Believers and non-believers...

a reply to: oloufo

That's all true, or, not, we can't even say that for a fact. heheh
I'm with you though, I feel the same.
We don't have a clue at all what is going on, well, WE don't, as citizens, maybe some, or all governments do, we'll probably never know though.

All I want to say is, remember when we would watch a video and say, "What'd they take that with, a potato?"...
Now, we see a video and say, "FAKE!, it's too good, it's too perfect, CGI!"...

We'll never be really satisfied. heheh

It's simple, I won't believe until evidence has been presented that has been studied by different sources by people with an understanding of that subject. Be it biologist, chemist, microbiologist, etc. Those happen to be people in science that have studied their subject for years. Why would anyone believe something as important as visiting alien beings because stories have been told? Is it possible? Sure. Has it happened as a fact? No.

The government cover up and alien conspiracy is nonsense. Alien visitation wouldn't be exclusive to a single government, it would be a worldwide event. There are plenty of outlets now where people can come out with what they've experienced and give us any evidence. Look at the Starchild skull. A perfect example of how the internet can be used to show the world "evidence". The Atacama skeleton. An example how film can be used to show "evidence". Alien implants. An example of how "evidence" could be shown through the medical community. The mummified alien skulls of South America. How the internet can be used by any country to present the world with "evidence". So this idea that evidence is suppressed by governments isn't true but it makes for a good conspiracy and another excuse as to why there's no evidence after 70+ years.

I've been a member of the forum for a while. I won't name names, but I've had run-ins with plenty of believers here that turn aggressive and defensive in their stance. That kind of response get a certain response back. You have members that have claimed multiple abductions or interactions. I hold those accountable for their stories. I'm not going to naively take a strangers word for something as incredible as that. Back up those claims with the evidence we've been looking for.

a reply to: recrisp

If you were in Garland, TX then you were only 3 hours west of where my mom and I saw what we saw (small world). In my experience, I never saw the UFO as it followed us along the top of the trees because I was sitting in the passenger seat of a Bronco and the UFO was on my mom's side. The roof blocked my vision but she could see it, and feel its presence. I didn't see it until mom turned in the driveway and started backing up to the shed where we were going to unload the hay bale. What we saw was round like a traditional saucer and it had red lights going around it. When I got out of the truck, I only stood there for about a second before my mom had made it to my side and grabbed my arm and told me get inside and don't look at it. We ran in through the back door and I immediately went to the first window and it was gone. This thing was only about 30 to 40 yards from us and that's probably why everything felt like we were in a dream. My mom and I still talk about it to this day, she came to the conclusion that the reason we felt like we were in a dream was because the UFO was close enough that we were probably in some sort of vacuum from it. I really don't know how to explain it other than that way. Here is a picture I've posted before, this was taken in our front yard and the trees across the street (where we saw the UFO) in 1985 when we moved there. As I said before, we saw the UFO in 1988 but the scenery hadn't changed at all. Oh, and if I were to guess, I'd say the size of the UFO was probably 80' to 100' from one side to the other. I can't say for the height because it was at night when we saw it.

I am a 100% believer due to personal experience.
And I have no problem with people not believing crappy photos and crazy stories thats out there. I used to be like that myself.

a reply to: Ectoplasm8
"Look at the Starchild skull. A perfect example of how the internet can be used to show the world "evidence". The Atacama skeleton. An example how film can be used to show "evidence". Alien implants. An example of how "evidence" could be shown through the medical community"

I agree with what you say, but I am unclear as to what you mean in the above...
Are you saying that there is TRUE "evidence", or you saying, "evidence", being sarcastic? The quotes is what is throwing me off.
I ask because I am personally a non-believer in those particular instances.

OTOH having little patience with folk we know are about to spend years chasing what at first seem such promising leads & cases only to find out their fatal flaws, and then eventually end up where many of us are at now, can be a wake-up call.

