The reason why Religion is put to shame

I have to agree the way we have been controlled and brainwashed by religions is so insidious most of us are oblivious to it. They tell us that you have to believe in this or that otherwise you will be punished for eternity. No wonder our generation is growing out of this repressive mindset and acknowledging the bullsh-t behind it all.
Now, this rebellion comes with a price.
A heavy one, that is-

Ultimate truths have been lost and nobody knows what is real anymore. Science pretends to be the answers to everything when reality is it probably only showcases 5% of what the universe is all about. One day they claim you need two doses of Covid19 vaccine to be fully protected and the other one claim the complete opposite when it fits their agenda. "Science" they say.

Yet people deny thousands of years of knowledge accumulated by our ancestors, who were just as smart as us in their own ways, and when they hear the word God or spirituality they start laughing right away like it was the most stupidiest thing of all.

It is true many things in religions are wrong as f-ck and clearly show the evil and greedy hand manipulation of man in power to gain and keep control of this wonderful world. This simple yet very effective tactic is based on the idea of hiding and surrounding the deep hidden truths of reality around so much lies that it becomes almost impossible to understand what this train wrecks of life is all about. Also, hidden in plain sight. Those f-cktards above us knows most of the true purposes of life and they want everything but humanity to awaken to it... because it would mean the end of their disgusting wicked reign over Planet Earth.

So when I see Christians and genuine good honest people claim all over the place that the only way back to the Source is to believe in Jesus Christ or God without doing any real efforts whatsoever other than having blind "faith" I can't help but have understanding to those who deny the existence of a supreme being. Not that I agree with them but cmon, it's just so obvious this mindset and belief is behind pushed by evil and demonstrate manipulation at its finest.
Who in their sane mind would truly believe saying to an atheist that if he does believe with all his heart in Jesus Christ (something he has no comprehension about at all in the first place) it will then magically convince him to come back to God and the Divine? And if he not do so, he will rot in hell forever and ever.

This is pure insanity.

Now, I will give you an alternative.
What if the real message behind Christianity (and religions as a whole) was to learn from teachers like Jesus and the such, realize what's hidden behind their teachings and put it into actions into the real world? What was JC working towards to teach us? Claiming to have to believe in him and asking others to do the same mean absolutely nothing alone by itselfs if it isn't backed up by strong incentives to do so. My point is-

The lie we are being fed is that all you have to do to redeem yourself is to have faith. While I agree that learning to trust the Divine is the only way to redemption, it seems most people feed wickedness knowingly everyday but tell themselves that if they believe in Jesus or whatever they will be saved. Just like my dad who believed in God all his life asking for good fortunes but never wondering what he could have given back. Such a great person but oblivious to the consequences of his actions and beliefs.This is the definition of being deceived, I tell you.

God requires true sacrifices from all of us... you know, the ones you don't feel like doing. Faith is only one of them. And he gives us all the chances we need but patience has limits.
Jesus Christ was the greatest teacher of all and he is expected to come back and save all of us. That would be awesome but I must ask, what does it means for all of us if he won't show up? We are in deep sh-t right now. The enslavement of the human race is coming to fruition in front of our very eyes and yet we all act and pretend like everything is all alright.

Well, let me tell you something.
The great deception is coming and if you truly believe in God start asking yourself what he truly expects from you right now. Faith isn't enough.

"Be the change you want to see in the world"

This is often called the "faith vs works" debate in Christianity. Perhaps the easiest way to show the fallacy of the "faith" argument is that the Devil believes in God too so is the Devil going to Heaven?



I think it's far more likely that we're all going to "Heaven" and Jesus has prepared a special room for each and every one of us in one of his many mansions according to our personal faith AND works... the question is which one?

a reply to: Boadicea

As always, what do I know anyway.

In ways I hold with your notion of we all are going to heaven, heaven of course being a very generic word to describe what's going on after we live here. The idea of many mansions or many rooms has helped to guide a lot of my own thinking over the years in response to a number of issues raised by our OP.

