Watch What Actually Happens On January 6, 2021

originally posted by: Blue_Jay33

originally posted by: AugustusMasonicus

originally posted by: Blue_Jay33
Pence has the power to make this a VERY long day...

..and nothing else so it's all grandstanding.

You might be right......BUT you could also be wrong, apparently devastating new information is being prepared to be put up at that meeting; and that could change everything. The point is Pence has the power to allow the new information to be presented.

And can do nothing about it.. specially now that all credibility is gone... haven in a murder prosses if in the middle the bring new evidence they have to be evaluate and approve before they are presented .

So expect a bunch of conspiracy theory again... Opinion wont change the result of the election only the law can...
so nothing devastating ... Only devastating for republican reputation the world in watching...

a reply to: Gryphon66
I think that you are just plain ignoring what’s going on and denying what Pence has said himself and maybe you do not understand how this actually works. Have you even read article 12 because if this plays out like it seems it’s going to - the constitution tell you exactly the plenary power the president of the senate has

At this point a sizable amount of Americans would simply be ok with presenting evidence available and fighting to uphold their beliefs and life. The belief that the entire system is so corrupt that it has no more redeeming qualities is a real thing. It is sad that we have arrived here.

originally posted by: iwanttobelieve70
At this point a sizable amount of Americans would simply be ok with presenting evidence available and fighting to uphold their beliefs and life.

Then they should get to fighting and stop just talking about it on the internet.

originally posted by: carewemust

originally posted by: NoCorruptionAllowed

originally posted by: carewemust
Breaking..

The (majority Republican) State Legislature of Wisconsin is telling VP Mike Pence that if he throws the state certification of Joe Biden back to them, they have a "resolution" prepared to potentially decertify Joe Biden's Wisconsin "victory".

The Resolution: docs.legis.wisconsin.gov...

That's a very powerful message and evidence testified to by those officials. Excellent news.

Members of Georgia's state legislature sent a letter to VP Mike Pence last evening, asking that he delay certifying Georgia for about 2 weeks.

Contrary to what Sec of State Raffensperger said on 2 TV networks and at his press briefing Monday, there is TONS of evidence that is being investigated. Everything from outright cheating, to gross violation of Georgia's laws by election officials.

Long and well documented lists of those gross violations of their own election laws. And then the outright and blatant cheating.
Trump will still be our president.
What is amazing to me is how MSM and Biden supporters deny everything. Never have I seen anything like this full blown psyop in my life time before. It boggles the mind.

ETA. I am seeing signs that ritual black magic has been used to accomplish this.

a reply to: NoCorruptionAllowed

ETA. I am seeing signs that ritual black magic has been used to accomplish this.

I have the name of that incantation for you right here sir COVID 19

originally posted by: iwanttobelieve70
At this point a sizable amount of Americans would simply be ok with presenting evidence available and fighting to uphold their beliefs and life. The belief that the entire system is so corrupt that it has no more redeeming qualities is a real thing. It is sad that we have arrived here.

Absolutely I'm sure the evidence will be along tomorrow.

originally posted by: NoCorruptionAllowed

originally posted by: carewemust

originally posted by: NoCorruptionAllowed

originally posted by: carewemust
Breaking..

The (majority Republican) State Legislature of Wisconsin is telling VP Mike Pence that if he throws the state certification of Joe Biden back to them, they have a "resolution" prepared to potentially decertify Joe Biden's Wisconsin "victory".

The Resolution: docs.legis.wisconsin.gov...

That's a very powerful message and evidence testified to by those officials. Excellent news.

Members of Georgia's state legislature sent a letter to VP Mike Pence last evening, asking that he delay certifying Georgia for about 2 weeks.

Contrary to what Sec of State Raffensperger said on 2 TV networks and at his press briefing Monday, there is TONS of evidence that is being investigated. Everything from outright cheating, to gross violation of Georgia's laws by election officials.

