclaiming your credibility.

Harte

That and the stones were probably placed on a sled and moved to the building site.

These folks in Indonesia seemed to use that sled idea - as did other heavy rock movers in history

i.imgur.com...

i.imgur.com...

i.imgur.com...

i.imgur.com...

etc., moving rocks with ropes on a sled seemed to have worked and was still working up until 1915

People still use them, they're called Stone Boats.
www.google.com...

originally posted by: AlanBChrist
a reply to: Byrd

iF A FAMILY IS FARMING A SMALL PATCH OF LAND THEY ARE NOT GOING TO WHASTE THE TOP SOIL TO MAKE MUD BRICKS AND WHAT IS ALWAYS CHANGING THE DESIGN OF THE MUD HUT EVERY 2 MOUNTHS
DO YOU REALY THINK THAT THEY DIDN'T UNDERSTAND THERE OWN VERION OF THE 3 LITTLE PIGS

THE FACT IS YOU CAN OFFER NO OTHER LOGICAL WAYS TO DEAL WITH ANY ISSUE THAT RELATES TO PYRAMID CONSTRUCTION

but that OK keep trying

I think you haven't watched many videos of them making mud brick.

They don't use the fertile top soil. it makes lousy bricks.

www.youtube.com...

They did not use stone.

Here's an archaeological team excavating a mud brick site

originally posted by: AlanBChrist
a reply to: Harte

Remember this has to be done with no lifts or pulleys or
wheel and axle in other word no machines

They had machines -- cranes called shadoufs. In large cities they had very large ones to lift the big and bulky cargo that traveled along the Nile. They also had levers and ramps and hammers and sleds...and they DID have the wheel (but used it for pottery and not transportation since wheels don't run well on sand or mud)

a reply to: Harte

It hard to contradict a enginering firm when I don't know the name of the company
and have never seen anything writen by them I thought you were going to tell us of there findings..

Of course there are more than one firm out there that might come back with a different anser
in pyramid construction which one do you beleive in your chose has nothing to do with credibility
nor how many degrees..becouse they can't all be correct but they could all be wrong

OK class today I will show you how to make a rope tied around a block move
under a block without moving the rope.. you tilt one end of the block. now what angle must the
block be in order to in order to be concidered under the block and not around it anymore
Dont know that don't matter but keep trying...

a reply to: Byrd

Don't forget the ropes.. So how do you use those tools to stack the blocks that make up the grand gallery walls
You use the DDC,.. method.
setting mutible blocks in to place at one time,. with less manpower cutting cost
all the way around

originally posted by: AlanBChrist
a reply to: Harte

It hard to contradict a enginering firm when I don't know the name of the company
and have never seen anything writen by them I thought you were going to tell us of there findings..

Looks like you didn't even read the article I linked.
I'm not surprised.

Harte

originally posted by: Mike27

originally posted by: Hanslune

originally posted by: Harte

originally posted by: AlanBChrist
a reply to: Harte

Once again you are claiming to these kind of ramps will work . study long , study wrong,,.
Not one of the studies include the ability to build any of the chambers or grand gallery,.
this is becouse the know that there method would fall short so they simply avoid it all together
So there just blowing a lot of smoke ,.much like yourself

The reply on the ropes isn't is this ,,. Lift one end of a 30 ton block 26 degree
using your method of construction without putting a rope under it

The rest of your reply is just BLAA BLAA BLAA ,. YOU have not told us how to build what
will work You have sim;lpy reverted back to what was built

If you have ever taken a coke can and filled it with sand it becomes very hard
to crush yet you can poor the sand out like water. this is a part of how the grand gallery is built

The DDC is correct..

You are contradicting one of the largest and most successful Construction Engineering firms in the history of the world.
Guess who sane people will believe?

Please state any credentials you may possess which would lend any credibility at all you your hand-waving away an engineering study that you yourself asked for.

In view of the fact that you can't even realize that ropes can go around an object without going under that object, it's difficult to imagine that you might have any success regarding reclaiming your credibility.

Harte

That and the stones were probably placed on a sled and moved to the building site.

These folks in Indonesia seemed to use that sled idea - as did other heavy rock movers in history

i.imgur.com...

i.imgur.com...

i.imgur.com...

i.imgur.com...

etc., moving rocks with ropes on a sled seemed to have worked and was still working up until 1915

People still use them, they're called Stone Boats.
www.google.com...

