Bigelow, UFOs, MUFON and ‘DeLonge’ Road to AATIP

originally posted by: mirageman
a reply to: Willtell

That list is interesting because APEN were actually active in Britain. They appeared to be a far right wing group masking as a ufology group or maybe the other way around. Possibly that was just a cover for another organisation to infiltrate UK ufology.

They bombarded various researchers and UFO groups in the UK during the mid 1970s - mid 90s with cassette tapes and literature. Sometimes including bizarre Nazi propaganda. House break-ins were also reported. To date no one has really cleared up what exactly went on and who was behind it. But their objective seemed to be to disrupt British ufology. Especially concerning the UK's two big UFO cases Berwyn and Rendlesham.

Hmmm

I do recall the weird actions of APEN, the very prolific Nick Redfern has revealed much about them in one of his books.

Many researchers have pointed out the often fringe right-wing connections to the traditional period of UFOlogy, in contrast to the new period of UAP’S.

(ufo, uap? semantics are the last refuge of a bull sh___er)


Anyway, we all recall the Silver Shirts movement of William Dudley Paley and his interest in UFOlogy and his supposed connections to Adamski and George Hunt Williamson.
Interesting connections though one doesn’t necessarily have anything to do with the other.

I think blaming the roll-out of TTSA on the fact Hillary lost and Trump won, so "lets go ahead anyways" is just too simplistic. There have always been factions within the military and government so without more info I think we're jumping the shark with that assumption.

Elizondo pulling a sideways information declassification is highly interesting. My first question would be "who was asleep at the wheel?" It's very possible some of the sidelining of Delonge is due to internals trying to contain the cluster cluck of Elizondo getting some info past main channels and giving him enough rope to hang himself with?

Of course I'm just spit-balling.

a reply to: Caver78

All of us are spit-balling to some degree.

Back in the beginning I had a conversation with a certain someone
about Hilary, wikileaks and the whole thing going on at that time..
that conversation did not go well... there was huge frustration
about how the cesspool of american politics had yet again
gotten in the way of something worthwhile.

so while I agree that there are various actors at work here.. various
agendas.. the politics of it certainly WAS a big factor in the beginning.

We can certainly say, that there will be no more $22 million dollar
endowments from the current senate majority leader.

I'd say that most parties who think they know something about all
this, are mostly wrong.. but despite being mostly wrong, they
try to force things to unfold according to their agenda anyway.

And us "outsiders" just get more and more frustrated.. as we see
how little they actually know.. but how deceptive they are..
(they bet 12 sixes on liars dice to the public, when they have
2 sixes in their dice cup).

Things are a tad more visible than they once were.. due to the
great research of various people on ATS and others who run
reputable blogs/shows. That's something at least.

Kev

a reply to: KellyPrettyBear

In these times it's going to be miserable for IC campers to run any kind of disinfo program or even a psy-ops past anyone with internet access or an unbroken google finger.

I also have a VERY difficult time believing as previously mentioned that TDL got off a plane an a multiple star general jumped at the chance to "give him" resources.
BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

Not in our reality. It is possible that General is one of the puppet-masters tho. At least that would make some sense. Have to still disagree that this plan was hinged on a democratic political win. Hillary has done exactly nothing she's ever promised. Hubby Bill could at any time blow the doors off this if he was inclined an willing to take another ear beating from his Missus.

We're not seeing that either.

Trump with his itchy Twitter finger and temper tantrums equally isn't in a position to ever find out enough or force the parties responsible to "fess up".

It's harder to just call a zebra a zebra but this could all really be as simple as a paper pusher dropped the ball an Elizondo made off with "some goods". Fortunately for whoever has a vested interest in making some waves.
Again....call me crazy, but couldn't some great military grade video footage be leveraged with aviation companies?
If you're going to sell out to the highest bidder that is?

All under the auspices of doing a public service such as disclosure?

This might be a tiny bit off topic, but certainly related to the current speculation as the what TTSA and IC community are up to with the present day "disclosure" shenanigans.

