USS Connecticut has undersea collision

a reply to: penroc3

You

my question to you is what happens to the warm water from the seconday cooling loop/radiator when it is pumped out?

It’s not pumped out. The exhaust steam from the turbines dumps into the main condenser to be condensed into water. Hence the name condenser. The condensed steam now water is pump to the steam generators to start the steam cycle again.

The steam in the main condenser gives up its heat through tube walls of the heat exchanger which has sea water flowing through the tubes. The flowing seawater picks up the heat and the sea water being ejected into the sea from the condenser takes the heat with it.

I know. How dare the navy pick the most convenient, simplest, reliable, safest, proven means of getting rid of waste heat. And not some over complicated method that would add unneeded complexity and required maintenance. With needing additional equipment, and consuming valuable space on a sub.

a reply to: neutronflux

Still not seeing your service record anywhere

and i already posted my MOS or i want to be difficult i can say my AFJC was 1T231


when someone asks about an MOS they are just asking wha your job was, i have been out for over a decade or so,


you claim to be an expert but cant answer my questions.



the only question i asked was what happens to the hot sea water

originally posted by: JIMC5499
a reply to: neutronflux

I got out as an AD2 (AC) (SAR) EAWS ESWS from an HS Squadron.

Let him figure it out.

let who figure what out?

and what does it have to do with this conversation. We are not in the military so we don't need to play the acronym game

why should i have to figure anything out? why cant you just say what you did?

a reply to: neutronflux

after it heats up it wont condense anything, it needs to be cooled somehow.


but if that's your answer thank you

originally posted by: JIMC5499
a reply to: neutronflux

I got out as an AD2 (AC) (SAR) EAWS ESWS from an HS Squadron.

Let him figure it out.

and i could google that crap but i know you were in aircraft haunting subs so that means you did surface warfare

a reply to: penroc3

pretty close according to google

originally posted by: penroc3
why should i have to figure anything out? why cant you just say what you did?

I did.
AD - Aviation Machinist Mate - aircraft mechanic
2 - Second Class Petty Officer (E-5)
AC - Aircrew
SAR - Search and Rescue Wet Swimmer
EAWS - Enlisted Aviation Warfare Specialist
ESWS - Enlisted Surface Warfare Specialist
HS - Helicopter Anti-Submarine Warfare Squadron. We chased subs. In my case from Carriers. Independence, Carl Vinson and Forrestal. We flew SH-3H Sea King Helicopters.

I was in the Navy in the mid-80's. We were still in the Cold War. A few times it almost went hot. Our primary mission was anti-submarine warfare. Since I was Aircrew, I had to learn enough about sub hunting and the equipment to be able to assist in the event something happened while I was in the aircraft. I also stood Assistant Squadron Duty Officer watch in the ready room. Sometimes that would involve assisting the Duty Officer when we had acquisition of a Soviet Sub and help coordinate the Battle Group's ASW effort.

In other words, I know subs and how they are hunted. Somebody has given you some bad information. Some of it is from Popular Science and Popular Mechanics. I think a bit more is from YouTube videos. A lot of that is theoretical or somebody trying to get funding.

Google "Kamen Aerospace" "Magic Lantern". You might find it interesting. I worked on some of that a while back.

a reply to: JIMC5499

the pod sounds very dangerous for the thing being hunted.


i wonder what they have on them now...

i know you might not be able to answer this but here it goes

other than a visual ID of a sub or a confirmed sonar hit, what would be the best way of detecting a nuclear sub underway>?

i could see something like LIDAR(but not LIDAR) that could see into the water to look for perturbations in the water colom,

and do boomers leave a trace of radiation in the water for all the warheads and the reactors

a reply to: penroc3

"other than a visual ID of a sub or a confirmed sonar hit, what would be the best way of detecting a nuclear sub underway>?"

If I could figure that out, I'd be a very rich man. Here's the problem.

Sonar is of two types. Active and Passive.

Active is what you see in the movies. You emit a sound pulse and then get an echo back. It has several problems. One is that a sub can hear your pulse passively further away than you can detect it. It just changes course and moves on. Another is the difference in temperatures and salinity in the water. Colder water and water with higher salinity can deflect active sonar pulses. Those are the two problems that I'll mention.

Passive sonar is when you listen for the noise that your target makes. The sound of it's propeller as it moves through the water, sound that it's internal machinery makes, a cook dropping a pan are all sounds that can be transmitted through the water and picked up by somebody who's listening.

