NEWS: Judge Orders Feeding Tube to Be Removed

Originally posted by SourGrapes
Okay Fred I'm still lost. Is it Conservative to let her live or die? When Rant said 'conservatives' who was he talking to?

Ooooh twilight zone Rant and I are on the same page

As he pointed out The right to life crowd almost always has a religous bent and ultra conservative politics. Does not have to be a Republican either. i am a Republican but I support the right to die when you chose, the right to have an abortion, and Im an officer in our Union to boot .

Its funny, some of the same group that is outside protesting Terri's right to live supports the death penalty and tacitly if not activly provides support to those who murder people who work at abortion clinics?

I admit, medical expertise is not on my side in this argument. When I think "life support", I think that they are keeping the heart beating and the lungs breathing. I don't think about feeding the poor woman. We hear the words "pull the plug", we don't hear, "pull the food"

I've seen the video of Terri where her eyes follows the balloon. She reacts to her parent's voice. Aren't those signs of living? Doesn't this require parts of the brain to function? If the brain is functioning, than is she alive?

IMO, death is the heart and brain have stopped beating without artificial life support. If you can convince me that her heart and brain have stopped functioning without starving a her to death, then I will change my mind on this topic.

I should add this because it might explain better why I stand firm about this. Just 9 weeks ago, my Father in law decided to end his life. He was a diabetic and had just had a leg amputated. He refused food and dialysis and it was his decision. He died on 1/7. I emphasize that it was HIS decision, not ours. We accepted it because it was his decision. He had signed a DNR order, made his requests known to several personnel as well as family members. He didn't do it because of medical costs, he did it because he didn't want to suffer any longer or live that way.

On the otherhand there is Terri, who's husband speaks for her, who has gone on with his life. She never signed a DNR, he has a cash settlement, and wants to starve her to death. You all ask about HIS rights, but what about the rest of the family and her rights? It just doesn't pass the smell test to me. Why does her husband even care when he's gone on on with his life?

Originally posted by FredT
You will always find one or two doctors that will say WHATEVER for a few $$$$ at anyrate the parents are keeping her alive because of "thier" issues not Terri's.

A feeding tube is life support period. SUre not as dramatic as say a vasopressen drip or HFOV, or ECMO, but it is life support.

Since day #1 since ive lived in florida ive been following this case. Ive never liked her husband. For one it seems like he want to have nothing to do with his wife or her parents. He didnt seem to hesitant to find himself another woman either. Its great that allegations of abuse come up now cause if there are police records somewhere or some sort of proof that this happend Schivo's parents have a victory. Schivo isnt in a vegative state as many say. If that were the case she wouldnt be able to breath on her own, respond to her parents etc... A parent knows much more about their daughter then a husband ever will regardless of what any of you say. This 3 week extension is great. The judge keeps buying time for her parents and we will see where it goes from here. If they were to remove her tube on the 18th im possibly planning on attending the protest. Trust me if im there, there will be nothing peaceful about it. There have been people in this condition documented up to 35 years that have somewhat snapped out of it and now live somewhat normal lives. I have to agree she may not enjoy the condition shes in now but if shes fighting to somehow come back and the tube is removed she starves slowly and suffers even more. Basicly murder IMO. Would be hella funny if she were to improve dramaticlly over the next month .

FredT, I enjoy your posts, but just because I am conservative, don't put me into a neat little box.

I believe that life begins at the moment of conception, so abortion is murder.

I do not believe that the death penalty is just. You and God decide your death. Life in prison is a greater penalty.

I don't believe that anyone in abortion clinics should be put to death. I believe they are mislead. The mislead should not be punished.

I also don't believe a person should be starved to death, unless it solely his/her decision. Give me written proof where Terri stated she wanted to starve to death and I will change my mind.

Originally posted by FredT

Originally posted by SourGrapes
Okay Fred I'm still lost. Is it Conservative to let her live or die? When Rant said 'conservatives' who was he talking to?

Ooooh twilight zone Rant and I are on the same page

As he pointed out The right to life crowd almost always has a religous bent and ultra conservative politics. Does not have to be a Republican either. i am a Republican but I support the right to die when you chose, the right to have an abortion, and Im an officer in our Union to boot

.

Its funny, some of the same group that is outside protesting Terri's right to live supports the death penalty and tacitly if not activly provides support to those who murder people who work at abortion clinics?