Yep, thanks for the reminder and I am waiting for the customary cry about the stone crushing the wood (and a lack of knowledge about wood compression)

originally posted by: Harte

originally posted by: AlanBChrist
a reply to: Harte

To your frist question the answer is YES
To answer the next question were you state that you know severial different methods that would work
Well then tell us how one of these methods of construction could build a structre such as the great pyramid

You tell us how to get the mutipal ropes out from under the 20 or 30 blocks that are present in the
lower leves of the grand gallywalls ,. While being stacked on top of several other block
that form the walls at a 26 degree angle Remember this has to be done with no lifts or pulleys or
wheel and axle in other word no machines

This simlpe qestion will tell you if a method will work .
that is why the other methods never ask
The DDC can answer that question ,. but tell us your answer frist

Multiple exterior spiral ramps will work, as well as a single interior spiral ramp.
Regarding the exterior ramps, this has been studied by a world renowned engineering firm.
www.ekt.bme.hu...

Regarding ropes, tell us why you think ropes need to go under a stone being moved? Sounds crazy to me.

The Grand Gallery is itself a ramp. The theory is that this ramp was used to haul some of the stones (and the largest stones - granite ceilings in the relieving chambers above the King's Chamber) into place. Counterweights on the opposite side would have helped.

People that haven't first decided it can't be done that way (you know, like you,) have studied these methods and found them to be sufficient.

It is an established fact that ramps were used to build pyramids. Remains of ramps are be found at Giza and other pyramid sites. Some of these ramps still exist leading up the pyramids - they were integrated into the final design of a couple of Egyptian pyramids.

Harte

A lot of studies are done that just have odd assumptions. Like the idea they were sliding these stones up a ramp.

It would be easier to just keep tipping it over, and roll it as a block. You know: attach ropes to the top corner, and then pull it onto its side. Then grab the new top corner, and pull it onto its side again.......... etc.

Maybe not "easier", but then the slope of the ramp matters less to the final outcome, and leverage devices can be used, like attaching long poles to the side and pulling from the top of the pole to tip it. Slow going, but less likely to have it start sliding backward down the ramp and hurt someone.

For the 5 ton blocks, I can believe that. For the 80 ton blocks.... it's a bit harder.

a reply to: bloodymarvelous

Howdy BM

Well they might have done it that way. However, what evidence we do have demonstrates that they tended to move stones (on flat ground) by pulling them on sledges. There are remains of ramps at various sites but I would think the constant need to reset the ropes on a 'rumble pull' method might be time consuming. I once moved a four ton (estimate) rock in Cyprus (up to uncover a well we planned to excavate then onto a metal sledge to get it out of the excavation zone as the weight would collapse the walls) pulling on ropes actually works. We didn't have a sufficient strong enough cable long enough to reach a truck outside the site.

One would have to do a experiment with that and measure whether it is more efficient: tumble versus direct pull.




These guys were the last to drag rocks around after thousands of years (1915) they were using direct pull of a rock on a sledge versus tumble but then they weren't going up a ramp (just a slope).

a reply to: bloodymarvelous

It would not matter at all the ramp would be in a contant state of repair an there for useless

But a down ramp would have walls on each side to contain the material used for the ramp
This would compress the ramp making it more durable the more it was used

The DDC knows all

a reply to: Hanslune


The last picture is telling you something,,.

Look at the direction the boat is facing ,. there pulling on the front of the boat
to a leveled area from a ramp ,..a down ramp,. need I say more

The DDC sees all and knows all

a reply to: AlanBChrist

your ramp looks a lot like a lever ....

If you want to develop the down ramp possibility, consider if they built/cut a vertical shaft, filled it with water, and floated the stones to the top. Add some reeds to the top of the stone, letting the stone's own volume be part of the floatation, and it's not too hard to reach a volume/mass ratio that's low enough to float.

Then there is no contradiction taking the stones from near the Pyramids' base, but still moving the stones to a high location and bringing them down.

It seems like a lot of work, though.

.... Also not sure it works for the Granite.

originally posted by: AlanBChrist
a reply to: turbonium1


FIRST you dig a very large hole about 250ft down..
this was more than possible due to the elevation of the plateau was bbout 250ft higher BEFORE the begining
of the pyramid complex..
while doing this you would dig a very large down ramp .

you can now start construction pushing the blocks down the ramp to create the foundation of the structure..
the higher you buid the structure the more you fill in the down ramp .. You would end up back at ground level
right were the reliveing chambers over the kings chambers are finished ..now , a logical sized upramp can be built to get the smaller stones up to the top..

originally posted by: AlanBChrist
a reply to: bloodymarvelous

It would not matter at all the ramp would be in a contant state of repair an there for useless

But a down ramp would have walls on each side to contain the material used for the ramp
This would compress the ramp making it more durable the more it was used

The DDC knows all

I'm thinking that excavating the whole ridge like that would be a *bigger* feat than building the pyramids to begin with.

originally posted by: Byrd

The thing about a tomb, is "perfection" is a mostly aesthetic argument. So anything you want can be "perfect".

