The American Civil War of 2005 as predicted by John Titor

Originally posted by SkepticOverlord

Originally posted by Roth Joint
Dear Moderator,

I'm one of the owners of AboveTopSecret.com, LLP.

To demand us to stop talking about tasers because YOU think it is irrelevant to John Titor's "prediction" does not mean it is irrelevant in OUR perception

In an effort to maintain an orderly structure of easily discovered content, the request stands. If you honestly believe your theory to be important, then it will be better served by a new, dedicated thread.

I understand. I will take this in consideration.

Roth.

Ahhhh…the back and forth of the believers and the skeptics…music to my ears.
I have been following JT since he started this trip, the end point is, to some is a few days away, to others it is still years. For Me?...it has already come and gone, I do believe in JT, I also think that there is percentage difference between our TL and his. Do I believe that what he says is going to happen? A lot of it has already, but most people don’t want to hear that. Especially about the good OL’ US of A. I wonder who could tell me how the civil war started?(the one in the 1800’s ;0))..and how the folks felt about it then?.did they really think that is was starting or did they just wonder until the first troops fought? I am not a scientist or even know that much about it. I do know that if you get past all of that, and this is where most folks blow the gaskets, it rings true. It might not have then, but is sure does now. Being that I was a soldier, and grew up with out power and running water, in a smaller community, I guess it is just the way he described things that rang true. If you lived all of you life with power and water, you might not see it that way. I hope that the 2% percent or so he talked about will be enough to head us another way. I guess in 2008 and we all need bike tires we can say for sure. Here is one for the fuel too..take a look at Wi-FI…look into how the HotSpots work..Oregon is a great place to start.

Domestic spying, worse it that it is vigorously defended by Bush supporters.

Torture and Rendidtion, again defended.

War on Terror = War on Islam.

Fear does some strange things to a population. Not sure how far some will go to feel safe again.

Originally posted by Valhall
Okay, here is the skinny on the AnnaMC post. It was deleted in error while a moderator was attempting to edit the offensive language out. Since at least two of you have the quoted post in your posts, no information has been lost.

Please take notice that more than likely either a moderator of this forum, or a supermoderator will come along and edit out the the portion of your quotes which were attempts at circumnavigating the language filters. So when that happens...please point your tinfoil hats in another direction. The substance of the quotes will remain intact.

Roth - If you can't figure out what SO is trying to tell you, we may have a slight problem. Arguing over two pages about whether Tazers or guns are a more violent or egregious manner in which to lose your life in an altercation with law enforcement is NOT what the intent of this thread is. I don't think we need to belabor that point anymore.

My post about that post (quoted by Roth in 1867296) was neither offensive, nor any more off topic than the quoted post about that post, yet it too is gone? Its one thing to want to change the direction of a discussion, its another to just disappear the public record. I can understand a mod accidently deleting a post, but c'mon now, its like rewriting history.

the next civil war isn't going to happen for a long time. and i suspect one of the parties trying to break away from this nation will be "white nationalists" aka nazis/white supremecists. also, titor seemed to imply that the nation that would rise would run off of a system similar to the articles of confederation, yet somehow work.

Originally posted by Mainer
My post about that post (quoted by Roth in 1867296) was neither offensive, nor any more off topic than the quoted post about that post, yet it too is gone? Its one thing to want to change the direction of a discussion, its another to just disappear the public record. I can understand a mod accidently deleting a post, but c'mon now, its like rewriting history.

If you check back on page 90 you will see that I've edited some posts explaining the mistaken removal of a post. I did then edit out some off topic posts, in an effort to get this discussion back on track. The quoted post stands and is still there.

Again, the original post is preserved in a quote.

Please, staff are not perfect. and we do make mistakes.

You are always free to use the gripe forum to submit a complaint about this or any board issue, without disruption of a discussion.

Take this as a final warning. Stay on topic




[edit on 18-12-2005 by UM_Gazz]

Originally posted by Valhall
Okay, here is the skinny on the AnnaMC post. It was deleted in error while a moderator was attempting to edit the offensive language out. Since at least two of you have the quoted post in your posts, no information has been lost.

Please take notice that more than likely either a moderator of this forum, or a supermoderator will come along and edit out the the portion of your quotes which were attempts at circumnavigating the language filters. So when that happens...please point your tinfoil hats in another direction. The substance of the quotes will remain intact.

Roth - If you can't figure out what SO is trying to tell you, we may have a slight problem. Arguing over two pages about whether Tazers or guns are a more violent or egregious manner in which to lose your life in an altercation with law enforcement is NOT what the intent of this thread is. I don't think we need to belabor that point anymore.