In that vein I kind of hold at this point with more of a Mall of Heaven idea. If we spend our time here only learning to eat hot dogs, then when we get to the Mall, we only want to visit the Hot Dog Court. If we only learn to appreciate heavy metal when we get to the Mall, we only want to listen to Metallica in the Great Amphitheater. These being of course gross simplifications yet enough to offer the drift of these thoughts.

So in a way , I see our time HERE as being kind of a Table of Contents for heaven. What we learn here, what we come to appreciate here all add to our consciousness and become what we want to engage in when we cross over. The more we learn in the way of what is true here, what we learn to love here all translate to the size of those rooms on the other side. And maybe not even rooms but rather as I like to see it a Grand Mall where we can visit as we choose but only if we have built the base for even comprehending the plethora of potentials once we are gone from these physical bodies.

I even at this point consider that even here is merely one more of those rooms. That we are already in Heaven, just one of the rooms that presents us with all the stumbling blocks we see, or don't see before us. I mean whose to say that all of heaven will be challenge free?

originally posted by: Boadicea
This is often called the "faith vs works" debate in Christianity. Perhaps the easiest way to show the fallacy of the "faith" argument is that the Devil believes in God too so is the Devil going to Heaven?

I think it's far more likely that we're all going to "Heaven" and Jesus has prepared a special room for each and every one of us in one of his many mansions according to our personal faith AND works... the question is which one?

I also have the belief we all have a place in heaven waiting for us. Now, what I feel most people seem to be missing is the concept of having to make real sacrifices in order to get there. I guess self-proclaimed good human beings will think to themselves they deserve to be in heaven no matter what. We all commit to things we know are bad in the end and that doesn't make us bad persons. It's part of life ofc, yin and yang.

My argument is ppl think this through in the wrong way. Faith and good doings is awesome but have you ever considered that to make it to heaven you have to be free of sins in some ways or at least inspire to it? Heaven is the personification of perfection. It is the ultimate statement of the vision of God. A perfect creation full of love, truth and free of evil.

I'm just confused as to why even the strongest believer think they will go to heaven by only having faith. Yet, they will lie, consume porn, feed their wickedness all their life without ever asking themselves if their actions are truly honoring the God they believe in.

One will be deceived if he really thinks he can go through Heaven's gate armed with Faith only. If you consume porn daily, lie to your peers when unecessary, judge others, feed anger and envy, fail to show gratitude, make the same mistakes over and over again, deny forgiveness and love, so many things everybody does on a daily basic, how can you even consider being worthy of Heaven? Cmon man. We all know deep down we don't deserve to be there right now. And believing in JC won't change a thing.

originally posted by: St0rD
The great deception is coming and if you truly believe in God start asking yourself what he truly expects from you right now. Faith isn't enough.

God expects Faith in Jesus Christ who will now spread His Word to show how today's events were written into a Book 2000 years ago.

Option 1: God exists and is our Mr Universe Himself. Bible is True. Corinthians 15 1-4.
Option 2: Bible is lies and the elite running this planet seem quite intent on obeying everyword that their predecessors conscribed 2000+ years ago.

Either way: Billions of people are about to be wiped out of existence.

a reply to: TerryMcGuire

Yes! That's much how my faith perceives Heaven to be, with our experience and perception of "Heaven" -- our afterlife -- in many ways determined by ourselves, and how we live our lives. Your afterlife may be very different than mine... or not.

And while earth may not be part of Heaven, if Heaven is defined as our afterlife, earth is still part of the divine kingdom or universe, subject to the same laws (allbeit limited to our five physical senses). "As above, so below."

I honestly don't think we can fully understand what is beyond, and all the whys and wherefores, just as Jesus also told the people, "If you do not understand earthly matters, how can you understand the heavenly?"

originally posted by: Rapha

originally posted by: St0rD
The great deception is coming and if you truly believe in God start asking yourself what he truly expects from you right now. Faith isn't enough.