I'm not trying to box you into a box, but the reality is most pro life, life at all costs people I have encountered are religious conservatives. Exceptions abound no doubt.

However, the mere mention of his wife to carry on this subject is enough and I believe that it was a similar issue with Karen Ann Quillan (sp?). Money as a motive has been ruled out as well as at this point there is little left.

As Rant pointed out, the Husband is and should be the final arbiter of her fate period.

i know many liberals who protest this, dont generalise, last i looked she isnt dying so how is this even legal to disconnect someone after years being alive? you dont see the danger here?

infact many i know who are against it were and are like her, one was fully aware when she was in vegitable state, unresponsive, etc.

[edit on 26-2-2005 by namehere]

Originally posted by namehere
i know many liberals who protest this, dont generalise, last i looked she isnt dying so how is this even legal to disconnect someone after years being alive? you dont see the danger here?

Don't know many myself so pehaps Im not in the right area. But the SF Bay Area is pretty left of center though. At any rate there is a religious smell to all of this no matter what people say.

No she is not dying, but if say she was hooked up to every piece of technology we posses would you change your mind? She stated to her husband that she did not want to live life this way. He is acting for her as his capacity as husband as he is moraly and LEGALY entitled to do.

I work in the health care field and we posses technology that if persued with all vigor could keep you lifeless body alive not quite forever, but quite a long time. And to do what? Brain cells do not grow back when whe was gorked by her cardiac arrest that was it, I understand the pain of the parents and her husband, but everything that made her special to them is now gone. She is a body on auto pilot.

Again I ask who's good is this for? The parents or Terri????

Very few that are in vegative states return. Remeber the kid that was revived after 30 minutes in icy water? How come you don't see that kid today on TV???? Cause he is gorked out. The body survives many trials the brain does not.

Originally posted by FredTNo she is not dying, but if say she was hooked up to every piece of technology we posses would you change your mind? She stated to her husband that she did not want to live life this way. He is acting for her as his capacity as husband as he is moraly and LEGALY entitled to do.

I work in the health care field and we posses technology that if persued with all vigor could keep you lifeless body alive not quite forever, but quite a long time. And to do what? Brain cells do not grow back when whe was gorked by her cardiac arrest that was it, I understand the pain of the parents and her husband, but everything that made her special to them is now gone. She is a body on auto pilot.

Again I ask who's good is this for? The parents or Terri????

would it be legal if someone like me told my guardian i wanted off my vent? i thought thats illegal to do, if so how is this, what if shes aware, we cant tell..

I don't see why not as parents makes these choices almost daily in pediatric and neonatal ICU's across the country. But lets say for instance you and your SO decide to let your child go who's brain was deprived of oxygen and an Aunt steps in and gets a legal injunction that prevents you from doing so? Its not farfetched as it seems and if the courts take away a husbands rights in this matter, a parents rights will be next?

Would any of you want to live like that?

have a little mercy and let her go.

We have more compassion for our dogs

This is not a matter of simply pulling the plug and dying within a few minutes, or hours even. It could take as long as 2 weeks for Terri to starve to death! I don't know about the rest of you, but I could not watch someone I love slowly starve. Especially if there was the slightest chance that they would suffer the pains of starvation or, God forbid, be aware of what was happening, but unable to communicate their wish to live.

If the people who think this is not cruel or wrong were really so concerned about Terri's quality of living, or lack thereof, they would be asking for her to be euthanized, not starved.
I don't have a problem, so much, with the fact that they are going end her life, but I have a huge problem with the fact that, despite our ability to end her suffering in a pain-free and humane manner, they won't do it because that would be murder. Yet, somehow, actively removing her feeding tubes and letting her die over the course of 2 weeks is not only not murder, it is a kind and compassionate thing to do.

Huh?!? How does that make any sense at all? They are killing her either way, so why wouldn't they want to make it as quick and humane as possible? If euthanizing her is murder than starving her is too!

Originally posted by surfup
After seven years of battle between the parents of the brain-damaged Ms. Schiavo and her husband, the Judge has ruled in favor of the husband to remove the patient's feeding tube on March 18 at 1.00 p.m. According to the Mr. Schiavo, his wife has commented several times against being kept artificially.