Then you have MAD (Magnetic Anomaly Detector) It detects variations in the Earth's magnetic field made by a large mass of Iron or Steel (submarine hull). An advantage MAD has is that large areas can be covered by aircraft that have the detectors.

Usually a combination of methods are used. Think of a submarine being in the center of a box. An aircraft's MAD shows a reading. The reading is plotted and tracked. That reduces the size of the box. Then sonobuoys maybe dropped in the area to listen for any noise. When a noise is heard a sonobuoy can give a general direction of where the noise came from. Then more MAD passes and more sonobuoys are used, shrinking the size of the box. That is called "Localizing". If everything works right, the box is narrowed down as much as possible and in the event of war a weapon is used. Our helicopters carried the Mk 46 torpedo. We could carry a W-57 nuclear bomb configured as a depth bomb.

Read Clancy's Hunt for Red October and Red Storm Rising. He goes more in depth on this in those books. 99% of what he has there is correct.

"i could see something like LIDAR(but not LIDAR) that could see into the water to look for perturbations in the water colom,

The "Magic Lantern" system was designed for use in shallow water (less that 100 ft.). That would be dependent on the clarity of the water and again changes in temperature and salinity. All of these would effect the laser. The problem with using "pertubations" in the water is that water is constantly moving.

There are no traces of radiation left in the water from any ship. If on the off hand a sub had a failure that resulted in a release of radiation, it would spread out so far through the water that it would be undetectable.

a reply to: JIMC5499

i love the hunt for the red october.


I know all about the nuclear depth bomb, the version i saw was attached to a rocket that launched off a boat.(it was in a museum).


last question


with USO coming into their own, do you think that they will be using them as a type of decoy(like MALD)? if it were to broadcast a very powerful broadband 'ping' wouldnt it blind all subs in the area?

in the H.F.T.R.O the Dallas releases decoys that look like they just make allot of bubbles and noise. With the new sensors and torpedo's coming out other than going deep and silent is there another way to mask a sub.

aircraft have chaff to blind a radar, granted if that happens the other side knows SOMETHING is there but cant pin point it.


it seems subs once they are spotted would have to return to port or something to try to hide again as you could just follow them with aircraft and surface ships.


is there such thing as a sub decoy?


thank you in advance

a reply to: penroc3

The counter measures used in The Hunt for Red October are big Alka-Seltzer's.

It isn't that easy to keep tracking a sub once you acquire it. They can and do break contact.

There are submarine decoys. That's all I'm going to say.

A "broadband ping" from an underwater drone wouldn't only blind a sub, it would blind you too.

a reply to: JIMC5499

i thought subs used dead reckoning when they have a map that is very well charted? or is that from the old days when they couldnt use sonar or GPS

i would love to toss one of those fizzy decoys in my pool lol.


I'm sure you know about Russia's clamed 100megaton(dirty)/50MT(clean) USO, from some of the underwater tests i have seen that would only really be useful against a port or military base.

I think the Chinese DF-21 has a better4 shot at hitting a carrier group. the Russian USO is almost as big as a sub its self.


When Plutonium decays it gives of gasses and all sorts of decay products that are VERY detectable, i know they use some special alloy in the pits and rods of the warheads but a full boat of missiles is ALOT of nuclear material.

it is really surprising there isn't a way to detect that even in deep water. We can shield or deflect neutrons so I'm not sure how they attenuate them.

I have a feeling that the FOGBANK is really some type of advanced aerogel that has deuterium and tritium in it and maybe boron as a shell to reflect as much radiation as possible.

i mean seamen sleep next to the tubes so it has to be pretty shielded/heavy

a reply to: penroc3

Sigh…..

What do you do when the radiator in your car heats up? You stop and change it?

after it heats up it wont condense anything, it needs to be cooled somehow.

The condenser is kept at proper operating temperature from the sea water pumps continuously pumping sea water through the tubes of the condenser.

Condenser

A large heat exchanger designed to cool exhaust steam from a turbine below the boiling point so that it can be returned to the heat source as water. In a pressurized-water reactor, the water is returned to the steam generator. In a boiling-water reactor, it returns to the reactor core. The heat removed from the steam by the condenser is transferred to a circulating water system and is exhausted to the environment, either through a cooling tower or directly into a body of water.

www.nrc.gov...