God expects Faith in Jesus Christ who will now spread His Word to show how today's events were written into a Book 2000 years ago.

Option 1: God exists and is our Mr Universe Himself. Bible is True. Corinthians 15 1-4.
Option 2: Bible is lies and the elite running this planet seem quite intent on obeying everyword that their predecessors conscribed 2000+ years ago.

Either way: Billions of people are about to be wiped out of existence.

God is real and the prophecies of the Bible are coming to fruition... or so it seems.

JC is a real being but ofc one of the most meaningful moment in our history will be used against us by the powers that be. JC showed us the way to honor his father (God) and he spoke about all the sins we should avoid at cost.

But sadly all of the OG sins are being feeded everyday by most of mankind. Truth is, our generation is just as wicked as the one in the days of Noah and Sodom which were destroyed because of their ignorance.
I'm gonna give you a little clue m8 do what you want with it..

Did you know thousands of years ago it was stated in the bible that man were wiped out because they started to play God, did some f-cked up stuff AND mixed the all of the species together. This is some pretty deep stuff..
Why would you say?

Because we now discovered that kind of technology and it's called Crispr. So not only they can bring back extinct species back to life with DNA engineering but they can also mix different species (like a human-pig hybrid) just as we speak or like our ancestors would call it-

A chimera.

Why would ancient civilizations thousands of years ago talk about stuff we only just discovered a couple years ago? What does that tell you?

a reply to: St0rD

Hmmmm.... you've made me look at this in a new light.

I read once, and I cannot remember where now, that when Moses gave the Ten Commandments to the people, that they were not true commandments, but rather given as those who truly follow the law of the Lord will do these things because they are the right thing to do.

Perhaps the people who profess faith but live a life of sin are simply saying the words, and really don't understand the faith they profess, or their actions would reflect their faith in all they do. Even if they have only a widow's mite to give. Even if they fall short of the mark at times. Some folks might actually believe saying the words is enough because they really do not know Jesus or his teachings.

I suppose those would be among the people that Jesus said would claim to know Him, but He would reject them in Heaven.

a reply to: Boadicea

I guess I take this place here as a drop in the bucket of the whole bucket. By learning and experiencing this drop is how we can begin to be in the spoonful, the cup, the pint, etc. For years and years I thought of heaven in terms of an after life, something that came after, ''here''. At this point I am working on changing that to thinking on it as if this place as our secondary existence and what I once considered the ''after life'' as our primary existence. Everyone's primary existence.

That is the notion that you alluded to in your first post here you think we are ''all going to heaven''. My take at this point is it's not a matter of going, but rather continuing to be ''in heaven'', just in one of the rooms that contains a restrictive element, a veil, which limits our perceptions of the whole. That it may be that we are here as we are by choice in agreement with the limitations of this reality with the way out that is guaranteed by physical death.

From this perspective there is no, deserves or need for redemption or salvation, no requirements or hoops of faith to get us home, though, and this is important to this idea, that all of those points I just mentioned can be intertwined with any number of belief systems people choose to follow. And all to the end they have chosen.

originally posted by: Boadicea
a reply to: St0rD

Hmmmm.... you've made me look at this in a new light.

I read once, and I cannot remember where now, that when Moses gave the Ten Commandments to the people, that they were not true commandments, but rather given as those who truly follow the law of the Lord will do these things because they are the right thing to do.

Perhaps the people who profess faith but live a life of sin are simply saying the words, and really don't understand the faith they profess, or their actions would reflect their faith in all they do. Even if they have only a widow's mite to give. Even if they fall short of the mark at times. Some folks might actually believe saying the words is enough because they really do not know Jesus or his teachings.

I suppose those would be among the people that Jesus said would claim to know Him, but He would reject them in Heaven.

Thanks for putting your opinions in perspective. I respect that a lot.

I know many people fight for good with clear actions and intent. However, there is just too much people pretending to believe in God, asking good fortune from the Divine and yet never truly consider the real implications of God's teaching.