Anyone else but me see more politics here? Notice he set the date at least two weeks away; which in effect is giving the parents more time to appeal even his ruling.

BTW, I do not buy what the parents are saying regarding alleged abuse either, I think that is all a sham. Surely if there had been abuse it could have been proven by now.

Additional Information

abcnews.go.com...

Twice, Terri Schiavo's feeding tube was removed by court order, and both times it was restored. The last time, in 2003, Gov. Jeb Bush pushed through a state law later ruled unconstitutional that authorized him to resume the feedings six days after they were stopped.

The ruling came on the fifteenth anniversay, when Terry's heart stopped beating for five mintues leading her to the state she is right now.

Michael Schiavo said his wife never wanted to be kept alive artificially, but she left no written directive. He says he's fulfilling a promise he made to her, and he has spent most of a $700,000 medical malpractice award given to his wife for her care to pay his attorney.

Surf

I don't know who made this a politically partisan (i.e., Right vs. Left) issue, but the logic of that escapes me. Personally speaking, the woman is the victim of a failed suicide. She was bulimic and refused to tell doctors about her behavior so they could make an accurate diagnosis. Then when she passed out after having purged one time too many times and suffered brain damage, her husband took the MDs to court and won [a substantial sum of money] for malpractice, because they did not ask the right questions.

Now, he's shacking up with another woman, having produced another family with her, while his wife wastes away and will be the beneficiary of the life insurance policy when she finally starves to death. Someone should remove this anus's "feeding tube." He's some husband, alright--just the type you would expect the left to support, as long as we are appealing to political partisanship.

Edit for clarity.

[edit on 05/2/26 by GradyPhilpott]

Originally posted by GradyPhilpott
Personally speaking, the woman is the victim of a failed suicide. She was bulimic and refused to tell doctors about her behavior so they could make an accurate diagnosis. Then when she passed out after having purged one time too many and suffered brain damage, her husband took the MDs to court and won several million dollars for malpractice, because they did not ask the right questions.
[edit on 05/2/26 by GradyPhilpott]

Several stories said she had a heart attack, now I am really confused

Then you say several million dollars yet the husband states he has spent virtually all of the 700,000 he received in awards. Even more Wanders off into La La land

[edit on 2/26/2005 by shots]

I'm going on what I heard from an attorney involved in the case who was on "On the Record." Schaivo purged so much that her electrolyte level dropped enough to cause a heart attack. She also suffered brain damage as a result.

It's hard to find this material on the internet, because of all the goings on over removing her feeding tube, but I found one link that puts the figure for the lawsuit won by Michael Schiavo at $1.2 million.

[edit on 05/2/26 by GradyPhilpott]

Originally posted by shots
Several stories said she had a heart attack, now I am really confused

Then you say several million dollars yet the husband states he has spent virtually all of the 700,000 he received in awards. Even more

Wanders off into La La land

From what I have heard her heart stopped beating for about five minutes, cutting of oxygen supply to brain causing her vegetable state. No mentions of heart attack.

According to ABC, Mr. Schiavo recieved about $700,000 from the medical malpractice award and has spent most of it in the fight.

Surf

Originally posted by GradyPhilpott
I'm going on what I heard from an attorney involved in the case who was on "On the Record." Schaivo purged so much that her electrolyte level dropped enough to cause a heart attack. She also suffered brain damage as a result.

It's hard to find this material on the internet, because of all the goings on over removing her feeding tube, but I found one link that puts the figure for the lawsuit won by Michael Schiavo at $1.2 million.

[edit on 05/2/26 by GradyPhilpott]

Thanks for the clarification, however I am sure you will have too admit that there is a big differance between several million and 1 and a half.

The one or two sources I read only stated she had a heart attack and that being the case don't you think it would have been rather hard for her to answer any questions considering the fact at that time she lapsed into what one might call a coma?

The several million figure came from a TV source who would not confirm the figure, but did say that it was more than a million. I probably should have just said a substantial sum.

There really are a lot of unanswered questions about this case. Terri wasn't trying to kill herself outright, but her behavior was suicidal in nature. I still believe that she deserves to be fed, unless there is a document with her signature on it to the contrary.

A feeding tube for someone in her condition is not the same as a respirator on someone who is "brain dead."

[edit on 05/2/26 by GradyPhilpott]