If you missed it” The heat removed from the steam by the condenser is transferred to a circulating water system and is exhausted to the environment, either through a cooling tower or directly into a body of water.”

If the above is too much for you too read…

“ directly into a body of water.”

a reply to: penroc3

The diagram shows this…

a reply to: neutronflux




still waiting on what you did in the navy and for how long


what boat were you on

how long were you in

did you ever strike out?

Again. None of your business.

If you think I posted something false, quote it. And provide evidence.

a reply to: penroc3

But it is funny watching you have a hissy fit because your not getting your way, and watching you get called out on the falsehoods you hold.

What you going to do, throw another hissy fit….

a reply to: neutronflux

i dont think you were in the navy and i think you like to steal others valor in a half assed attempt to make me look like i dont know what im talking about.


you are the FIRST person i have ever meet that wont say what their job was in the military


so until you can tell me what you did you are now in the category of people who wear uniforms that don't match and are all fcuked up.

i really do hope you were in because if you were lying trying to make a point it doesnt matter if the point you were making was right or wrong because you lied from the jump.


just tell me what your job code was?

what's the harm in that.


you keep posting the same pictures saying i don't understand but offer no explanation so to me that means you know less than me and just copy and paste wiki and YouTube BS.

please prove me wrong. Stolen Valor is a federal crime and one people take very serious(i have had to hold 2 of my friends as they died) so its not a joke.

what class did you graduate from?

originally posted by: neutronflux
a reply to: penroc3

But it is funny watching you have a hissy fit because your not getting your way, and watching you get called out on the falsehoods you hold.

What you going to do, throw another hissy fit….

no just address you like the child you are/act like

you are nothing other than a distraction on a dull day, don't get your self twisted thinking i care about you or your opinion

your less than the dirt on the bottom of my boots


the worst of the worst


what's next going to start a gofund me for your military induced injuries?

ETA:pointless

a reply to: penroc3

i dont think you were in the navy and i think you like to steal others valor in a half assed attempt to make me look like i dont know what im talking about.

Exactly what valor am I trying to steal? Basic nuclear power plant operation? And theory? And I only started posting because of some of the ridiculous posts.

So. You have no cause to believe I posted anything false concerning the operation of a nuclear power plant on a sub.


Because you are clueless.

Example.

originally posted by: neutronflux
a reply to: penroc3

You

why on god earth would you stop a reactor just because?

Because when you pull in to port you bring on shore power.

Shutting down the reactor in port lets the navy…

One, extends the life of the core.

Two, makes it safe to work top side. And for divers to work below.

Three. Allows for cleaning of the main condensers. And many other PM’s.

Four, pier side. There is less a available sea water for dumping waste heat and more chance of fouling the main condensers with crap from the sea.

Five. A shut down reactor is safer for being pier side. And requires less watch standers which gives better quality of life for when the crew is in port. And allows for less pier side restrictions.

you are the FIRST person i have ever meet that wont say what their job was in the military

I guess you cannot always get what you want.

I would think my screen name would be a clue.

so until you can tell me what you did you are now in the category of people who wear uniforms that don't match and are all fcuked up.

Because I value my privacy? Especially on a website where I made people made because I pointed out how absurd it is in the 9/11 forums for those that believe the WTC was brought down by Nukes.


You share many traits of those people.

i really do hope you were in because if you were lying trying to make a point it doesnt matter if the point you were making was right or wrong because you lied from the jump.

You have no authority and no cause to think lying.

just tell me what your job code was?

what's the harm in that.

See above.

you keep posting the same pictures saying i don't understand but offer no explanation so to me that means you know less than me and just copy and paste wiki and YouTube BS.

False argument by you easily proven false.

originally posted by: neutronflux

originally posted by: penroc3
a reply to: neutronflux

i have been nothing but civil to you and kept my questions civil

why are you so evasive

I am not evading anything. I have repeatedly given the heat flow path from core to primary reactor coolant to secondary steam plant to sea water repeatedly.

Worded it many ways. Cited material and diagrams.

Unfortunately. In the nuclear navy, you would be called a rock.

You just ignored the answers trying to play smart.

please prove me wrong. Stolen Valor is a federal crime and one people take very serious(i have had to hold 2 of my friends as they died) so its not a joke.

Ok. Report me. But your the one making false accusations. And I think I that would open you up to civil and criminal suits.