Thank you for making that clear Valhall.
I would like to point out though that I myself did have reservations concerning "AnnaMCs" post because of the last sentence. I appeared to me quite unusual that a person posting a death of a brother would use such wording so shortly afterwards. On the otherhand my judgement led me to leave that uncommented just in case the message should be truthful.
After the disappearance of the original post I wasn't quite sure if it just might have been a kind of "hoax" to break up the focusing on tasers and guns.
I also accept the "red card" concerning one of my posts. But I would like to point out that I do know why I mentioned that. I have already stated that I have living relatives in Canada, USA, UK and in Germany. Among these are a US Diplomat, 2 high ranking German officers of the German Bundeswehr, a Dr. and professor of a very famous university and several other highly regarded and well educated personalities.
Please excuse me if my "red card" post made the impression that I might have gone too far. But I am well experienced enough to tell when it's time to log off a sight before a serious discussion turns into plain nonsense or a real threat. To make myself perfectly clear for anyone on this thread, I would like to add this to whom it may concern:
I enjoy any kind of discussion here as long as it stays friendly and nobody gets the impression that they needlessly get forced or pushed around to believe in anything they cannot believe or comprehend. In this sense I always hope to be within the allowed rules of the owners of this site. Up to a certain point I do have a great sense of humor. But there is also a point where we have to be serious and be aware that we might also be hurting a person's feelings up to a point where they may fall into great distress or worse. For these reasons I try to balance my writing as good as possible and explain myself to the best of my own knowledge. This goes for posters, moderators and owners ALIKE. I do not wish to be a nusance of any kind, no matter where I go or am on the internet.
I have personal responsabilities of my very own, also regarding all members of my family, relatives including their very own friends and business partners alike and where ever they may be and that includes those that I do not even know in person. It is just a short time ago when I was on a forum, when I started to be insulted, threatened and towards the end there were even attempts to blackmail me using false accusations by the owner of that sight. That is the point where I have to make a decision of my very own to protect myself. In that case I was forced to forward all evidence over to the authorities to make it unmistakenably clear that these false accucations have
nothing to do on PUBLIC BOARD. I'm sorry to add that their site was taken down by the law of the foreign country it was registered in.

I'm still very sorry about that since all of them were very nice people, but the law in that case does not allow anyone to descriminate others who live in other countries and who they themselves are subject to laws different than the ones the owners themselves live under. I did not invent the laws of other countries, but I am also aware that some of the information I post might be unlawful if I do post it on a PUBLIC BOARD. I do not know all the laws of every country I go to surf, but in certain cases I could be accussed of being a terrorist. In the true sense of those laws anyone, anywhere might in that case THINK that I have broken the laws of their country and by law have to report this wrongdoing to the authorities on notice.

In the past ten years I have received murder threats and even threats to murder my son and so on and so forth. In all cases I can only pass all information on to the German authorities that are allowed to investigate the cases. So anyone reading this please be aware of the fact that I would rather break off the line of communication before I consider this very last measure to protect myself and my next of kin from becoming a target of emotionaly guided derailment. Believe me all, it is as the owner of this site has stated, it is not worth it to stress a point beyond acceptance. If someone cannot believe then just let go and leave it up to time. Even John Titor told you so and that is a very true and truthful statement. No matter if he is or was real or not. The MEANING makes the difference, not the one individual who repeated a UNIVERSAL TRUTH.

Thank you all for allowing me to state this opinion. The truth will live on forever no matter if I said it or anyone else. The TRUTH is the TRUTH, no matter what language spoken and under which earthly law. Need I say more?
Yours truely
Peter Paul, may the TRUTH find you where ever you may be
G-d bless

well, there are only a handful of days until the end of 2005, and the credibility of John Titor.
Considering this should have been killed at the end of 2004, I would think any rational, logical conclusion would have to be that the lack of monthly waco type events, and the complete and total nonexistence of a civil war in america means the whole thing was a clever hoax.

Should you disagree, kindly make a case for 11 waco events that occured this year, and demonstrate organized groups engaged in combat

txs

Waco type events could better be described as Naked abuse of federal powers. This could explain the inclusion of Ruby Ridge and Elian later in the discusion. The consequences of the ATF raid on Waco brought a new outrage to what people already believed was a goverment out of control.