When describing a functional use, on the other hand, you are proposing a hypothesis that can be falsified.

Right. So... "pump hypothesis"
* requires watertight channels
-- that's a "nope"
* requires tubes/channels/etc that are a consistent size for the plunger
-- also a "nope"
* requires power
-- no evidence of anything other than human and animal power
* develops from previous models
-- no evidence of pumps before or after
* evidence for continued use and modification of plan (like improving a car design, etc)
-- no evidence in writing or physical evidence of them using pumps anywhere (other than the shadouf)
* evidence by location
-- no pyramids are in villages (where water might be moved) and none in towns. They're all in cemeteries, away from towns, and on the opposite side of the river.
* special titles for the important people on the project (like "mechanic" etc)
-- there are titles for the people who worked the pyramid. There's nothing about water movers or sealers or mechanics.


Evidence for tomb:
* similar architecture in other tombs
-- yes, from the 1st dynasty onward. Khufu's father had 3 pyramids (possibly 4) with variations of the chamber designs and pits and shafts as well as pyramids built afterward. Body parts and bodies have been found in other pyramids.
* evidence for use and modification of the design for the same purpose
-- absolutely. Take a gander at the floor plans of other pyramids
* exterior structures within the complex containing the main structure relate to the function of the structure
-- yes. There's a mortuary chapel (standard on all royal tombs; it's where the deceased) was given offerings after his or her death), a valley temple (where mummification took place) -- these structures are found on royal and noble tombs from the first dynasty onward. Ka statues in the temples (again, from early dynasties onward. They had a special chamber for these statues in the associated temples), assigned priesthoods (we know there were still "Khufu priests" at the time of Tutankamun and later). Boat pits -- boats are included in the burials of nobles and royals.
* location
-- the pyramids are in cemeteries, surrounded by graves and large tombs.

Mostly the heights ruin the hypothesis.

I don't know if I was clear about this part, but the plunger would only move up and down the grand gallery. It's the widest, offering the most displacement, but it's also the closest to smooth.

A pump only needs a plunger in one place.


For it to work as a pump at this point, I think it would have to be pumping a gas instead of a fluid. And I can't think of a good reason why you would want to do that.

The Osiris shaft is interesting, though. located between Khafre's pyramid and the Sphynx. Apparently at different times in history it has gotten full of water, even though there is no good reason for water to be reaching that elevation.

hiddenincatours.com...

a reply to: Mike27

Take a look at the right side of the picture it is no a straiat edge like the left side

The height of the jagged line and the height of that line represents a very tall wall,,
Notice at the very top of the ramp there is onlt half a person being representedthis is becouse the other half is in the down ramp eara that you can not see , Your lever would be the last part of the downramp made of wood like a bridge
to span the are at the base of the pyramid ,,. this area would have been wide enough to allow the builders to walk around the base of the pyramid,...

Once the base was completed and the very large stone including the finished stones,. the wooding ramp would be removed and replaced by dirt
The people are using there weight to keep the ramp from tiping under so much weight

That plie of rocks
Look at were the fulkrum is is,.. there would be no mecanical advantage moving the block it is suport for the ramp let's say that is a 20 ton stone your lever it'self would have to be 35 feet long 8 inchedf around and weigh more than 5 ton

The DDC is correct ,. of couse you could always explain how that lever would work

but the carts have been added becouse they depick ann axle that would need a hub to keep the spoes in place and then a thick round wooden rim thy might have had a axle and a solid wheel but the concept of a hub is mutch to modern

remember you have to build the structure without machines

Class dismissed

a reply to: AlanBChrist

Have you ever moved something like that in real life?

it looks like they are dragging the sled along soft ground, using matting to support the sled.
They are removing matting from the rear and moving it to the front as the sled moves forward.

A modern day example;
www.youtube.com...

Maybe the sled was just stuck and they tugged and levered it out.
youtu.be...

The jagged lines are a representation of damage and defects of the art work. Prove me wrong with a photograph.