The College Dream About to Burst?

a reply to: lakenheath24

I'm not advocating making that move retroactive. I'm saying they should make loans moving forward dischargable. It would be a very bad idea to allow the existing loans to be discharged, purely because most of them were only granted because the federal government was insuring them to lenders under the guidelines of "there's really no way you, John Q Student, can escape paying this loan off."

Let's be real here... we're presently having discussions on raising the age limit for some firearms to 21 years old because 18 year olds aren't considered mature enough to make good decisions... but let them sign themselves into decades of debt to be paid off with careers in fields that aren't financially beneficial? Sure! Go for it. *sarcasm* If it doesn't make dollars, it doesn't make sense. Anyone should be able to chase their dream, even if said dream involves an absolutely worthless degree, but they should have to figure out how to pay for that dream beforehand.

a reply to: JAGStorm

In California, trades is not option and they tend to emphasize more on white collar jobs than on blue collar jobs.

Right now, I'm trying to get a white collar job just to survive. I am planning on learning a trade once I get out of California.

a reply to: burdman30ott6

I completely agree with you. I am just saying that "they" are creating an entire generation of people in debt, and they won't stop it until something bad happens. I want to believe it is ignorant fools in Congress who can't see past their greedy noses, but something is afoot when multiple people and agencies cry foul, yet nothing is done. It truly is a giant bubble that has implications far beyond the schools themselves.
I wonder how many banks are rolling these debts into junk bonds to sell just like with the housing market. "No way will millions default on their loans say the sharks". Yet looking at the data, there are literally millions of people 30, 60, and 90 days overdue on their loan repayments, and that doesn't include the hidden credit card borrowing and regular bank loans.

As the poster above noted, it is 6% of our ENTIRE debt! That is probably bigger than the housing bubble in terms of total dollars. I now want to find out if there is a fund shorting the student loan market!!!!!!!!!!!

I personally am appalled of the thoughts and beliefs of the proffessors and teachers at the schools and universities. Not only do I disagree with them I find it hard to pay a ton of money to send my kids to listen to them. I hope they do attend college with the mindset to obtain the knowledge without the extracurricular beliefs of the teachers. I wonder what percentage of college staffs are far left and trying to push it on young people.

a reply to: starwarsisreal

Good luck to you sir. I would check out Mike Rowe from Dirty Jobs. He has a lot of vids and is a huge advocate for trade type jobs, and not just the traditional stuff. He even briefed Congress on the situation. There are thousands of unfilled slots due to a lack of skills. Just need to research and be prepared to relocate.

a reply to: LaitModelFan

More than you want to know! I had a teacher who insisted on telling us about her lesbian lifestyle in class! I reported her, but nothing was done. This was a religious studies class FFS. As an adult student, I am not afraid to let it rip on faculty, but young kids just keep quiet in order to get a good grade.

a reply to: lakenheath24

I hear plenty, and it doesn't surprise me in the least.

a reply to: LaitModelFan

You have kids in HS? Do they have a guidance counsellor anymore ?

a reply to: lakenheath24

1 graduated and 2 in middle school. They all are very intelligent and making good choices so far.

I really regret not going to college. Things happened, I got married very young, and never went.

I wanted to go last year. I figured, single guy, in my mid 40's, I should get some help right?

Well, yeah, I did. But the help didn't even come close to being enough to avoid hefty student loans. I'm already in debt for my house, my car and my motorcycle. There's no way a student loan would be doable.

I know, we're supposed to think ahead right? It's what I WILL be making once I got that degree. Reality is quite different. We all know that a degree doesn't equate a higher check these days. The employment pool is flooded with them. They're not special anymore.

I work with several people who make less than I do, but have degrees. The workforce is realizing (again) that experience and attitude is better than paper promises.

In my field, my knowledge is leaps and bounds over what those eggheads have. Yet they always complain that they should be making more because they went to school. Well, actually no. You'd make more, if you put your nose to the grindstone and worked your butt off and took direction well. They promoted me three months ago, and the two people up against me both had 4 year degrees. I thought for sure one of them had it in the bag. But they chose the long haired, bearded tattoo having biker type to lead the department. Imagine that!

a reply to: lakenheath24

Universities were originally set up for strictly higher learning, if someone wanted a career they apprenticed under a master in the field of choice.

Today they have become a scam for fleecing the masses of money, and many times put them into a lifetime of debt.

We've become a blurred society of life and career choices.

My personal experience has taught me that a collage education is actually a detriment in terms of work ethics and cognitive abilities.