I'm scanning ATS for interesting threads when I come across this thread title:

“The Air Force is putting 'tremendous emphasis' on preparing for war in space”

www.abovetopsecret.com...

on the first page, these comments started to catch my attention:

originally posted by: Azureblue
“Kerry Cassidy of project camelot has talked about the secret space race for many years.

Her whistle blowers tell her there are various types of ETs who are supporting various earth bound forces and are using them as their proxies forces fighting for control of the earth."

To which another poster replied:


“Oh no you didnt....

Take this ET talk out of here, apart from some of the crap Astr0 spouted its a forum mainly based on Aircraft Projects.“

Which prompted what I think is a pretty intriguing response from username: Archivist -

“That aside, the discussion of preparation in response to an eventual threat is appropriate.

One day we will have to face a military conquest from a civilization utilizing space as it's battlefront.

It may be a branch of our own, or entirely from somewhere else... Ultimately... That is a question of when, not if.

Also, I have reason to believe, with high confidence, that we have begun to receive so called "First Contact" signals. There are artificial signals from elsewhere, intersecting with Earth. I have proof beyond a reasonable doubt on this, but I refuse to divulge it at this time. (Another group has the responsibility of publication for this finding. I am waiting for them. Not BS. Fairly certain there are several observatories that have come to the same conclusion. I don't know who is publishing the meat and potatoes first, but I know there is one team I am expecting to hear from, soon.) “


I know its suspect to take a random users comments on this forum as "truth"... but I couldn't help think that, like others have speculated, the current disclosure lite process might be helping provide cover, obfuscation and/or justify other projects that need it. It would also be amazing if Archivist's comments are in fact true... imagine new evidence of signals from other planets?

Anyhow, whether you believe in the Wernher Von Braun false flag UFO theory or not, (I tended to disregard it as near impossible due to the technological challenges of fooling billions of people with something as sci-fi looking as a UFO attack, but considering how far we've come with CGI effects etc... who knows) the fact that Leslie Kean was just quoted as saying there is evidence that UAP/UFOs have been witnessed coming in and out of earths atmosphere and the TTSA crew is pushing their talking points, its certainly looks like there is a deeper agenda unfolding.

It is unlikely Disclosure as they could disclose if they wanted to/had the means and will.

It could be a cover story leading to something related (space weapons, false flag UFO event).

Actual disclosure of a WOW signal.

Simply more fake news to disorient the public and further disempower the general public.

I personally hope the post is true and we will hear about a new "wow signal" soon... then again, maybe even that is disinformation.

a reply to: Harpua

Regarding the aliens are attacking idea, I wonder what they could do to simulate such an attack?

Also, what will they do to persuade the people of the earth such an attack is taking place.

Anything is possible, from a real attack from outer space to an alien false flag. When were ignorant and don’t know then anything is possible.


I say the most interesting thing in this AATIP, TTSA incident is the media accepting this story

That may be the real story, therefore maybe they are preparing us for some big disclosure

a reply to: Caver78

the problem is, there is at most 5% to disclose.

(per Kit Green.. and I totally agree).

So these guys are singing and dancing for their supper, and hoping to make
more of it, than really exists, to get the nuts and boltsers on board and
other subgroups of folks who've they've managed to delude over the years.

They want funding that they will now not get..
They want to examine the brains of experiencers.. which they will get I imagine..
I'd see Bigelow behind those "experiencer reporting websites" but can't prove it..

There's not much there, there.

a reply to: KellyPrettyBear

I think ttsa included nuts n bolts in the campaign amongst skinwalker ranch type stuff and Roswells "life form" in a simple effort to cast a wide net and suck as varied a demographic they could into their little scheme.

originally posted by: BASSPLYR
a reply to: KellyPrettyBear

I think ttsa included nuts n bolts in the campaign amongst skinwalker ranch type stuff and Roswells "life form" in a simple effort to cast a wide net and suck as varied a demographic they could into their little scheme.