Of course rudeness is uncalled for but explaining unequivocally & passionately that Roswell, for example, is a waste of time is a durn public service and even kindness. I've seen quite a few here that while they may have been a little miffed at having their balloon burst so quickly took the wake-up to heart and sharpened their critical thinking skills. Some never do because they want to believe so much.

I wanna believe to, but I determined long ago to follow the truth wherever it leads even if I have to give up a cherished theory or belief. And I don't think that comes so automatically for many of us, I had to work on it and still do to some degree. It was this very subject that instilled that in me.

Personally, knowing what I know now isn't a disappointment (anymore anyways) and I still believe there is a real phenomena we can't yet explain be it deep psychology, E.T., "Dimensional" or even spiritual.

Being free of chasing mythologies that leave out facts that don't fit ones tendency to confirmation bias keeps the tail-chasing down and still leaves plenty of less "damaged" cases & ideas--like the IDH--to ponder...and, theoretically, at least a little closer to the truth.

Good thread.

a reply to: LSU2018
The picture your showed definitely looks like something from a UFO movie! heheh
My father lived in Minden, probably not too far from you.

I don't really know what to say when someone tells me something that is so 'out there' to most of us, but at the same time, you're a pretty credible person, and I almost always agree with everything that you say on most subjects. In other words, I respect you and your opinions.
So, while if an average person told me what you just told me, I don't know if I would believe them at face value. In my entire life I have known zero people that have seen a UFO that scared them, or, they told of an incredible story. Nobody in my entire life. That says something.

On the other hand, if I saw something I wouldn't be telling just anyone. (ATS is anonymous, so, that's different)
I know one guy that swears up and down that he saw the acorn shaped UFO in Kecksburg that night. He was the only person that I know of. I didn't believe him and he was my best friend. heheh
He was not known to be completely truthful all of the time though.

I mean, I KNOW there are planets out there that have life on there, or, there is a future that someone/some thing could come through. I know the government doesn't tell us about all of their black projects, and really, we don't need to know secrets IF it was for our own good. Not that I believe that they do anything for our own good.
The thing is, none of us know a thing about what is really going on, I am sure there is someone that will read this and say that they were abducted by a certain type of alien, they may have been abducted, but we can't be sure as to who abducted them. Not unless we were there, them saying that they were abducted doesn't make it a true statement that is was done by aliens.

It sure might all be true, people getting probed, cows being experimented on, glowing spaceships, the whole deal, but nobody, anywhere that I know of can prove to me, or to you that they have the truth.
Even when the truth comes and bites me on the buttocks I won't believe it because I have conditioned myself to not believe it. I had to I guess to protect myself, I would like to believe, but right now I just can't believe the majority of what I know to be true, whatever that may be.

I am not referring to you, I am 'just saying'...

I do have to say this, I sincerely believe that Betty Cash saw something that night, I firmly believe that she got radiation poisoning from whatever it was that she and the other two people saw. I believe that she died from it.
What I don't know is. Who or what was responsible for that crazy-assed sighting? I mean, that one really takes the cake!
I read that it said, "U.S. Air Force" on the side of the 'space ship', and that it had flames, like some terrestrial early model rocket ship might, and, helicopters flying all around.
Who knows what that was, AND, if that was possible, what else was possible?
That's the kind of stuff right there that keeps me from not believing, I sincerely believe that they witnessed something, and that it literally killed her in the long run. That to me sounds like the government though.

So, what you saw was not that far from her incident really, as a crow flies, and I am not saying that it was terrestrial, or extra-terrestrial, but it sure could have happened.
Why? Because that poor lady died, and nobody would help her. She struggled until the day she died, nobody came to her aid or ever told her what happened, that I know of anyway.

So I know my little dinky stories are true, I don't know where they came from or who was piloting them, if anyone was at all. I just know what I saw was real, but I have no idea as to how important of a sighting it was, if I could even call mine a true sighting.
If MY "dinky stories" are true, why can't other's be too?

a reply to: tjocksteffe
What would you feel like if we didn't believe your story though, would that bother you?
I don't know your story, but, as we have all pretty much said, it's hard to prove our stories, and what we have seen.
I'm just asking, hopefully you know I'm not being a jerk.