I don't know man. I'm just sharing my own insights from the relationship I think I have with God. The message I got was that we think life is a game, which it is in a way (a simulation), and we know deep down it is a temporary illusion but still we are being tested and judged... all of us. You know, what they call Judgment Day, it's probably coming man.

We all know we fall short of grace. We are being given every chances to turn away from our evil ways. But patience is not infinite. God is just like us. He loves us but he is not a fool. What is he gonna do with all the people who choose to rape, murder and torture everytime they get the chance to? With no real intent of change?

Yeah, I'm pretty sure Satan and Hell is real now after everything I've seen. And it's so #ed up and terrifying... beyond words. It's hard to grasp the idea of such a terrible punishment but think about this-

If you were the almighty force behind creation and suddenly manifested a perfect material world out of nowhere (the big bang) reflecting your true being and then realized evil also existed within you..
So you try to hide it a first and quickly realize there is no escaping from darkness. Evil spread everywhere in your beautiful OG vision and corrupt everything. Instead of having kids enjoying the magic of life forever and ever, you see them being raped, tortured, kidnapped and murdered. Instead of seeing people loving each other and the animal kingdom like intended, you see the horrors of war and the madness behind the meat industry.

Since you are a being of honor, you respect your own laws. Free will must be preserved at all cost even if it means experiencing the insanity of our reality. But you know it's only temporary. People will come around eventually..
But what do you do with those who never turn away from their wicked ways?

That's why I've learned to fear God and Hell, not the fearmongering provided by the Vatican but the one that awaits me if I can't let go of my sins and ignore all the chances that were given to me.

People like to think God is so bad for "sending"people to Hell but the truth is he has no choice at all. We have all been warned for thousand of years that there will come a day when this universe will be purged from evil and that it will be imprisoned somewhere so all the rest of creation can enjoy life what it was meant to be. And people have all the time they need to pick a side. Maybe and probably I'm pushing it to far right now, yet if I'm right we are taking this life and the consequences of perpetual sins too lightly.

I know I sound crazy rn but still I trust the knowledge I've learned in the last 3 years and had to share it with you



Peace

I 100% agree! If you accept the Lord Jesus Christ as your savior and think that is all you need to do to lead a healthy life, you are an idiot!

People should be learning from the wisdom of their ancestors, applying it to their own life, and also building on that wisdom. Some of it might be outdated and need to be updated.

This all requires critical thinking and not blind belief!

originally posted by: darkbake
I 100% agree! If you accept the Lord Jesus Christ as your savior and think that is all you need to do to lead a healthy life, you are an idiot!

People should be learning from the wisdom of their ancestors, applying it to their own life, and also building on that wisdom. Some of it might be outdated and need to be updated.

This all requires critical thinking and not blind belief!

Yes, it's so ridiculous our generation acts like we are the culmination of evolution. Sure, we evolved so much in the last 100 years but at what cost?
How many animals suffered terribly in the name of science? What about Mother Earth and the Animal Kingdom that are both not in good shape at all?

I know most people want to put their heads in the sand and pretends it doesn't matter to them but we will all be affected by it really soon. My guess is 10 years and this world will go insane.

It's funny you bring up not having blind belief. Recently, I've been asking life to teach me once and for all to trust and have faith in its true intentions almost blindly. Which means, having doubts is totally normal and people should never stop asking questions.

a reply to: St0rD

Truly having faith is a sacrifice.

As humans, we are born into this body. At the time of birth, I believe we know instinctively that there is a God, but then we are overwhelmed by all these physical sensations. Oh, that food tastes good! The chemical releases in the brain when we laugh... such an awesome feeling! It doesn't take long for us to forget the spiritual side of ourselves and concentrate solely on the physical.

That is the curse that Adam and Eve handed down... the curse of forgetting who we are beyond the physical. Jesus is the cure for that curse. When one is "born again" one realizes again that there is more to our existence than this physical body. There is no other way to regain that realization, because the body's impulses are simply too strong. Fasting, for example, is a tried and true method of starving the body to the point that one begins to realize that those hunger pangs will pass and are only trivial. We force ourselves to ignore our body's demands while concentrating on the spiritual. If we cannot concentrate on the spiritual, we will not be able to fast; the hunger will be too strong for us to resist.

