Beyond Bigelow & BAASS, After AATIP and on To the Stars...

The greatest spokesperson for Ufology:

Did someone post this already? Looks like a great site for some more digging.

1. During the period April 2009 to January 2010 we know that MUFON via its STAR group were indeed sending UAP reports to BAASS.

2. The open literature, reports that BAASS employee Gary Hernandez was investigating UAP reports.

3. The US Federal Aviation Authority (FAA) were referring UAP reports to BASS during the period 2009 to 2012.

4. A BAASS Investigator/Security Officer wrote that he "Investigated paranormal activity." Plus two security officers employed by BAASS in September 2010, did tours of duty at Robert Bigelow's NE Utah range, where a range of paranormal activity was described by these two employees.

5. One August 2009 employee in his list of duties, speaks of "Perform field measurements collecting data regarding ionizing radiation as well as performing chemical/metal/soil and spectrum analysis across the United States..."

This work could be argued to be that of researching physical trace evidence associated with UAP.

6. Lastly, but most importantly, former Senator Harry Reid, who instigated the AATIP/AAWSAP says that AATIP studied UFOs. In a tweet dated 8 December 2019, Las Vegas journalist George Knapp cited former Senator Harry Reid as recently stating:

"AATIP was my program. One can say whatever, but the truth is it was for only one purpose - to study UFOs."

7. Based on the above, I can see two possibilities. Either BAASS was simultaneously running with the AAWSAP contract, and also conducting its own UAP investigations; or the AAWSAP work did indeed involve researching UAP. On the basis of what I have learned, I suggest that the latter is true, which is contrary to recent statements from Pentagon spokesperson Susan L Gough.
By Keith Basterfield

Yes, indeed, BAASS' AAWSAP contract did, in part, investigate UAP

A while ago, I located a copy of the Freedom of Information Act (FOIA) request log for the Defense Intelligence Agency (DIA) for 2018. This covered requests submitted between 1 October 2017 and 30 September 2018. The 1 October 2018 to 30 September 2019 log, is as of today, not yet posted to the DIA website.

The 2018 log is full of requests for information about the Advanced Aerospace Threat Identification Program (AATIP). Later, when the alternative name, Advanced Aerospace Weapon System Applications Program (AAWSAP) was revealed by Melbourne researcher Paul Dean, individuals started to ask the DIA for information about AAWSAP.

As of today, I am aware of only one final DIA response to the dozens of AATIP/AAWSAP related FOIA requests.

Dr Steven Aftergood, of the Federation of American Scientists, in a blog post titled "More Light on Black programs To Track UFOs" dated 17 January 2019, advised receipt of a DIA response to his FOIA request dated 15 August 2018. He had requested [request 00239] a "copy of the list that was recently transmitted to Congress of all DIA products produced under the Advanced Aerospace Threat and Identification Program contract." The DIA provided such a list.

The DIA, FOIA, and the AATIP/AAWSAP

a reply to: PublicOpinion

It is a good site from down under and they've even used the previous threads to this one as a source for a blog or two.

For example : Link 1 and Link 2

It's not for the twitter generation though. You have to read it rather than look at it.

originally posted by: celltypespecific
Now that BIG lue and BLACKVAULT are working together...expect more successfull FOIA reponses!!!

Even if this was the case then this would have no influence over FOIA responses.

But if are trying to imply that Lue would be able to provide information leading to better FOIA requests then you should remember that he could have provided the details to anyone else in the past two years as well.

So Big Lue and Black Vault are working together? Can you supply the source of that information?

Isn’t there a massive implication that your all missing?

I was gonna pipe up and say this months ago but everyone seemed so preoccupied with the Black Vault and their investigations into the paper work surrounding the released videos that it seemed like I’d be vilified for speaking up. Now that’s all dying down I fed the time is right to say....


