Porton Down experts unable to verify 'precise source of novichok'

a reply to: TrueBrit


You may well be right.

Or, you could be wrong and it was a Russian state sponsored assassination attempt. Shall we agree to wait and see what the outcome is of the Police investigation and the OPCW inquiry is?

And, to be clear, if it is indeed the case that there is intel pointing the finger at Russia, which has not been disclosed publicly for obvious reasons, that has proved sufficient to persuade lots of countries to back our stance, diplomatic action (as opposed to criminal charges - two different things) is wholly appropriate.

Indeed, if May had adopted a wait and see approach, she would have been slammed for being weak.

originally posted by: oldcarpy
a reply to: TrueBrit

Yes, but there was an assassination attempt in a public place on our soil using a nerve agent. That much I trust you will accept.

Some people were poisoned and it's not yet clear if "there was an assassination attempt in a public place on our soil using a nerve agent".

Do you remember the case of Ronald "human guinea pig" Maddison for instance? Seven miles away?

www.theguardian.com...

This could still be a cover up or a hardcore fake news propaganda stint.


Our transatlantic commanders want to export more oil and gas, Britain needs some Brexit presents, there is that new eurasian land bridge...

en.wikipedia.org...

NATO economics and geopolitical environment:
eeas.europa.eu...

EU hard in Brexit case:
www.cer.eu...



And the Ukraine conflict could be ended by cold winters:

Former Soviet Union
Gazprom will continue to transit gas via Ukraine – Miller
By Staff reporter 4 April 2018

Gazprom Chief Executive Alexei Miller said in a TV interview on Tuesday that the Russian major will continue to transit gas via Ukraine.

However, volumes shipped via the country will drop by up to 90% after the Nord Stream 2 and Turkish Stream pipelines are launched, Interfax reported on Wednesday.

Gazprom said in early March that it did not intend to renew its gas transit contracts with Naftogaz Ukrainy after they expire in 2019.

“We’re not saying that we will completely cut off transit through...

a reply to: greyhat

Do you remember the case of Ronald "human guinea pig" Maddison for instance? Seven miles away?

Seeing as how that was in 1953, no I don't remember it. I think we have all moved on a bit since then.

"Some people were poisoned". So thats allright then.

a reply to: oldcarpy

If May had adopted a rational approach to her next step, the mindless drones in her own party might have been aggrieved by it, but that is really immaterial. Those in the know would merely have been glad there as not a reactionary, fool of an oaf in the PMs office.

originally posted by: oldcarpy
I think we have all moved on a bit since then.

"Some people were poisoned". So thats allright then.

No, thats a crime. But its far from clear who commited it.

And did someone "move on" in geopolitics? Really?

Do you remember the Iraq WMD propaganda train 2003? Not so long ago.
Do you remember Syrian rebels using sarin? Where did they get it from?

www.youtube.com...

a reply to: TrueBrit

I really get that you are not a fan of the Tories. If you are referring to Boris Johnson as the oaf in question I am not a fan of his either.

However, I think that his bumbling oaf-like persona is a façade behind which lurks a very shrewd and ruthless person and not a particularly likeable one.

a reply to: greyhat


I was not speaking of geopolitics.

Yes, I remember Blair's warmongering lies very well.

I don't know, where did these Syrian rebels get Sarin from?

a reply to: oldcarpy

Boris Johnson is no where near the idiot he makes himself out to be, but should never be allowed to control anything more vital than the tea and coffee making facilities, precisely because he is a devious and utterly despicable individual. No former member of the Bullingdon Club should ever be permitted to attain officially derived power. Membership of that "august" body is only proffered to those whose morality is so damaged and corrupted by wealth that they have lost all semblance of good form, or respect for decency of character.

With regard to the specific instance we are discussing, his comments, while the discovery of their inaccuracy might make him appear as if he has egg on his face, are the lie that will travel half way around the world before the truth puts its boots on. More people have heard and paid attention to those words, than have accepted the truth which made those utterances seem so absurd. In a year, only a few people will even remember that he was wrong, leave alone that he was shown up by the very facility which he claimed to be speaking on behalf of. But they will remember what he said. They may even forget that what he said was inaccurate, a lie. It happens all the time.

