Ukrainian 737 down in Iran

Iran has automated, radar tracked air defence systems. They are German made Skyguard system, designed to protect bases and airfields etc.

From 2014,

Skyguard is a laser-based air defense system to protect airports and other areas against a variety of military threats, including short-range ballistic missiles, short- and long-range rockets, artillery shells, mortars, drones and cruise missiles.

Earlier today, Iran tested its home-made mid-range Shalamcheh missiles fired from its new air defense system, Mersad, which is capable of destroying different types of modern fighter jets and drones.

en.farsnews.com...

Skyguard is a compact and autonomous ground-based short range air defense system intended to protect military facilities. The air defense system comprises a fire control/search radar unit, up to three 4-cell missile launchers and a twin-barrel 35mm gun.

www.deagel.com...

It wouldn't be much of a stretch to suggest that an automated air defence system would be protecting the airport on a day like today. hmmm

a reply to: weirdguy

Just a niggle. Skyguard was originally developed by the Swiss; now associated with Germany because RheinMetall bought out Oerlikon Contraves.

The 35-mm GDF cannon's projectiles have an effective ceiling of 4000 meters.

Cheers

a reply to: weirdguy

German? Didn't they just fly to Iran on a peaceful mission? Good God this thread is getting weirder and weirder. The whole missile bombardment seems like a fluff piece now.

Off to sleep! I got a crooked lip and eyebrows to match. WTF actually took place today. Yesterday?

Claims on Twitter that the civil aviation authority "Orgas" will refuse to give the black boxes to Boeing twitter.com... also claims the Ukrainian airline has withdrawn claims that the engines were at fault. twitter.com... and some arabic sites just before 6am this morning were attributing this crash to an Iranian missile..

The skin on a 737 is relatively thin, but it's not that thin, not like beer can thin. It actually takes a surprising amount of force to puncture / pierce a hole through it. Uncontained engine failures sometimes throw debris, but I've never seen or heard of them puncturing something as far back as the tail. Plus, the wing would tend to shield the tail from a direct impact.

Could the hole in the tail have been caused from something else? Sure, but coupled with the similar holes in the fuselage this seems unlikely.

News reports say "mechanical failure". I'd say, 'yeah, like some sort of an explosive device going off in the immediate vicinity of the aircraft causing that mechanical failure'.

Just my .02

A night SAM launch would leave an exhaust glow wouldnt it and make the missile more visible?
None was seen in the video..Trying to find an online video of one being night launched to show..
Not all SAMS have rod projectile warheads though,some are fragmentation and would leave ragged edges..
Engine debris goes out radially from the centrifugal forces..Maybe a fuel tank exploded while breaking apart damaging the rudder and vert fin..

a reply to: Blackfinger

Shrapnel from the aircraft itself isn't going to leave that pattern seen in the pictures. The only way it would leave holes in the tail like that is if the shrapnel turns in midair and comes back at the tail.

One of the Iranian investigators said that it appears the crew was unable to communicate with air traffic control before it crashed.

www.cbc.ca...

a reply to: Zaphod58

Also saw that all data from the aircraft stopped almost immediately after takeoff. Seems odd.

Could be fake news coming from Iran though, trying to do damage control.

I wonder if they maybe had some sort of an electrical failure, which shut off their transponder, and they have missile batteries trained to fire at anything without a transponder?

Dbl

Triple!

a reply to: Flyingclaydisk

That's a very real possibility. If a radar operator saw an aircraft without a transponder near Tehran they may have fired without trying to identify it through other means. They possibly could have thought it was a retaliation for their attack. Press TV announced earlier that six American fighters from the Deid were heading towards Iran.

Suicide mission from onboard passenger charged with making sure certain select passengers did not leave as attempted.

Holes are the key - keyholes if you like.

By passenger - that's someone other than the pilot - including cockpit crew.

a reply to: CthruU

Except that the only way you get that shrapnel pattern is something outside the aircraft.

a reply to: Woody510

I've read that this model of airliner has had issues in the past, but still...

I am not an air crash investigator, I'll leave that to the professionals, but we definitive proof that the world has gone mad.

High probability Iran shot it down by accident with 82 Iranians onboard. With no black box comms I would say it's 99.9% they screwed up big time with their protocols. Turned on defense systems without checking with outgoing flights first or just said screw it and assumed no flights were leaving after a rocket volley. One thing is for sure though, 100% chance Democrats blame it on Trump. If he would have just let them attack the embassy and kill some lowly contractor none of this would have happened.

a reply to: Thecakeisalie

The 737-800 has a pretty good record. It's had something like 12 incidents, including several that were runway excursions or ground accidents resulting in no fatalities.

originally posted by: Zaphod58
a reply to: CthruU

Except that the only way you get that shrapnel pattern is something outside the aircraft.

Yes indeed - after the fact when it's already on the ground, why do the holes look fresh on the inside circumference? Shouldn't they be tarnished like the rest of the wreckage?

a reply to: CthruU

Not necessarily no. Not all of them were exposed to high heat like the rest of the wreckage. What would be the point of adding shrapnel holes after the fact?

I wonder if Iran shot down the plane in hopes to blame it on the USA since they were hearing rumors of an incoming Air raid to Iran on some news media tweeter feeds...

Anyway engine failure via SAM missile is more likely, I wonder if the USA has any military radar pointing in that general direction (Likely) that might have recorded something, they could share it with the Iranian people and the rest of the world to help them figure out what really happened...