Let’s just assume (hypothetically) that Tom Delong has been speaking truth for the past decade regarding this topic.
He spent all his spare time in Blink 182 reading every book on the phenomenon, made some assumptions and went looking for anyone in the know that could confirm his suspicions.
His suspicions being:

1. The ufo phenomenon is real and has large scale global implications.

2. The ufo phenomenon is actively involved in our development and there are governments and on this planet that know this and are working to combat it (despite senior members of the government condemning study of this topic as demonic).

3. The phenomenon is what ancient people called gods and humanity is a cargo cult.


He makes contact with people in the know, firstly General William Mcasland.
For those who don’t know:

Maj. Gen. William N. McCasland is the Commander, Air Force Research Laboratory, Wright-Patterson Air Force Base, Ohio. He is responsible for managing the Air Force's $2.2 billion science and technology program as well as additional customer funded research and development of $2.2 billion. He is also responsible for a global workforce of approximately 10,800 people in the laboratory's component technology directorates, 711th Human Performance Wing and the Air Force Office of Scientific Research.


So yeah, probably in the know. He high tails once the wiki leaks emails hit the web and Tom is left high and dry. He is undoubtedly the General that have him his line on the Cold War being a product of the phenomenon and how they “found a life form” and all of this was put into the first book of the Sekret Machines series Chasing Shadows.
But something that’s becoming apparent is that not many people are actually reading TTSA’s books.
Because if they were (reading AND UNDERSTANDING them) then they wouldn’t give two cents about Pentagon paper work and FOIA requests.
No, you’d be spending time getting your head around the following topics:

Mysticism
Alchemy
Hermeticism
Esoteric Christianity and Judaism
Apocryphal Religious Works
Mythology of Ancient Greece, Egypt and Sumeria.
Carl Jung and his Collective Unconscious and the Archetypes that live within it.
Shamanism
Julian Jaynes and his Bicameral Mind Hypotheses
Occultism from 1800-2000
Tibetan Buddhism
Holy War

I mean the list goes on but a lot of discussion I see here isn’t even situated within the right wheelhouse.
The implication that I feel is being missed is that all that stuff that is called “woo” in this field requires a re-evaluation.

Woo is a funny term and I get it.

There’s so much nonsense in this topic that I get the need for a term like Woo and the slightly patronising connotation that comes with it.
But I feel at this point the skepticism is hindering advancements in the study of the phenomenon.

All the topics I’ve listed above are referencing a time or event that happened.
The time of the gods and many people (Stitchin, Jaynes, Crowley, Blavatsky, Steiner, Dawkins, Striber to name a few) have tried to make sense of the esoteric texts with little progress in my honest opinion.
What seems to make sense is that small portions of each of these hypotheses are true, it’s quite postmodern really.
If you take Stitchins Anunnaki story, minis Nibiru and see it through the Bicameral mind lens all of a sudden Stitchin’s ramblings start to sound a little more coherent.


BY NO MEANS AN ABSOLUTE ANSWER!

But a little closer that Stitchins work on its own. Whitley Striber’s Communion tale sounds so far fetched that even Christopher Walken wouldn’t save it but if we apply some of Jung’s concepts, Crowleys concepts and the concept of. Bardo’s from the Tibetan Book of the Dead we start to maybe get an idea of what the man experienced.

I’m not saying I know the answers of anything, I just know over the past 6 years that I’ve been privy to the information in the Sekret Machine series ( Especially the ones written by Peter Levenda! I cannot stress this enough! Between his book Unholy Alliance and the Sinister Forces series the many has a monopoly on the scholarly work on occultism imo) I’ve lost over 10 stone in weight, developed a healthy relationship with physical activity for the first time in my life and learnt transcendental meditation to the benefit of my creative endeavours.
So at the end of the day, even if this is all nonsense I believe there’s great benefit one can find from going down the rabbit hole.

There’s so much more to talk about here but I’ve tried to summarise my feelings in a coherent concise manner. I’d love to hear you thoughts...

originally posted by: deanbaker

1. The ufo phenomenon is real and has large scale global implications.

2. The ufo phenomenon is actively involved in our development and there are governments and on this planet that know this and are working to combat it (despite senior members of the government condemning study of this topic as demonic).