Long and well documented lists of those gross violations of their own election laws. And then the outright and blatant cheating.
Trump will still be our president.
What is amazing to me is how MSM and Biden supporters deny everything. Never have I seen anything like this full blown psyop in my life time before. It boggles the mind.

ETA. I am seeing signs that ritual black magic has been used to accomplish this.

What's funny is Trump supporters can't believe they are so right and he is still going to win.

The rest of the world can't believe the ignorance of the Trump supporters and how great their inability to accept defeat really is.

I look forward to Jan 20th

originally posted by: djz3ro

originally posted by: iwanttobelieve70
At this point a sizable amount of Americans would simply be ok with presenting evidence available and fighting to uphold their beliefs and life. The belief that the entire system is so corrupt that it has no more redeeming qualities is a real thing. It is sad that we have arrived here.

Absolutely I'm sure the evidence will be along tomorrow.

I think we all know what your reaction would be if it had been Trump and the RNC who had rigged the election blatantly and in your face like this. The MSM and democrats would be in an uproar and going bat sht crazy with it.

Double standard democrats have a history of exactly that, denying when they do it and ridiculing the right when democrats are accused.

It just isn't going to fly any longer. Even if you win you are still going to lose.

originally posted by: NoCorruptionAllowed

originally posted by: djz3ro

originally posted by: iwanttobelieve70
At this point a sizable amount of Americans would simply be ok with presenting evidence available and fighting to uphold their beliefs and life. The belief that the entire system is so corrupt that it has no more redeeming qualities is a real thing. It is sad that we have arrived here.

Absolutely I'm sure the evidence will be along tomorrow.

I think we all know what your reaction would be if it had been Trump and the RNC who had rigged the election blatantly and in your face like this. The MSM and democrats would be in an uproar and going bat sht crazy with it.

Double standard democrats have a history of exactly that, denying when they do it and ridiculing the right when democrats are accused.

It just isn't going to fly any longer. Even if you win you are still going to lose.

This is exactly what it is...Trump and other republican actually are trying to steal the election and start this process before the election...With the sabotage of the post office and calling fraud on mail in voting and telling rep not to used it because they tough they could invalidate all mail in dem vote and win...that exactly what i call a rigged election

and now they resulted to conspiracy theory and seditious act to overturn an election he lost fair an square.

Allowing people to vote is not rigging election...

a reply to: NoCorruptionAllowed

Not at all. 2016 was closer than this, yet the Democrat candidate immediately conceded and with the exception of a handful of nut jobs, we all accepted the results and moved on.

What Trump is doing is sedition. After the phone call with Georgia this weekend, it is clear he is guilty of election tampering.

a reply to: BamaRich

Obviously you do not know how this works. Pence simply counts the certified Electors from each state. Each state only has one slate of certified Electors, these alternative slate of electors are just a publicity stunt.

I am going to repost what I wrote on this thread because it is being ignored.

In order to challenge a states Elector's, a Congressman and Senator have to start the challenge, this will happen but unsure if a Senator can challenge more than one state. This means both the House and Senate will be called to vote on the issue with a majority needed in both to challenge the state's Electors. This is where it stops, because there is no way the House will vote to dismiss the Electors of the states being challenged. It is also unlikely the Senate will get a majority either because every Republican Senator will NOT vote in favor of challenging the electors. You should know this, as it has been explained over and over again.

It looks like they are hoping to challenge up to 5 states...each challenge can take 2 hours or more. It will be a long session.

Polls suggest that somewhere aroun 60% of Americans know that the election was the same as it's always been. This is about par for the course in the last two decades. Some of the time we're at a 60%/40% on any issue, sometimes it's 55/45 and quite often its a point or two away from 50/50.

This is intentional, and this is the way it's always been. It's how the public is managed by the elite. Look back at the last 20 years Presidential Elections. As far as the vote of the People goes, it's usually within a point or two, even for someone like Obama who had a massively successful ground game.

