Beyond Bigelow & BAASS, After AATIP and on To the Stars...

Generally agree with the points but what are the implications?
Someone tricked Justice into joining a UFO start up so it could make UFOlogy look less credible?
Is that even possible?

Fairly sure there would be a number in Justice's phone that he's supposed to call if anyone approaches or attempts to solicit information from him in any way.
OPSEC would dictate that even if that person presented proper credentials- they would need to be checked and verified by a third party authority before Justice was OK'd to interact with them.

If he wasn't tricked (and after absorbing every piece of info I could find about him - I doubt it) there are 2 further options:

2: He has experienced something that really makes him believe there are none terrestrial UFO's dropping pieces of their ships

OR

3: He is involved in something so important- it is worthy of the short term ridicule arising from a legit. aerospace engineer who specialises in system integration making very outlandish claims regarding the back engineering of complex systems.

Random bits people haven't discussed:

*Justice is a Kelly Johnson fanboy and is a double recipient of the Johnson Engineering prize.
Johnson's edict was hard work, good communication and unwavering honesty.

*Justice was the "Custodian of records and artefacts" whilst at LM.

a reply to: Jukiodone

With regards to Justice - It is possible that he too got fed up of technologies or other materials, applications that their engineers created - that there was never a need for or that the funding dried up - or certain aspects of projects that never got past the testing stages - that pissed him off and he wanted to see some of that work out there in the real world.

It could be as simple as Un.Funded Opportunities - I bet there is some fascinating technology on pallets in dusty warehouses and/or buried in the desert that belong to multiple defense contractors. Planning for certain projects and technologies, especially defense is done decades out at times.

When the cold war ended, I bet there was loads of interesting "toys" that were in the pipeline that were simply, no longer required and funding was pulled- no matter how cool they were.

If Luis brought the videos, you could argue that Justice brought the meta-materials...or knowledge of where to "acquire" them.

Its quite possible that TTSA could have done a switcheroo in terms of materials - meta or otherwise. I wonder if those materials submitted in the CRADA really are "Arts Parts". It sure would give TTSA supporters something to cheer about afterwards wouldn't it...if they had switched them and they were from some unfinished project somewhere..

Thinking out loud....

a reply to: Jukiodone

Justice's role is as Contractor - Director of Advanced Programs and Technology for TTSA (at least publicly) appears negligible. He was originally registered as only working part time for TTSA (20 hours per week). He rarely speaks publicly and so far hasn't any meaningful resources to achieve much.

I would say that we are all are too focused on the UFO angle here.

TTSA seem happy to let social media and the UFO community argue endlessly about that subject even encouraging it with their sloppy research and spurious claims. Meanwhile securing an agreement with the Army to test some already tested materials that the Army are supposed to have confiscated long ago in 1947. The Pentagon have only added to the confusion. Maybe purposely.

I would suggest that Justice considers himself an American patriot and whatever he is doing with TTSA is linked to that. Maybe Tom still believes it's about UFOs to this day. But if this is a clandestine operation then we'll possibly never know what it was all about.

Just over 10 years ago there was a hepatitis vaccination project in Abbottabad, Pakistan and that ended the world's longest ongoing high stakes game of hide and seek. Could you honestly have worked that one out back then?

And that's one of the few we know about.

TTSA
2017 - 2019
* A TV Show
* Alien Merchandise - including Pajamas!!
* Trilogy of Books
* Book about a guy being naked
* Angels and Airwaves Tour and New Album
* CRADA on Industrial Slag -previously analysed materials...
* Taken credit for FOIAs / Work by others (Videos Depict UAP - John Greenwald)
* Insinuated briefings was their influence - even before they existed!
* Credited themselves with changing Navy Guidlines - that were already drafted!
* Released UAP Videos - DoD did, oh wait TTSA did, oh no....errr hang on?
* Taken peoples money in whats considered by many - a dodgy stock offering system

What a waste of time this has been...one hell of a way to start a cult though.

a reply to: pigsy2400


Their greatest supposed act was the video radar releases which evidence seems to show they weren't the first to release them.

You don’t even give them credit for that, I agree with you.

a reply to:mirageman[/post]


The American government has a very sinister element to it we all know and its not outside of their moral scruples to be running a psyop scam through TTSA.


There’s prima facie evidence of such, like putting it in our face ( like 911 and the JFK government-sponsored murder) is the very origin of TTSA within the MIC.

No one with a modicum of knowledge of the history of ufology and the US IC would trust any military-backed ufo group having any degree of sincerity.


That, of course, is the new modus operandi of the US IC: put it right in our faces. They realize most Americans are dumb and clueless( or just don't give a damn) so they can do things overtly and not worry about any ramifications or negative feedback.

All the lies and duplicity the US has been caught at and people still trust this cabal of sinister evildoers from the IC and military is prof of massive universal stupidity and ignorance in the country.