We would, arguably, not have the government we have now, if it were not the case.

a reply to: TrueBrit


That's politics, it works for both sides, though.

Me, I think that anyone who has an ambition to be Prime Minister should be disqualified. Don't vote, or the Govt will get in, etc.

a reply to: greyhat

Here is an article about Sarin and the Syrian rebels:

BBC Syrian Rebels and Sarin

What interested me was this quote from the then Russian Foreign Ministry Spokesman (its from 2013):-

On Monday, Russian foreign ministry spokesman Alexander Lukashevich said it was deeply concerned by "signs that world public opinion is being prepared for possible military intervention" in Syria.

God forbid that anyone should intervene militarily in Syria, eh? Oh wait - Russia did!

originally posted by: oldcarpy
I was not speaking of geopolitics.

But i was.

Maybe it was a Russian attack, or some kind of Gladio 2.0 strategy of tension with the Skripals as pawns, maybe some non governmental terrorist organization.

We need some more 360 degree view in this case.

a reply to: greyhat


Maybe it was the pink unicorns. They cannot be trusted, you know.

originally posted by: oldcarpy
God forbid that anyone should intervene militarily in Syria, eh? Oh wait - Russia did!

The Russians didn't intervene, they are supporting the Syrian government on request.

You see the difference?

originally posted by: oldcarpy
a reply to: greyhat
Maybe it was the pink unicorns. They cannot be trusted, you know.

Please stop this homophobic hate speech, there is no such thing as a pink terrorist organization!

a reply to: greyhat

I call what they have done and are doing "intervention". What with all the bombing of civilians and stuff.

So Russia is not pursuing it's own ends in Syria?

Please, don't be so naïve.

a reply to: greyhat


Why do you automatically assume that they are gay, just because they are pink? Shocking.

originally posted by: oldcarpy
a reply to: greyhat

I call what they have done and are doing "intervention". What with all the bombing of civilians and stuff.
So Russia is not pursuing it's own ends in Syria?
Please, don't be so naïve.

It's not an intervention, ironical as it may sound, the Russians are supporting the elected Syrian government in their war against ISIS and Al Qaeda terror.

And this is not for free, of cause. The Russians need their early warning systems there (remember the nukes in Turkey and the jericho rockets), they don't want a Quatari gaz pipeline there, they need a harbor in the mediterranean sea...

a reply to: greyhat



Not propping up a genocidal dictator?

As for the rest of your post, well, quite.

originally posted by: oldcarpy
a reply to: greyhat
Not propping up a genocidal dictator?

Do you really believe in that propaganda bull#?

Look at Saddam Hussein, who killed more Iraqis, that "genocidal dictator" or the "liberators"?

www.youtube.com...

Remember Egypt? Liberated, "wrong party" elected, was put back under dictatorial rule...

Its all about vital interests.


What could be the Russian interest in killing a released spy they could easily have killed while in a russian jail, with WMDs on NATO territory? Doesnt this sound far too stupid?

a reply to: oldcarpy

And the western element are in control of the islamofascist brigades, supply them, arm them, write the theme tune, sing the theme tune. They are the Dennis Waterman of world affairs at this point. It really does not matter what Assad is doing, at this point, for one simple reason...

If allying oneself with any of the contributors to, or directly with the operations of ISIS (which the British and American governments are both up to their eye sockets in), is necessary to reach an end, the end is immoral and should not be sought. Put another way, the ends never justify the means. Just ends are only ever achieved with just means. They might not be pleasant means, but they will be just, provided the ends are just also.

Where people try to justify unjust means to achieve an end result, that end result is corrupt, broken, and not worth striving for. For example, killing Nazis by the dozen was not a nice thing to do during the forties, but it was just. Using islamofascist terrorists to dethrone leaders and throw entire regions into disarray however, was both unpleasant of our govnernment, AND unjust.