Whether you like the outcome in 2020 or not don't continue to allow yourselves to be ginned up by the media and the political machines (not separate entities.)

Yes, we're "divided" and have been so since the beginning. It's in the nature of our country. It's not new.

Just as our tripartite form of government is designed to diffuse power, so also is the division of the electorate. We are maintained in a balance of anxiety vs. apathy.

Most of us want to be able to take care of our families and live our lives as we see fit. Ask yourself if you're able to do that, and if you can say yes, then you're in good shape.

originally posted by: Blue_Jay33
Every objection made could be greeted from Pence with "I will allow it" that is his power that day.

Actually, there is a wrinkle that I learned about that could very well be part of the plan. I was going to make a separate thread about this, but it fits in perfectly with this thread, so...

Before Louie Goehmert's lawsuit against Pence was thrown out, I actually read it, and there is one part of the relief requested that is extremely pertinent to what is going on, and it is a point that the 12th amendment to the Constitution is clear about, but the Electoral Count Act is (maybe intentionally) vague about.

Here is the excerpt for the relief requested in his lawsuit (this is a link to a PDF:

"11. Accordingly, Plaintiffs respectfully request this Court to issue a declaratory
judgment finding that:
...snip...
C. That, with respect to competing slates of electors from the State of Arizona or other
Contested States, the Twelfth Amendment contains the exclusive dispute
resolution mechanisms, namely, that (i) Vice-President Pence determines which
slate of electors’ votes count, or neither, for that State; (ii) how objections from
members of Congress to any proffered slate of electors is adjudicated; and (iii) if
no candidate has a majority of 270 elector votes, then the House of Representatives
(and only the House of Representatives) shall choose the President where “the
votes [in the House of Representatives] shall be taken by states, the representation
from each state having one vote,” U.S. CONST. amend. XII;"

Now, let's look at the pertinent clause from the 12th amendment:

"The person having the greatest Number of votes for President, shall be the President, if such number be a majority of the whole number of Electors appointed; and if no person have such majority, then from the persons having the highest numbers not exceeding three on the list of those voted for as President, the House of Representatives shall choose immediately, by ballot, the President. But in choosing the President, the votes shall be taken by states, the representation from each state having one vote; a quorum for this purpose shall consist of a member or members from two-thirds of the states, and a majority of all the states shall be necessary to a choice."

And last, the pertinent text of the Electoral Count Act:

"Upon such reading of any such certificate or paper, the President of the Senate shall call for objections, if any. Every objection shall be made in writing, and shall state clearly and concisely, and without argument, the ground thereof, and shall be signed by at least one Senator and one Member of the House of Representatives before the same shall be received. When all objections so made to any vote or paper from a State shall have been received and read, the Senate shall thereupon withdraw, and such objections shall be submitted to the Senate for its decision; and the Speaker of the House of Representatives shall, in like manner, submit such objections to the House of Representatives for its decision; and no electoral vote or votes from any State which shall have been regularly given by electors whose appointment has been lawfully certified to according to section 6 of this title from which but one return has been received shall be rejected, but the two Houses concurrently may reject the vote or votes when they agree that such vote or votes have not been so regularly given by electors whose appointment has been so certified."

So, here's the thing...

The 12th amendment is clear - if no candidate reaches 270, then the HoR votes for President, and does so by State Delegation (not the whole house).

The Electoral Count Act does not change this requirement for the Objections process.

Therefore, all of the yammering about Congress being able to vote on the Objections by simple majority of the whole House is erroneous, and in fact,wrong, and doing so goes against the Constitutional.

I submit to you that any objections referred to Congress for consideration, must be voted on in the exact same manner as prescribed by the 12th Amendment for a contingent election - by State Delegation.

At a minimum, this question needs to be permanently resolved either by the Supreme Court deciding that the same process inherently applies, or by clarification via Constitutional Amendment.

a reply to: tanstaafl

Good info.