I don't know you really, and without a real story that at least sounds credible, it's hard for most people to take anyone's word at face value. Even your family, or, I should say, people's families.
I know one night I was telling my brother about an incident at Caddo Lake at the Texas/Louisiana border as we were going to bed in the back of my pick-up, as I told him, lo and behold, there was another one, just like my description.
It was 'just a bubble', a little clear blue bubble-like thing floating through the sky. The clearing in the trees above us prevented us from seeing it for very long, it was only probably 8-10 seconds or so, maybe.

Why that was significant was, he wasn't really believing what I was telling him UNTIL he saw this right in front of him. It wasn't spectacular, but it was pretty significant.
The story I told him though was a lot more significant than what we both saw though.
The guy I was with in my first event was my best friend, he wouldn't talk about it later, and, at work that following Monday, he made me look like a lying fool when I told a bunch of the guys about what we saw, it turns out, in his memory, he didn't see a thing. He told me later that he didn't want to look like an idiot, but, I guess he sure didn't mind making me look like one. heheh

Anyway, years later my brother wouldn't really admit that we saw anything weird, and he didn't believe in UFOs at all, then or later. So, just because we do see something, some people aren't prepared for the truth, or, at least what they see with their own eyes. My brother was a pretty devout Christian, and a Pentecost kind of guy though, whatever that means.

My story is not really that interesting, if I told people if wouldn't be a big deal in today's world. Back in 1973 it was a big deal. Telling a story might also depend on when you told it. What year, etc.

I can't say that I believe you saw something, but you haven't made me feel as though you're a nutcase either. heheh

a reply to: The GUT
Perfectly put, so much better than I can put it. I really appreciate the input and thoughts in your post, saying a lot and saying it in a polite way that one can take from it what they want, which is a good thing.

Thank you, GUT, that was a nice read, all of everyone's is too, of course.

originally posted by: BrokenCircles

There always remains the possibility of existence.

Off Earth, even the grouchiest scientist will surrender to the notion that this Possibility can stretch to a Probability, even accounting for the incredible odds and necessary accidents for Intelligent life to finally evolve within 13.8 billion years. The Universe is Big Enough, and currently expanding at the rate of 82.4 kilometers per second per megaparsec.

So we can all put that in our pipes and smoke it.

Imagine if such an intelligence had reached our fifty-year span of Airplane-to-Space travel a long, long time ago in a galaxy far, far awa....er, you catch my drift.

Moreover, if such a race visited our planet, I somehow doubt they would travel in a silly tin can; indeed, the actual feat of interstellar travel may involve an evolution into such a high intelligence that a 'craft' or even a body to house that intelligence would seem a ridiculous proposition.

Not to us violent apes, of course, but we do tend to believe that our own current era is the apex of all knowledge - just as we believed so in the 17th Century whilst using leech medication, burning witches, and hunting down heretical philosophers like Bruno and Galileo.

Basically, the 'Nuts & Bolts' theory of alien visitation in tin cans (or indeed "Tic-Tac"s, although the original Nimitz yarn on this very site in 2007 specifically described a Flying Saucer in its first incarnation) is swiftly becoming rather silly.

On the other hand, how on earth do we persuade a general public to soak up the idea of a travelling consciousness? We like our UFOs to be plain and simple, innit?

It's hard not to believe. Even if people think all the ufo sightings (alot by professional pilots and military) is not convincing enough. I mean sure it could be humans flying those things however.....

In comparison to what we know now on how big the universe is, Earth is x1 billionth the size of a pin head in comparison to the size of space.