Agreed.

I still find TDL's words about "aliens" quite telling.

Of course he was fed a ton of disinfo..

but this particular wording rings bells, that something more than
simple disinfo was at play.

a reply to: pigsy2400

....one other area that hasn't been spoken about much since TTSA released statements etc, is the app that they are developing which will allow you to upload UAP/UFO sightings immediately after they happen. Along with the option of uploading videos/images of said sightings.

This was mentioned at launch date and probably is one of the things that could be developed quite easily with the current finances available. But it's all gone quite over there about the app and the UAP experiencer studies.
The app, if done properly takes MUFON out of the game. It also means they can read all sorts of stuff about anyone who downloads it onto a smartphone if they so wish.

If the TTSA people wanted to keep the appearance that this project really is some sort of Public UFO Study then you'd have thought they'd have sorted the app out immediately. It probably would be prone to hoaxers and crazies sending in duff info. But that has always come with the territory. I'm surprised it wasn't ready and launched a lot sooner.

....they want to control the narrative - hell they always have! Anything we have ever learned really has come the big evil government really.

It all started in the early days if the Cold War. The 1952 Saucer flap over DC really shook the military up. This was all being reported in the mainstream press at the time and the people wanted answers. That's when a cover-up really did kick in after the recommendations of the Robertson Panel. The fear was that with all the hysteria about Flying Saucers the West could be prone to a Soviet attack. Do you see a parallel with today?

They've probably been refining it ever since to suit officialdom but not to cover up ET. However I don't think any governments know that much about what is going on. Maybe if they pooled resources they'd know a little more. But I suspect everything remains fragmented even within the US. I also doubt there is an organized evil group in overall control. Some believe its demons, some believe ET, others nothing at all. So internal battles are continually fought.

I think that Lazar was taken advantage of to leak a fake story when they knew he had connections with Lear as an example, so they set him up to fail. Bill Moore the same really...and as unpopular as this will go down, Knapp and how C2C was created to drive that narrative.

The 1980s were a crazy time in ufology when things went dark, very dark. Much meddling went on and ufology has never recovered from it. Art Bell took C2C and made it what it was. Whether he, Bob Bigelow, George Knapp and others have all been manipulated at times I don't know? We have to be very careful about joining too many dots in some grand conspiracy and making people guilty by association with each other. But we shouldn't be blind to the possibility either.

...control and collection of data relating to the issue - so they can control it, analyse it, use it to see where the UAPs turn up....

It would appear that's been going on with varying degrees of control since the 1990s. Some interesting points there.

Any thoughts on why this always seems to be very US-centric though?

a reply to: mirageman

"Any thoughts on why this always seems to be very US-centric though?"

1. The United States has no culture to glue it together... it's fragmented and at
war with itself... magnifying paranoia and a desire to win at any cost.

2. The United States has the largest military budget.. and as it crumbles as
a super-power, it entertains any and all concepts, no matter how paranoid.

3. Some large percent of the USA is illiterate and loves their guns and bibles
as unfortunately former president obama said, which exploded the culture
war and was enough to get Trump elected.. just do to that.. a lot of people
here will believe almost anything.

Lots of other countries are poor and unstable.. but we are "poor" as a culture,
unstable and have the INTERNET to spread craziness more than anyone.

Let's start there..

I don't understand why the I.C. would do cold war shenanigans anymore..
the UFO stuff here is making us look weak and foolish now..
I'd say that fewer and fewer people actually believe that the USA has
alien tech and is in concert with aliens.. to keep Russia scared.

Hell, a Kremlin operative ("theoretically") is president now.. there would
be no reason for Russia to be afraid or to believe UFO BS.

It’s the nukes people.

I believe the main reason this is what is is over the nukes.

We take for granted that we are close to self-destruction

As well, we do not even know what are the ramifications of our extinction regarding other parts of the solar system

Now whether they are egging us on to blow ourselves to oblivion and wipe out this abomination called humans or trying surreptitiously to save us is the question.