So, it's down to The head of the HoR, Vice President M. Pence, Also, Sen C. Grassley, and N. Pelosi ?

I'm from the UK, so not overly familiar with your system of Governance.

originally posted by: maya27
a reply to: tanstaafl

Good info.

So, it's down to The head of the HoR, Vice President M. Pence, Also, Sen C. Grassley, and N. Pelosi ?

I'm from the UK, so not overly familiar with your system of Governance.

So, what should happen is, when any State's Electors are challenged, the House and Senate split and go into closed sessions for minimum of 2 hours of debate, then vote up/down on sustaining the objection (toss/not count the electors) or not. In the case of 'dueling electors', I think, but am not sure, that one of the options is to accept the alternate set of electors.

Everything I've been hearing states that when the House votes on Objections, they do so as a whole house/simple majority, but...

My position is, Pence could, when asking about Objections, make the simple statement that when the House votes, they must do so by State Delegation, not by simple majority, and if he did that, chaos would ensue, but I also argue that he would be on firm Constitutional grounds to do just that.

originally posted by: djz3ro

originally posted by: iwanttobelieve70
At this point a sizable amount of Americans would simply be ok with presenting evidence available and fighting to uphold their beliefs and life. The belief that the entire system is so corrupt that it has no more redeeming qualities is a real thing. It is sad that we have arrived here.

Absolutely I'm sure the evidence will be along tomorrow.

Im sorry but no evidence will be presented tomorrow..
If something is presented it will be some conspiracy theory nothing more
If they have any real evidence they would present them to a court of law
tomorrow they gonna try to appeal to a court of opinion but it wont change nothing there just gonna embarrass them self
only the law can reverse the election and the law don't care about opinions
tomorrow its for the first time ever its sedition live on tv...they should pay per view that.

originally posted by: tanstaafl

originally posted by: maya27
a reply to: tanstaafl

Good info.

So, it's down to The head of the HoR, Vice President M. Pence, Also, Sen C. Grassley, and N. Pelosi ?

I'm from the UK, so not overly familiar with your system of Governance.

So, what should happen is, when any State's Electors are challenged, the House and Senate split and go into closed sessions for minimum of 2 hours of debate, then vote up/down on sustaining the objection (toss/not count the electors) or not. In the case of 'dueling electors', I think, but am not sure, that one of the options is to accept the alternate set of electors.

Everything I've been hearing states that when the House votes on Objections, they do so as a whole house/simple majority, but...

My position is, Pence could, when asking about Objections, make the simple statement that when the House votes, they must do so by State Delegation, not by simple majority, and if he did that, chaos would ensue, but I also argue that he would be on firm Constitutional grounds to do just that.

lol...the only thing he can do is open envelope and give them to the guy that read them...nothing more and specially not change the rule set by the constitution...he as only a ceremonial role nothing more

President Trump confirms this morning that VP Mike Pence has the authority to reject electors from states where significant fraud is suspected, after hearing the evidence.

We'll know more tomorrow 1.6.2021: twitter.com...

At 2 hours (maximum) per objection, tomorrow's session could stretch into Thursday.

originally posted by: THeGreaTZoiD
originally posted by: tanstaafl
"My position is, Pence could, when asking about Objections, make the simple statement that when the House votes, they must do so by State Delegation, not by simple majority, and if he did that, chaos would ensue, but I also argue that he would be on firm Constitutional grounds to do just that."

lol...the only thing he can do is open envelope and give them to the guy that read them.

Really? I think maybe the 12th amendment just might say otherwise.

nothing more and specially not change the rule set by the constitution.

Yes. And the rules are explicit about how the President of the Senate - aka the V.P. - aka, in this case, Mike Pence - is to handle objections to said electoral votes.

he as only a ceremonial role nothing more

Usually his role is just ceremonial, yes - but when objections are raised, he plays a much more important role.

We'll see what happens tomorrow, won't we?