I know because I have been trying to manage these people a little longer than a decade now. I get more productivity and personal responsibility with less entitlement and complaining from high school educated people than collage educated ones. Not all but most are a bunch of self entitled narrow minded sjw's who think they deserve something for nothing.

it depends on degree you have

I think that with MBA there are good chances to get a prestigious job. If you attend EMBA events you know that many businessmen have it. MBA offers a wealth of advantages, especially when it's offered by a top business school with a very good reputation.

originally posted by: bigfatfurrytexan
a reply to: bender151

Its been a long time since I tried to attend college....

....do they provide placement or employment stats to folks choosing their major? That would really help, along with listings of job titles that one could expect to use their education in.

When I started my current major a couple years ago, the first day of the first class in that major involved placement statistics for the industry as a whole, likely jobs, program graduation rates, and industry related employment rates at graduation, 6 months, 12 months, and 24 months after graduation.

All good programs will do this (and your advisor will provide that information on request, if it's not published for all), but not all programs are good.

originally posted by: Edumakated
What people also need to realize is that there are only about 50 schools that are considered prestigious. These are the schools where your job prospects will be the highest graduating. If you get into an Ivy or peer schools, then taking on loans within reason is not necessarily a bad investment. Otherwise, you should go to the cheapest school you can find and take on as little debt as possible.

This is not true for Computer Science. Sure, there's the top 10 and top 50, but big industry in the US will recruit all the way down to the top 200, and some cases beyond that. Silicon Valley for example has major representatives at every Community College and University in California regardless of prestige. In other areas of the country there's regional or local employers. Then you have schools like mine which get zero recruiter interest but within game dev specifically have an extremely good name from what is otherwise a 5th tier school.

originally posted by: lakenheath24
a reply to: Quetzalcoatl14

I think my perspective if it being easy is because I spent 24 years in the military, and THEN went to school on my GI Bill. It's a whole lot different when you are doing it for yourself and know you only have so much time to get your degree done(36 months), so you work hard at it.

I just find it appalling at the way some people write. On here, meh, but a no kidding 20 page paper, it looks like high school level work.

I just had to write a 35 page paper. I got a D- on it. I was pretty unhappy with the grade. My paper was fine, the problem was the English department requirements for the paper. I have a big problem with English departments in schools, they pretend to be experts on everything but in reality know nothing. What ticked me off with this paper in particular is there was no leeway allowed to make conclusions or do your own thinking. Right or wrong, every idea expressed had to be taken and sourced from someone else and that felt very wrong to me. Even something as simple as "the sky is blue" had to be sourced from someone elses opinion.

originally posted by: Aazadan

originally posted by: Edumakated
What people also need to realize is that there are only about 50 schools that are considered prestigious. These are the schools where your job prospects will be the highest graduating. If you get into an Ivy or peer schools, then taking on loans within reason is not necessarily a bad investment. Otherwise, you should go to the cheapest school you can find and take on as little debt as possible.

This is not true for Computer Science. Sure, there's the top 10 and top 50, but big industry in the US will recruit all the way down to the top 200, and some cases beyond that. Silicon Valley for example has major representatives at every Community College and University in California regardless of prestige. In other areas of the country there's regional or local employers. Then you have schools like mine which get zero recruiter interest but within game dev specifically have an extremely good name from what is otherwise a 5th tier school.

Hard sciences tend to be less concerned about school rankings. My point though is that most schools are not worth the massive tuition bills. It is one thing to pay $60k/yr to attend say Stanford with excellent job prospects at graduation vs $50k at say a fourth tier school. If you are going to pay a lot to attend, it needs to be a top tier school IMHO. This is why I said there are really only about 50 schools that are considered prestigious and worth going into debt to attend.

The school loan system has allowed bottom tier schools to charge top tier tuition, but the ROI is not the same for most students.

a reply to: poncho1982

The workforce is realizing (again) that experience and attitude is better than paper promises.

you say this yet hiring practice continue to move in the other direction

originally posted by: lakenheath24
a reply to: JAGStorm

Good god!!!!!!!!!! I wouldn't be able to sleep at night. I would drive my kids down to the Air Force recruiter and drop them off. Here Son/Daughter, talk to this nice Tech Sargeant. Ask him about the GI Bill. I will see you in a couple months after you have finished your technical training as a med tech, aircraft maintainer, or other great career field that you can use later on in life. In the mean time you will learn people and management skills, can learn more about yourself than you ever thought. You are welcome.

Why force someone into a career instead of let them figure out what they want to do? The best careers are not 9-5 jobs, they are hobbies that you monetize. You're not going to have a hobby of being a med tech or aircraft maintainer.