3. The phenomenon is what ancient people called gods and humanity is a cargo cult.

I’d love to hear you thoughts...

To me, those 3 are FACTS.

But I found the book of his I did read to be mismash. That would be his first(?) book, "Gods" (the orange one). Maybe I should read up on what the one you are talking about says one says.

originally posted by: celltypespecific

Oddly enough I was thinking of you last night, because I turned onto the channel exactly when this came on.

So the Navy says the videos are of real unknown flying objects. Does this mean ATS hero Mick West is full of crap?

a reply to: deanbaker

I've been stating for a while that the beliefs of those involved have been steering ufology for a long time. Fundamentalist religious views including interests in the occult, scientology and all manner of other stuff that does indeed come across as woo woo.

But people want to talk about aliens and it gets lost in the noise...people have already decided what "it" is and are led by that bias so anything else is irrelevant and subsequently ignored.

a reply to: mirageman

But if are trying to imply that Lue would be able to provide information leading to better FOIA requests then you should remember that he could have provided the details to anyone else in the past two years as well.

Exactly....
You have to think more in terms of Marketing Dear Mirageman...in the new digital age its about reaching the largest audience (twitter followers, youtube channels, etc) Blackvault has one of the largest following...

Think about Big Lue's appearances on Fox, Tucker, etc

I have no source....its my brilliant intuition.

a reply to: celltypespecific

I have no source....its my brilliant intuition.

Hmmmm. Again.

a reply to: pigsy2400

But people want to talk about aliens and it gets lost in the noise...people have already decided what "it" is and are led by that bias so anything else is irrelevant and subsequently ignored.

Parallel to that, in a somewhat concerted manner, all those Q-anons are going nuts over symbolism and "Hollyweird" as we speak. Coincidences? I don't think so, more like mind control at it's finest.

However. Even if all that was true from day one, and TDL's high ranking source really was in the known (which I'd doubt), we would still have a papertrail with all the various studies that delved into the subject. Basic epistemology, innit? We are in a material realm and there will be imprints of the woo one way or another, actual data and results (or the lack thereof).

People like Kit Green for example don't simply go from synchronicity to synchronicity and act on a hunch, otherwise they wouldn't be in that position. There's a lot of juicy details lost in the noise, which is why I believe it's important to address said bias every single time we see it.

a reply to: PublicOpinion

A paper trail?

If the three points I made at the beginning of the comment I made are true then this phenomenon is the biggest secret ever. You really think because “you” couldn’t work it out and find the paper trail then it’s nonsense?

That just seems ludicrous! I bet there’s an abundance of documentation that we’ve never seen that would blow your mind! And don’t worry I get how infuriating that is but for a group of people with such expansive imaginations I’m baffled at how little wiggle room you allow in your doctrines.

a reply to: spiritualarchitect

There’s two strains with the Sekret Machine books.
Both informed by ex-members of the government, intelligence agencies and Aircraft Contractors.

The first and third books released are co-authored by Aj Hartley and are entitled Chasing Shadows and A Fire Within.
These are both written to make a fictional story out of factual parts.
Very good like Pulp Fiction if the briefcase represented The Phenomenon.

The second and forth books are entitled Gods and the second one Man with a third instalment called War.
These books take a look a esoteric and mystical matters and correlate them with the UFO phenomenon.
It’s in these books co-authored by Peter Levenda (just go check his bibliography, it’s a good primer for these books and the best authority out there in this topic imo) that the real meat and potatoes is gotten down to.
The first one Gods left me unsatisfied after first reading that I denounced it and didn’t pick it up for another year.
But 12 months went by and I thought maybe it was my fault I didn’t understand the book not Levenda’s fault.
So I went back and whenever I hit a point where I get out my depth I took to the web to supplement my research and what do you know?

