Hydroxychloroquine Still Doesn’t Do Anything, New Data Shows

a reply to: puzzled2

Perhaps it because he also reveals

He's a psychiatrist.

This is how far you've gone with your excuses.

originally posted by: TheRedneck
a reply to: whereislogic

I stand corrected. Seems EGCG is indeed a zinc ionophore.

I would thank you for the assist, but you might consider that an insult too. You seem upset enough already.

No idea what you're getting at with that last part. Not that it's important. To consider something an "insult too" would imply I considered something else as an insult, which I don't think I gave that impression here or how that could be read into anything I said. The situation is similar for my supposed state of being "upset enough already". Huh, upset about you not knowing the research concerning EGCG being a zinc ionophore? Why would I be upset about that? There's nothing wrong with that is there?

I was just a bit puzzled with your statement about not having "found anything that shows ECGC as a zinc ionophore" (assuming you meant EGCG), when the information related to that possibly implied search is so readily available. So that was what my question was about, trying to figure out how that played out. Perhaps you used ECGC in google, if you bothered to google it before making that statement about not having found something that perhaps you didn't even bother to look all that hard for (which also wasn't clear from that statement, the reason I just used the expression "possibly implied search"). Anyway, the whole thing is not that important. I just found it a bit puzzling.

Now I'm puzzled2.

originally posted by: Southern Guardian
a reply to: puzzled2

...
To sum up the article, people have nothing to lose in trying HCQ because it's been used for so long.
...

One shouldn't sum up articles that they haven't read in its entirety. It makes one sort of a pretender giving some people the false impression that they did read in its entirety in order to be able to sum it up honestly and accurately for those of us who may still want to read it, or those who need a slight additional nudge not to read it and properly inform themselves about the subject and not take your word for it (which is wrong btw if referring to the long article linked by puzzled2, I know cause I read it in its entirety, the essay that is, as puzzled2 called it when he linked it).

a reply to: whereislogic

Perhaps I read your reply to me through a lens. I will admit, I do experience some frustration in this thread from certain posters. If I misinterpreted your intent (as it seems I did), I ask your forgiveness... at the time it seemed you were upset with me for not digging deeper.

I did look up EGCG, but I didn't see it stated as a zinc ionophore. After a few pages I stopped and made an assumption that it wasn't. That was inadequate research on my part and I freely admit it. I do thank you for correcting me.

TheRedneck

a reply to: Southern Guardian

Sorry does that mean he he can't write an essay on scientific studies?

You are a anonymous keyboard naysayer, so why would anyone accept you discrediting the article based on nothing in the article merely occupation of the writer.

You need to dismiss the message not the messenger.

Do you understand the essay?
Can you not discuss it?

But anyhow have and nice day.

a reply to: Southern Guardian


SouthernGuardian I have a question for you mate, A hypothetical scenario if you will.

Now I don't know if you've had Covid-19 , but that's not really the point. Ok here's the scenario southern you have Covid-19 it's effecting you particularly bad you require Hospitalization . You have all the classic symptoms Body aches , Fever , dry cough , losing since of smell and taste , Diarrhea etc etc.

Your at the point where your breathing is becoming difficult , patients describe it as not being able to catch your breath no matter how much you inhale. Your at a private hospital like the one I worked in , Your attending Physician suggest the triple therapy Hydroxychloroquine, Erythromycin , Zinc and he wants to start you on Pure 02 right away. He understands the medication is contrversial but he assures you he has used this therapy on many patients and they all recovered.

He says you only have a few days before your breathing deteriorates to the point that a tube must be ran and your put on a respirator .


What do you do Southern ?

a reply to: puzzled2

Sorry does that mean he he can't write an essay on scientific studies?

He can write about being an astronaut for all I care, doesn't make him qualified in that field.

originally posted by: asabuvsobelow

What do you do Southern ?

I'd stay clear of the hypotheticals and stick to topic.

Is the topic the efficacy of HCQ, or the efficacy of propaganda regarding the official narrative?

a reply to: Salander

Is the topic the efficacy of HCQ, or the efficacy of propaganda regarding the official narrative?

The official narrative? From the world's foremost medical experts and bodies?

In place of whom? Maybe you're brave enough to answer. Maybe you'll run away.

a reply to: TheRedneck

It seems to me that we need to "start over" with our understanding of the medical basics, particularly vitamins & minerals.

Many, myself included not that long ago, think that we had really explored them fully. But after pouring through immense amounts of research this year.. we have so, so much to learn.

The pharmaceutical industry isnt "just" motivated by profit, its the means by which they generate that profit that has greatly exacerbated an industry that has become disturbing (frankly).