If you look at Waco in this way, there are many examples in the last 12 months of "Waco Type" events. Just look at the domestic spying abuse of the executive branch, or Terri Schivo(sp). These revelations have been coming to light in a regular pattern since the conclusion of the 2004 elections.

[edit on 19-12-2005 by FernandoPoo]

Originally posted by Lurch

Originally posted by peterpaul
Roth, please, try to calm down a bit. You're getting way too emotional. Don't keep asking TJW for any proof of any kind, because even so, we are talking about casualties, REAL people, REAL lives. And of course those who are no more.

We can't handle the future if we lose our patience and ability to stay calm in the face of a storm. Gather strenght for what is coming next.
I have a list of over 800 concentration camps that have been built in America and Canada over the last 10 years. Each has the capacity of about 20.000 people, one is even for 2 MIO. Now add those figures and you can guess that this has been a long time plan. And that is not even counting the underground facilities. This is beyond civil war. This is a round-up.
Peace be with you all
Peter Paul

I'd be interested if you could post this list (or at least a fraction of it). Also, where/whom did you get this information from?

Here is a link to check it out youtself. There are many more reports on subjects relating to todays politics. It's run by former Senator Tim Ferguson who served in the Maryland State.

fergusonreport.myonlinepublication.com...

Originally posted by syrinx high priest
well, there are only a handful of days until the end of 2005, and the credibility of John Titor.
Considering this should have been killed at the end of 2004, I would think any rational, logical conclusion would have to be that the lack of monthly waco type events, and the complete and total nonexistence of a civil war in america means the whole thing was a clever hoax.

Should you disagree, kindly make a case for 11 waco events that occured this year, and demonstrate organized groups engaged in combat
txs

This is for my very special "friend" sryinx high priest who is so desperatly in search of "proof" (whatever that may be....).

www.abovetopsecret.com...

One doesn't have to go that far sryinx to find all sorts of occasions where Waco typ events might be happening. Maybe you should consider doing some research and analysing for yourself and post something worthwhile to debate that just might be part of a civil war going on.

Peter Paul

Originally posted by peterpaul

Originally posted by syrinx high priest
well, there are only a handful of days until the end of 2005, and the credibility of John Titor.
Considering this should have been killed at the end of 2004, I would think any rational, logical conclusion would have to be that the lack of monthly waco type events, and the complete and total nonexistence of a civil war in america means the whole thing was a clever hoax.

Should you disagree, kindly make a case for 11 waco events that occured this year, and demonstrate organized groups engaged in combat
txs

This is for my very special "friend" sryinx high priest who is so desperatly in search of "proof" (whatever that may be....).

www.abovetopsecret.com...

One doesn't have to go that far sryinx to find all sorts of occasions where Waco typ events might be happening. Maybe you should consider doing some research and analysing for yourself and post something worthwhile to debate that just might be part of a civil war going on.

Peter Paul

PP, I thought you had just advocated a kinder, gentler debate in a prior post, why the aggression here ?

I would like to humbly submit that providing a link to a camp fema set up for katrina survivors is hardly proof of 11 waco typo events this year. And you totally ignored the little detail that no civil war is happening in america in 2005. I'm sorry if you consider a point of view that is different than your own worthless.

I think its a reasonable position to take that a waco event is a large scale confrontation between citizens and the federal gov't that ends in violence or riots or many deaths. Please show 11 examples of this. JT mentioned it did get media coverage, it shouldn't be that hard.

As a quick thought, even if that was going to be future, wouldn't John Titor coming here and telling us about it change it? Since we know what he (supposedly) said, wouldn't we try to avoid it?

Originally posted by FernandoPoo
Waco type events could better be described as Naked abuse of federal powers. This could explain the inclusion of Ruby Ridge and Elian later in the discusion. The consequences of the ATF raid on Waco brought a new outrage to what people already believed was a goverment out of control.

If Titor mean Waco type events as just abuse of power or police brutality then he would have used some other examples beside Waco. He didn't. So that leaves us with the conclusion that a Waco type event is an event like unto Waco.
Pitting a group of people against the Government in an event in which both sides actually fight. If Titor meant something less than that, then why would he mention Waco? And if Waco didn't cause a civil war, why would anyone thing anything less than Waco would cause one?

When he mentioned Ruby Ridge and Elian, he was talking about how the media would cover the civil war. He said they would cover the war like that covered those events.

Originally posted by JBurns
As a quick thought, even if that was going to be future, wouldn't John Titor coming here and telling us about it change it? Since we know what he (supposedly) said, wouldn't we try to avoid it?