To think we the only intelligent living entity out there is harder to believe..

a reply to: lSkrewloosel

I really don't think that people don't believe, it's just that we don't know who to believe.
Even on ATS you won't get too much flak over people believing that there is 'someone' out there, I seriously doubt that anyone in this day and age believe that we are alone. At least not many people would believe that.
Personally, I believe that there is something going, I mean, I have no idea what, but something is seen, for whatever reason.

With the advent of drones now it just makes things much harder because there are a lot of drones now, and lights on them, and well, there you go, for the new generation of believers.

a reply to: recrisp


It is not about BELIEF.

It is about truth.

There is only on truth but 7 billion beliefs.

We are being lied to by our Governments/Religons/Researchers who have accepted the job of telling us the truth..... and who have abbrogated that simple task.

People can shove their beliefs where the Sun dont shine.

People who have lied must be held accountable and the truth must be shared Globally and freely.

Everyone has a bullspit story that they try to use to cover up the LIES they tell....time to hold them all accountable....including the ones who say they lied for National Security reasons.

This was never and will NEVER be about beliefs....this has always been and always will be about suppressed truths.

a reply to: recrisp
Yeah, maybe, but here's where they got you, we can't prove that they did or didn't do something, or, we can't prove a thing.
Truth is good, but to not being able to prove that truth, well, we're right back to square one.
You're right about government corruptions though, it may start there and probably will end there. Whatever that means.

I got no problem with anybody claiming some weird UFO related happening or experience. Turns out they're shockingly common.

But the minute they start claiming they know for absolute sure and true what it was all about, then they better start detailing things and coming up with the best they can do for proof.

But the reason is not to mock them or trip them up, it's to find out for real if what they say has merit or if it's just balloon juice. Let's see what they got. Excuse me for not blithely accepting their interpretation as accurate. Because we don't want to believe; we want to know.

So don't make super crazy claims without tons of disclaimers, unless you can offer actual proof.

Oh, and I'm sorry if the truth is made clear to the witness by telepathy. I can't work with that. They should understand that.

a reply to: recrisp

I'll be damned. Minden is the neighboring town! If you've been there then you passed through my little town unless you stayed on the interstate the whole time.

I'm definitely speaking the truth but it's a tough story to believe. We only talk about it around the family but putting it on here is a good fitting place.

I wasn't scared, I was drawn in and wanted to keep staring. My mom was scared and felt the presence, that's why she grabbed me so fast. We've all seen the movies (in the 70's and 80's) and when you're that close, you don't know what's really gonna happen. That's how she looked at it.

a reply to: recrisp

Doesn't matter to me if I'm the only person on the face of the earth that believes in UFO...If you had seen what I saw there would be two of us believers...

a reply to: Blue Shift
There's all kinds of claims, for sure. I'm like you, but for me, I feel that I need to get a feel for the person talking, maybe that is the wrong approach, but I like to listen first, then think about it all.
I agree with you though, the extraordinary claims that we hear about won't cut it, and if I went through something that was so earth-shattering as that, honestly, I am not sure if I would talk about or not.

I am SURE I wouldn't talk about it here! heheh

a reply to: LSU2018

I kind of got a feeling that you were near there when you mentioned something about being in North Louisiana not long ago, plus, your avatar says it...

I was always on the interstate, it was a 5 hour drive for me back then.

Yeah man, that is nothing like I have ever felt or seen, so I cannot relate, although it does sound very exciting. I am sure that when a kid sees that it's going to stick with 'em, heck, even your mother.
Did either of you get a feeling of where it was from? I mean, what was your gut feeling as to what was happening?

Pretty interesting, I must say. I say that out of respect, I know you, but you don't know me, and what I know of you, you don't seem like a quirky guy. heheh

Just for fun, if you want, I found my old first post about my little experience, it doesn't rate, but I only posted it to hopefully get an answer as to if anyone might have seen one before. Not just that, but in there, it says that I was searching for the member her that had the same experience as I did, I wasn't a member at the time he posted his thread, now I can't find it.
If you don't want to, that's O.K. too, it's really too long and not exciting anyway! heheh

www.abovetopsecret.com...