They have to continuously come up with compounds that can receive new patents. This leads to longer and longer laundry lists of "side" effects, and in many cases, less efficacy of the main purpose compared to compounds that are no longer part of the cycle. Many of these patents are publically funded, but with private profits. Add that there is a pesky level of liability, and its an increasingly unsustainable situation.

Vaccines fit the bill for the next phase here; efficacy is irrelevant, side effects outright dismissed by large portions of the public, and liability is essentially non-existent.

What happens when a global situation gets people looking into it, and something comes to light that would not only disrupt the established patent cycle.. but future plans for a shift to vaccines as the main source of profit?

Well.. they already have a massive marketing/propaganda apparatus. Couple that with data collection (to get real-time feedback of social engineering techniques) and groups like Project VCTR.. and ya might as well pull out all the stops.

Thats putting aside any larger motives as well.

With regards to zinc ionophores/zinc specifically, I think there is a lot of unexplored territory here. It seems that the medications change the membrane potential of cells to facilitate ion transport of, in this case, zinc.

This is a mechanism that might be absolutely revolutionary. Empirical data (dismissed as "anecdotal" nowadays by bureaucrats and media) shows impressive efficacy with stalling/halting viral replication. Could we possibly manipulate the membrane potential of cells for other purposes? In terms of different minerals, possible chelation of undesirable metals, as well as different ailments.

The entire financial interests of a massive industry are at risk here, including future plans within that industry as well as critical aspects of a wider ranging totalitarian agenda (imo), even if we only limit the conversation to HCQ+Zinc.

So, they almost *have* to bring the full weight of the manipulation system to bear. Many get their information about the world solely from bureaucrats and propaganda media, so all it takes is a cohesive Narrative in a manipulation system that is predicated on cohesive Narratives.

Meaning.. That system is at risk as well. As far as I can tell, this is "it," maybe out of necessity if nothing else. They need to push for the totalitarian system, or risk losing it all. If people started to actually question the media, started to go direct to sources (research papers, original footage, etc.) and realized how extensively they have been lied to, every day for years.. Well, its no surprise that this has become a mad scramble to keep people as off-balance as possible.

That desperation concerns me greatly. There was a chance to change course months ago, when public data began to make The Virus situation clearer than ever.. But they doubled down and continue to do so.

Far as I can tell, it all hinges on a single drug. And, they have to spin people off into a comprehensive manufactured reality as quickly as possible, where "truth" is solely dispensed by the bureaucratic & media priesthood, without eradicating the trust they have built by pushing too far, too quickly.

a reply to: asabuvsobelow

What do you do Southern ?

From earlier in the thread, he apparently builds telescopes but doesn't know how to use them.

I find it interesting that he questions everyone in the thread about their "qualifications" but won't reveal anything about his. I can only assume he spends all day thinking about different ways to bash people recovering from a disease.

TheRedneck

a reply to: TheRedneck

I find it interesting that he questions everyone in the thread about their "qualifications" but won't reveal anything about his

Because I know my place in a debate about medical knowledge and experience and consistently refer to those most qualified, hence my background is irrelevant. Unfortunately, some people, like you, deem it necessary to pretend you're otherwise.

a reply to: Serdgiam

There is a push that was ongoing a few years back at UAB (the top research hospital in the area; it is on the same order as some more well-known research hospitals in the nation such as St. John's, John Hopkins, and the Mayo Clinic... the difference is that media tends to not credit UAB because, well, it's in Alabama and we're still picking our tooth with sticks we found on the ground and dragging our knuckles around, you know?) to put more emphasis on older and less intense medications. The cocktail my wife uses for her migraines came from this effort. It's nothing official, but many of the research students there I have spoken to seemed more interested in discovering the why behind the medication efficacy and are less interested in the what. That has led to a couple of cancer studies that are being looked at in some of those other research hospitals.

UAB has limited facilities at UAH to interact with the engineering department to assist in testing and studies.

That's a good thing IMO, but there is an official push-back: money. Schools make a lot of money from patents, and they actively promote projects that can result in these profits. Oftentimes a patent from a pharmaceutical will ride on a patent from a school, meaning the school gets their cut of the profit. It's similar to how schools profit from engineering and scientific grants, but a little more complex and definitely more lucrative.

I became pretty close with one student who lived not far from me. He was not a computer expert; he was well able to use them, but when something went wrong he was lost. I, on the other hand, was pretty adept at the state of the art at the time and he came to me for help. He was working on Parkinson's (seems to be a big thing there at the time) and we spoke at length about his research. He was trying to understand the cause of the disease itself on the biochemical level, not looking for a new medicine to treat it. His work was, to say the least, quite impressive.