Yeah, tends to be ignored by the Titorites though...

He says a couple times that we can stop it.
And he's also from a different world line , and since no two are the same....it's impossible for what happened in his world line to happen here like he said it.

Originally posted by ThatsJustWeird
If Titor mean Waco type events as just abuse of power or police brutality then he would have used some other examples beside Waco.

I can't think of a more known event to use as an example. Even with the stand off, the underlying problem was that they shouldn't have started it to begin with. After the events of Waco, public perception of Federal influence shifted and people became less trusting of it.

And what about the rash of Militia stand offs after Waco. If he was trying to bring the image of armed groups, I would have thought those would have been a better example.

Originally posted by JBurns
As a quick thought, even if that was going to be future, wouldn't John Titor coming here and telling us about it change it? Since we know what he (supposedly) said, wouldn't we try to avoid it?

He said that it was a good thing for the humanity and that he didn't want to change it. I think he means that the war cleared the people like the majority of us, those who just live for money and for a personnal benefice.

This kind of thinking would be real if the world war 3 happenned, because the way his society is now working. Because in his times, they considers us as dirty people with no real ethic of those kind of things.

as sad as it may be, i think he would be right....a nuclear holocaust would be a benefit...not to the environment..that would suck, but to the general "get outta my way" attitude of 90% of the people on this rock

How many times have you cursed somone on the freeway for driving 30 over the speed limit, cuttin people off, including you, just to get 1/2 mile ahead and exit?

How many times have you been bumped into or pushed away rudely while shopping by someone who has more "important" things to do than you...

How many times have you been standing somewhere in a line, while the guy or girl in front of you screws around holding things up talking on the cell phone?

These are just a couple examples....people as a whole don't really give a damn about what happens to one-another...we are so desensitized to violence, greed, money, and hateful towards one another, that even the slightest comment makes most people want to go off on a rant, or get physical..

My question is why?

**sidebar**

with the aftermath of 9/11, we saw the coming together of our country (albeit for a short time) stronger than anything i have ever seen in my life. All races, religions, and genders were affected. We generally cared for those thousands of miles away, who we have never met, and never will in most cases.

**

All i'm saying....is that if there is a war, then i say let it go....
maybe the people that are left, will have more respect for thier lives, and those around them...and just maybe...religion will have joined, instead of divided us.

We’re seeing clearly now that Bush thought 9/11 gave him license to act like a dictator, or in his own mind, no doubt, like Abraham Lincoln during the Civil War.

From Newsweek

The President or "leader" in 2005 I believe tried desperately to be the next Lincoln and hold the country together but many of their policies drove a larger wedge into the Bill of Rights.

From Wikipedia's John Titor

Just something interesting to note. < 2 weeks to go!

Originally posted by Mainer

We’re seeing clearly now that Bush thought 9/11 gave him license to act like a dictator, or in his own mind, no doubt, like Abraham Lincoln during the Civil War.

From Newsweek

The President or "leader" in 2005 I believe tried desperately to be the next Lincoln and hold the country together but many of their policies drove a larger wedge into the Bill of Rights.

From Wikipedia's John Titor

Just something interesting to note. < 2 weeks to go!

I think this is bringing it closer to the description of a civil war then most other posts. The same goes to Kingalbrechts post. By looking into society you can tell that the situation as a whole is far from being at one or united. The interests of each and everyone of us is so scattered and different that even on this string it is difficult to reach a point of agreement.

Some would say the problems are psychological. I prefer to use the word spiritual which almost means the same thing. Psych is the Greek word for soul, where as spirit is something beyond that.

Now looking into the John Titor message as a whole from beginning to end it has an impact on my soul. But it will not have the same meaning for others. Once you start studying the details closer, some of them automatically will become more dominante than others. One of the themes therein has become this string, emphasizing the CIVIL WAR in America.

But would a civil war today look the same or be comparable to a civil war in the 1800s? Look at what we have today: cars, trucks, radio, television, internet, satellites, telephones. 200 years ago you were lucky to own a horse and saddle. And in many cases people were lucky if they were even able to read and write. America was in the making. Today it is at the peak of it's power. But the difference between rich and poor is ... undescribable.

Now what could John Titor have meant by us being able to prevent WWIII? The ground is prepared. All it needs is another attack comparable with 9/11 to make the situation worse. And what do we really know about those that have already withdrawn from society to prepare themselves for a civil war? Does anyone really think these people would ever come onto this string and admit that they ready to battle the odds? If I were one of them I would have gone underground years ago.

Peter Paul