Depending on a US government-sponsored group to disclose ufo secrets is like depending on a wolf to protect the sheep bin on a farm.

It was predicted TTSA would be light on any ufo information and it has come true.

The second proof of this group being a plot is the members themselves being attached to past FAKE ufo information peddling.

Thirdly, simply, as Pigsy’s post reveals, they have produced zilch in terms of ufo data disclosed

Strike three, they’re out!

a reply to: pigsy2400

Don't forget

1) Zondo did MUFON 2018 and claimed Ukrainians were spying on him. Even though no one remembers anything of interest he said besides claimiing his beard was blond not grey!!

2) Zondo and Tom went to Italy and hyped it up for weeks before claiming.....

.... invited into private meetings with a particular European Government on UFOs.

When in fact it was a civilian organisation CUN with no connection to any government.

Zondo gave a mistake laden speech with false pics of the UFOs over DC in 1952 claiming there were mass sightings and photos. When in fact only handful of people were witnesses and there are no photos. Amongst other errors.

Then we had the story of the copter shot down by a UFO



It turned out to have been part of a hoax by Antonino Pezzino and his son Guiseppe.

After that we got shots of Zondo proudly displaying his acquisition of UFO Files Italia to Tom and showing what appears to be categorization of different types of craft.



The pic actually came from a computer arts site where you can purchase computer modelling artwork of these UFO types. . In other words they weren't real....

3) Zondo again left the USA for a Brazilian or a couple of Argentinians? Allegedly claiming they had bits from Ubatuba. A dubious case at best. Although I don't know how they crossed the border into the Argentine. It looks like Jacques V got there first (before tindering his resignation) and Zondo had to go back for slippy seconds .



Don't forget as well that they changed Elizondo's former title from Director of AATIP (to Program Element Manager).....



Has anyone invested in asked for a refund on their investments I wonder?

a reply to: mirageman

Look at the state of that mouth!

originally posted by: mirageman
Zondo gave a mistake laden speech with false pics of the UFOs over DC in 1952 claiming there were mass sightings and photos. When in fact only handful of people were witnesses and there are no photos. Amongst other errors.

That was the point when my jaw first dropped at the sheer ineptitude of TTSA.

And during 'Unidentified', although it doesn't seem a concern for many other UFO enthusiasts (maybe because you and I have waded knee-deep in the case), the inept, inaccurate reporting of the Rendlesham incident was embarrassing. I bet Penniston's face went purple when he first heard he'd been out UFO hunting on Night Three! Burroughs was clearly not happy, either.

If TTSA made such a mess of the most famous UFO case in history (after Roswell), how on earth am I meant to trust their presentation of more recent incidents?

a reply to: mirageman

Damn dude, to be so deep in the weeds, you sure do a helluva job giving us the treetop (cursory) take on this USofA operation. You struck gold with that Studio Six corollary and its present-day implications vis-a-vie TTSA.

Look on the bright side: hot dogs are fungible and an inferior good, which will always be in business. Ya for TDL and pig nitrites.

Peace in the Middle East...next?

Any idea when we'll need a new thread gents?

a reply to: 1ofthe9

Threads now go to 400 pages apparently...so I can imagine this one will around for a while longer yet...

Some interesting developments in regards to the Nimitz Encounters in relation to a FOIA request that Chris Lambright filed 2 months ago that Paul Dean has reported on today. I am not going to include his full FOIA request - as its quite long - and I have included it in the links/source at the bottom of the post.

To Summarize Chris Lambrights FOIA;

"all releasable portions of records and reports related to investigation of the detection of and encounter(s) with Anomalous Aerial Vehicles (AAVs) by personnel involved with the Nimitz Carrier Strike Group"

Information supportive of my request comes from a former pilot and now writer who has publicly stated he was allowed to see an exhaustive classified ONI report on these events prior to an article he published in 2015. Other supportive information comes from a contractor/analyst who has stated that an investigation had been conducted by a “GS-15” with the Office of Naval Intelligence."

His response was this, again shortened;

Our review of our records and systems reveal that ONI has no releasable records related to your request. ONI has searched our records for responsive documents. We have discovered certain briefing slides that are classified TOP SECRET. A review of these materials indicates that are currently and appropriate Marked and Classified TOP SECRET under Executive Order 13526, and the Original Classification Authority has determined that the release of these materials would cause exceptionally grave damage to the National Security of the United States.

My Note / Thoughts;
ONI have "No releasable records" - maybe implying there are records but are not available for release.

Slides - there was mention of some PowerPoint slides by the original leaker here on ATS when the original F4.mpg was leaked. I know that some researchers were looking around for these at some point long ago.

Here is the original quote from "TheFinalTheory" in relation to when they put the f4,mpg online and linked to that thread on ATS.