I spoke at length with another student at one of the exposes. They were attached to UAB as well, and were working on the role of chemical signals in various forms of cancer. I will admit, she was a little over my head with the terminology, but I could grasp enough of her explanations to understand what she had done. Her work gives me hope that we will soon have an actual cure for cancer... and none of it was based on medication. All her work was based on chemical balance at the site of cancerous growth and supplemental methods to correct it.

So while I agree with everything in your post, know that there are some very bright people working on a different, more natural, and more effective route.

TheRedneck

a reply to: Southern Guardian

Because I know my place

Apparently not. It's over there in the corner, listening to those who know what they are talking about.

TheRedneck

a reply to: TheRedneck

It's over there in the corner, listening to those who know what they are talking about.

But you clearly don't know what you're talking about, hence your little hiccup with something as simple as recognizing Malaria is a parasitic disease. I stay clear of trying to interpret medical studies conducted by highly experienced individuals in that relevant field. I refer to the appropriate bodies and individuals. I'm consistent in that regard. You pretend to have the background and knowledge, and insist upon these as having some sort of authority on these matters, which is well outside reality. Delusional at worst.

a reply to: Southern Guardian

Aw, you're cute... OK, I got a little time for some humor.

The only thing I have claimed expertise in is being able to read and understand medical reports, and being familiar with how scientific studies are conducted. The rest is your interpretation of what you wanted me to say. And in those two areas... yes, I do know what I am talking about.

You do not, and have not only demonstrated you do not by failing to understand what a parameter is, but also by actually admitting that you are unable to read the studies I posted from the NIH that you then turned around and claimed were never posted!

Son, you have been nothing more than a joke with a pitiful punchline throughout this entire thread. Your hypocrisy is epic and thus your opinions are completely irrelevant and unworthy of anything other than jeers of laughter.

You have even called into question your very morality by continually stating, not in actual words but in intent, that you prefer people to die before they get a treatment that you deem is somehow wrong, despite first-hand testimony from people actually involved in the treatment.

You have nothing of substance to offer... nothing whatsoever. Your assertions are political punditry, your references are misinterpreted, and your claims are baseless. Your comments in this thread are something one might expect on Yahoo or Facebook, not on ATS.

For all that, you have become comic relief, nothing more. The more you fight against that title now, the more comical you become. Some people don't know how to quit while they're behind.

TheRedneck

a reply to: TheRedneck

The only thing I have claimed expertise in is being able to read and understand medical reports

Throughout this thread you've insisted upon your knowledge and background in relation the science behind treatment for COVID-19, even above the likes of Dr Birx and Fauci. You've also continued to dismiss the findings and concensus expressed by major medical bodies, globally. You are by all definitions an armchair expert on the internet.

Someone who claims to know all the answers to a problem, situation or scenario but has little or no experience or real understanding of it. Usually found on internet forums or writing in the letters section of tabloid newspapers. When faced with educated people who disassemble their argument with facts, they often state they learned their experience at the "University of life".

Source

I'll once again remind you of your irrelevance in the grand scheme of things. There's a reason you're stuck here, and the qualified people are out there actually doing something about this pandemic.

originally posted by: Southern Guardian
originally posted by: asabuvsobelow

What do you do Southern ?

I'd stay clear of the hypotheticals and stick to topic.

lol Yea I kinda figured it would be a cold day in hell before you answered that question .

But maybe you should give it some thought Southern , a Desperate Covid patient confined to a bed in the Hospital knowing the impending doom of a respirator is quickly approaching .

You cling to hope knowing there are medications you could try but the Doctors hands are tied he dare not risk his license treating you with HydroxyChloroquine in a state ran hospital. This was the scenario for thousands of patients in New York City they lay dying slowly smothering to death with a tube down there throat , you see it wasn''t Covid-19 that killed them it was the Doctors ignorance and fear , it was the Political leadership of NYC failing these patients watching them die knowing they could have treated them .

It's people like you southern you've let the media and Political bias creep into your mind manipulating you into believing a harmless medicine is poison a medicine that before this pandemic you Southern didn't even know existed and here you sit arguing it's effectiveness based on bias political studies .

You think because you Google HydroxyChloroquine and you copy/paste all these studies that show negative results it means someting ? how can you be so blind man ? There obviously censoring search results Southern .

This medicine this Triple Therapy could have saved thousands of lives THOUSANDS of lives.

a reply to: asabuvsobelow

You cling to hope knowing there are medications you could try but the Doctors hands are tied he dare not risk his license treating you with HydroxyChloroquine

Don't think I've ever expressed opposition against ones choice to use HCQ freely, as they please. I'm a firm believer in choice with regards to these matters. The OP isn't concerned with this end of the debate but rather the facts at hand behind HCQ's actual effectiveness, which to date, neither you nor others have managed to show.