There is, as some have suggested, no reward for simply believing that there was this person named Jesus from Nazareth and there is a God somewhere. That's easy. The change comes when one accepts that Jesus died for our sins. That is in itself an admission that we have sinned; otherwise why would we need to be forgiven? One does not require forgiveness for something one has not done. That in itself causes people to look closer at their life here and realize that all the worldly pleasures are so easily fleeting. Sure, you feel better after yelling obscenities at that old woman who you think shouldn't be driving, but that feeling is gone almost as soon as it appears, and now you have this sin to be forgiven for. Sometimes it is kinda slow to take hold, but that reinforcement of right and wrong does eventually change behavior.

It's not easy to have the kind of faith that Jesus wants us to have... it's a sacrifice indeed. Some of the things we are charged with are pretty hard, like forgiveness. How do you forgive someone who has hurt you badly? Let me tell you, it can be tough to do. How about finding that wallet with $10,000 in it? Jesus says I need to return it... anyone have any idea how hard it is to fork over that kind of moolah?

As for heaven and hell... look, we are already immortal spiritually. We do not just die and go to nothingness. We are still who we are, just without a functioning body. Heaven is not what most think it is; Heaven is a recreation of the Garden of Eden on a larger scale. It is paradise, where we will actually be able to talk face to face with God Himself. As it was before Adam left the Garden of Eden, our bodies will live forever.

Now, I don't know about everyone else, but my idea of Paradise is not being trapped for eternity with other people who will cheat me, injure me, or even try to kill me. If those people are in Heaven, it will not be a heaven for anyone else! Most of our problems here on Earth are the direct result of other people taking advantage of us... that will not be the case in Heaven. Therefore, those who want to destroy society or make life hard for others will not be there. They can't be there.

So where do they go? Somewhere else. Somewhere away from God and His children who believe on him. It has to be that way... and remember, we are already spiritually immortal.

The concept of Hell is intriguing. The Bible doesn't even mention the traditional burning pit of fire and brimstone much... mainly in Revelations, when the Devil (Lucifer) is thrown into the pit with all his fallen angels (demons). It doesn't say people will be thrown in there; it says many people will follow Lucifer in... of their own free will. There are several words in the Hebrew/Greek scrolls that got interpreted as "hell" but strangely enough none of them that I recall actually refer to the pit of fire and brimstone. That's man's interpretation.

Now, I don't have all the answers... I can only go on what is in the Bible. But I do know that the traditional teachings on Heaven and Hell are skewed from what is actually said. The whole point of the Bible being in written form is so people can read it for themselves. Preachers are good and all, but taking the word of any man, even a preacher, at face value is dangerous indeed. That preacher is a man; men can make mistakes.

One last point... true Christianity is far more than just being told we are to believe a certain way. I know of no one, even here in the Bible Belt, who has simply accepted that without any other experiences. No, true Christianity is about not just believing in Jesus, but knowing Jesus personally. One can no more judge another for their relationship with Jesus than one can judge someone for their relationship with their wife... even wife-beaters sometimes look like pillars of the community until those doors close. The closest we can come is by observing what they do in their day-to-day lives... like those bruises on the wife, those little clues will come around. Maybe she fell? Well, maybe that Christian just had a run of bad luck?

So be careful judging a religion by the actions of a few in it. You're no seeing the whole picture. Those people who have turned you against religion because they are constantly living in a state of sinfulness are not following Jesus. They are following themselves, nudged here and there usually by Lucifer, and only mouth what they think sounds good. If one is sincere in their relationship with Jesus, it will show. That's where the good works come in. One does what one wants to do in one's heart, words be damned.