The video you are about to see seems to be a FLIR-hud-vision captured by one of the jets, that were sent out to intercept the unknown object. The materials we (me and one other ATS member who wished to remain nameless) used for this analysis/post were this video, an event-log and a power-point-presentation, but the information included in there has not been worked out yet.The files we have can be released on demand.

Response Contd;

We have also determined that ONI possesses a video classified SECRET that ONI is not the Original Classification Authority for. ONI has forwarded your request to Naval Air Systems Command to make a determination on releasability…”

My Note / Thoughts;
Whats interesting here is there have long been rumors of a longer video in relation to the incident that many within ufology claimed to have seen, or this is the original video that wasn't actually cleared for release in the first place.

Huge credit here to Chris Lambright for filing the FOIA and sharing the response and to Paul Dean for reporting this.

Source

originally posted by: Baablacksheep
a reply to: mirageman

Look at the state of that mouth!

Yeh Zondo has a big tongue doesn't he?

Here is the full response for those that are interested;



Source

Yikes, Vallee and Zondo look like their souls are draining from their bodies in those pictures.

Too much exposure to UAPs?

originally posted by: pigsy2400
Some interesting developments in regards to the Nimitz Encounters in relation to a FOIA request that Chris Lambright filed 2 months ago that Paul Dean has reported on today. I am not going to include his full FOIA request - as its quite long - and I have included it in the links/source at the bottom of the post.

To Summarize Chris Lambrights FOIA;

"all releasable portions of records and reports related to investigation of the detection of and encounter(s) with Anomalous Aerial Vehicles (AAVs) by personnel involved with the Nimitz Carrier Strike Group"

Information supportive of my request comes from a former pilot and now writer who has publicly stated he was allowed to see an exhaustive classified ONI report on these events prior to an article he published in 2015. Other supportive information comes from a contractor/analyst who has stated that an investigation had been conducted by a “GS-15” with the Office of Naval Intelligence."

His response was this, again shortened;

Our review of our records and systems reveal that ONI has no releasable records related to your request. ONI has searched our records for responsive documents. We have discovered certain briefing slides that are classified TOP SECRET. A review of these materials indicates that are currently and appropriate Marked and Classified TOP SECRET under Executive Order 13526, and the Original Classification Authority has determined that the release of these materials would cause exceptionally grave damage to the National Security of the United States.

My Note / Thoughts;
ONI have "No releasable records" - maybe implying there are records but are not available for release.

Slides - there was mention of some PowerPoint slides by the original leaker here on ATS when the original F4.mpg was leaked. I know that some researchers were looking around for these at some point long ago.

Here is the original quote from "TheFinalTheory" in relation to when they put the f4,mpg online and linked to that thread on ATS.

The video you are about to see seems to be a FLIR-hud-vision captured by one of the jets, that were sent out to intercept the unknown object. The materials we (me and one other ATS member who wished to remain nameless) used for this analysis/post were this video, an event-log and a power-point-presentation, but the information included in there has not been worked out yet.The files we have can be released on demand.

Response Contd;

We have also determined that ONI possesses a video classified SECRET that ONI is not the Original Classification Authority for. ONI has forwarded your request to Naval Air Systems Command to make a determination on releasability…”

My Note / Thoughts;
Whats interesting here is there have long been rumors of a longer video in relation to the incident that many within ufology claimed to have seen, or this is the original video that wasn't actually cleared for release in the first place.

Huge credit here to Chris Lambright for filing the FOIA and sharing the response and to Paul Dean for reporting this.

Source

Excellent

a reply to: mirageman

Cough...

a reply to: celltypespecific

“The release of these materials would cause exceptionally grave damage to the National Security of the United States.” (= Alien – not holograms)

a reply to: spiritualarchitect

That is quite a leap of faith there... I am not going to attempt to change your opinion; your entitled to it; it also seems you are adamant that is the answer.

Lets have a close look at other aspects;

"In addition, the materials would trigger protections under subcategory e), Scientific and Technological Matters related to National Security of the United States. For this reason, the materials are exempt from release under the (b) (1) Exemption for Classified Matters of National Defense. As a result these records may not be released and are being withheld."

Lets look at who the original classification authority went to for the Videos;

The Naval Air Systems Command (NAVAIR)provides material support for aircraft and airborne weapon systems for the United States Navy.

NAVAIR is organized into eight "competencies" or communities of practice namely: program management, contracts, research and engineering, test and evaluation, logistics and industrial operations, corporate operations, comptroller and counsel.

Note;
Scientific and Technological Matters to National Security
Research & Engineering, Test & Evaluation

Doesn't sound like Aliens to me - sounds like a test of a platform in a real world scenario. But Hey - that's my opinion based on the information that's available.

NAVAIR Source