It seems Mr Levenda is right on the money, I can’t understate how ahead of the curve these books are! There really isn’t anything comparable in the field.

a reply to: deanbaker

I bet there’s an abundance of documentation that we’ve never seen that would blow your mind!

That's exactly what I was getting at. Let's be frank here - TTSA isn't just a public charity with the noble goal to share secrets for the betterment of humanity. Especially not when you're dang on the money and this really is about the biggest secret of mankind. And why shouldn't they make a profit with that as well? Ask a shareholder in case of doubt, any shareholder.

Point being, this isn't the first time we've bumped into that sales-pitch. Sekret Machines in a nutshell. Which is exactly why I believe they're merely overstretching the suspense with announcements for the next announcement at this point.
Or did you see them putting up actual results with a study on the metamaterials or something of that sort? Anything?

a reply to: deanbaker

Much (not all) of what you mention has actually come up in this long and winding thread, certainly in posts by The Gut, Pigsy and myself and links to other threads here.

I've done some posts about both the fiction and non-fiction Sekret Machines books. We even branched off into John Dee, Jack Parsons and their modern day American Cosmic counterparts at some point.

Admittedly we are talking about hundreds of pages now.

We were just talking the other day about competing religious and mystical beliefs trying to steer UFOlogy in one direction or another.

I can't think of an angle surrounding TTSA that has not been at least touched on at some point.

As for this occult truth being the ultimate revelation of TTSA, I guess it's possible. But it's also possible that Tom DeLonge doesn't know his ass from his elbow.

A couple of points for the record:

One, Zondo, in that interview with Carlson, looked afraid. He may be in fear that the gubmint is coming down on him all of a sudden.
The question is now why did the gubmint dis Zondo and TTSA?


Two, regarding all the occult stuff? That’s nothing new and Levenda is responsible for it completely.

The truth of the matter is Levenda was NOT a ufologist researcher before TTSA. He went into some of the secret space stuff, but that’s it.

TTSA actually tried to get Joseph P. Farrell before they got Levenda to be their in-house writer.

So, this stuff is nothing new:
You had the UFO space brother age of the ’50s, the Puharich and the Nine era, the WWII ideas about Nazis and occult ufos, and the US government-sponsored investigations into shamanism by John Alexander, are all past indications of the occult involvement with ufology or ufology involvement in the occult.

The reason why TTSA has even gone this route is for them to gather all the different shades of the ufology tree from the sci-fi, technical aspect all the way to the occult-UFO school of thought.

Its an indication that they are trying to reach all of ufology.

a reply to: deanbaker

It seems Mr Levenda is right on the money, I can’t understate how ahead of the curve these books are! There really isn’t anything comparable in the field.

There is not a single shred of anything even remotely resembling evidence in Levendas first book, which I did struggle through.

"Chariots of the Gods" provide more evidence than "Gods". Levenda is slicker, and more aloof than Mr Daniken, but there really is less compelling evidence in Levendas work.

If you have to resort to faith to get abord with the Gods, War and Men worldview, well what is its purpose?

Another Faith in the budding? Complete with prophets, gurus and zealots?

To sum up.

One question is open and that is why is the military all of a sudden distancing itself from TTSA?
As of now, we don’t know

The second issue is ufology and occultism.
I don’t agree this is any significant thing since its nothing new and actually TTSA is NOT too much into the occultism/ufo school of thought. Its only Levenda.

a reply to: deanbaker

I am sorry...but its all nonsense.

I can't do woo.....

Lets stick to military "secret" videos and hard documentation from the likes of Blackvault and Keith Basterfield.


ufos-scientificresearch.blogspot.com...

The rest is noise....

a reply to: celltypespecific

It’s all a part and parcel of the whole ufo enchilada.

So-called woo is an integral part of ufology whether you like it or not or whether you can do it or not.


It's unavoidable.

I do think TTSA isn’t necessarily into that aspect much (just the Levada influence).

But that is there for the wooefologists

That doesn't mean one has to believe in it just acknowledge its existence