TheRedneck

originally posted by: St0rD

Well, let me tell you something.
The great deception is coming and if you truly believe in God start asking yourself what he truly expects from you right now. Faith isn't enough.

"Be the change you want to see in the world"

Can’t we ask God? You know. Through prayer? Or through Jesus?
Hell. You could even try both and see which one works. What’s the use of a god who is incommunicado? Surely there is some miracle growing in your garden, or singing in your trees, that can show the way to divinity.

Hell is not being in the presence of God.
Sin is shooting your arrow and missing the mark.
Find God in your awareness and take the wind into account when you loose your arrow.

Religion put to shame?
Religion died on the cross with Jesus, religion in relation to Christianity is over
Christians are no longer under the Mosaic law but under grace by faith
Jesus taught those who will choose to follow Him, will have to become servants, to love their enemies, to die for others
Jesus taught that His followers would love and serve because Jesus first loved and served
Religion may have ended but the expectation

The “church” has become lazy and self righteous, Christ’s followers have lost their way and no longer understand the gospel, they serve them selves, no longer the community.

And christianity was never for everybody, offered to everybody but God knew many would not want a relationship with Him

Blame religion or the blind lazy selfish followers

originally posted by: Boadicea
This is often called the "faith vs works" debate in Christianity. Perhaps the easiest way to show the fallacy of the "faith" argument is that the Devil believes in God too so is the Devil going to Heaven?

Actually the devil does not "believe in" God. You have borrowed this argument from James, and his point is that "the devil knows and therefore believes that God exists", which is not the same thing.
There are two kinds of belief, carefully distinuguished in John's gospel.
There is belief "that" a statement is true.
And there is belief "in" the trustability of a person.
Faith in the gospel sense, as promoted by Paul, AND AS PROMOTED BY JAMES HIMSELF (see the beginning and end of his letter), is belief "in".
The devil hasn't got that. He only believes "that" God exists, which isn't enough.

Einstein said it best, but usually it how petty it can be. If anything, any real follower of Christ would be a stone temple that took a 100 years to build, an demolish, instead of a glass house having stones thrown.

Or to throw a punch, one must take one.

Then it ends up being about homosexual sex an how to pray Satan away an the amount of irony behind it own rear.

What about the anti thesis to forgiving them, they know not what they do? What would if they knew what they did?

You make an uncomplicated and therefore often dismissed reasoning, Raggedy.
It’s as true now as it was way back when sir.

a reply to: Raggedyman

a reply to: TerryMcGuire

"Deserve" is such an over-rated word in this sense (and, actually, in most senses). At the very least, it is subjective in every sense. We are here. We are part of the whole -- whatever that is, however one defines it. I don't think it's so much a matter of deserving anything, so much as that we function and exist and make our choices within the same whole, which eventually leads us all to the same place.

One of the reasons I love "the American way" is because in principle and in theory, we attempt to live as a nation according to Natural Law or the laws of the universe. We have free will and free everything (so to speak) because our Creator made us with a will, a consciousness, a mind to think and reason and make choices. It just seems to allow us the greatest opportunity to reach our own potential -- mentally, physically, emotionally and spiritually -- within the same whole.

a reply to: St0rD

You don't sound crazy at all. And all of your points are well taken!

As we are made in God's image, I tend to think that God does have much the same emotions (for want of a better word) as we do, including anger and sadness and joy -- albeit on a much greater and more mature (again, for want of a better word) level. Our best analogy may be that of a parent and child, and as much as we love our children, as much joy and love and satisfaction they give us, they can and do make us angry and disappointed and sad sometimes. For their own benefit, we have to act and react accordingly. But at any time, and every time, as parents we never really give up. If we have to send them to the corner or to their room, the ultimate purpose is not to punish but to teach and to discipline.

I tend to think there is always -- ALWAYS -- an avenue to redemption. Even if we must go to "Hell" for some period of time, I have to believe that we have the power within us to do better, and find our way to a better place. Perhaps figuratively, perhaps literally. But that within our eternity, our hope for doing better is eternal as well.