Were are a reckless species of savages is the bottom line and need help

a reply to: Willtell

I agree with your final sentence 100%.
Chimps with nukes.

But you are not usually this "negative"?

Kev

a reply to: KellyPrettyBear

That's a fairly depressing view of your own nation young Kevin. Do you really sense the end of Empire coming?

I don't understand why the I.C. would do cold war shenanigans anymore.. the UFO stuff here is making us look weak and foolish now.. I'd say that fewer and fewer people actually believe that the USA has alien tech and is in concert with aliens.. to keep Russia scared.

That's a very good point. I'm not sure Russia is scared any more. Putin seems to be able to influence democratic elections in the US and Europe, poison enemies abroad and exercise his 'right to arm bears'.

originally posted by: KellyPrettyBear
a reply to: Willtell

I agree with your final sentence 100%.
Chimps with nukes.

But you are not usually this "negative"?

Kev

Are you kidding, you don’t read my posts on other subjects.

And I wouldn’t call it negative, calling humans, on the most part, savages, it’s a recognition of empirical reality

There are some non-savage humans, of course

a reply to: Willtell

Personally I don't go with nukes affecting something out there as an explanation for UFOs. Nearly 2,500 nukes have been exploded in tests. Two were dropped in anger.

The Shoemaker-Levy 9 Comet slammed into Jupiter in 1994 with the impact of fragment G being "600 times the world's nuclear arsenal".(ref). Did that affect anything 'out there'?

If 'they' are trying to save us then how many good examples of this are there against the 2,500 explosions we've had?

If 'they' aren't intervening then that's exactly what would happen if 'they' don't exist.

Remember it's just my opinion!

originally posted by: mirageman
a reply to: KellyPrettyBear

That's a fairly depressing view of your own nation young Kevin. Do you really sense the end of Empire coming?

I don't understand why the I.C. would do cold war shenanigans anymore.. the UFO stuff here is making us look weak and foolish now.. I'd say that fewer and fewer people actually believe that the USA has alien tech and is in concert with aliens.. to keep Russia scared.

That's a very good point. I'm not sure Russia is scared any more. Putin seems to be able to influence democratic elections in the US and Europe, poison enemies abroad and exercise his 'right to arm bears'.

you posted those words, just as an excuse to show us putin riding that bear..
that PRETTY BEAR...

HMMM.

originally posted by: Willtell

originally posted by: KellyPrettyBear
a reply to: Willtell

I agree with your final sentence 100%.
Chimps with nukes.

But you are not usually this "negative"?

Kev

Are you kidding, you don’t read my posts on other subjects.

And I wouldn’t call it negative, calling humans, on the most part, savages, it’s a recognition of empirical reality

There are some non-savage humans, of course

I READ ALL YOUR POSTS in this forum anyway... every line.
I consider carefully whether you have a valid point.. and sometimes i think you do.
I star at least 25% of your posts.
Oh I disagree with you a lot...

but I'm overall a very fair person..

I can be a real butt-head.. true... I call a spade a spade.

You don't know me at all.

Kev

a reply to: mirageman

I agree 100%.

Even my "hypothetical plasma critters" --- they are so integrated into the human
brain and nervous system, of pretty much everyone.. and may be outside of time
some of them or all of them... they know years in advance before we scratch our
left nostril. They'd dodge nukes with 100% accuracy.

I find no merit in this theory for a host of reasons having nothing to do with
hypothetical plasma entities.. there is simply no evidence for it.

You an twist around a few UFO stories.. but in reality? Anything that's actually
out there... doesn't seem to care about us one way or another..

"don't want to help us"
"don't want to hurt us".

But in fairness to the topic... what do you think of the ICBM incident where
all the launch software went wacky.. was it Minot ND case?

Kev

a reply to: mirageman

trump is dismantling the US, and making a laughing stock of us.
He wants to to be "president for life" and says that "maybe we will
try that some day".

I think Trump is looking for a reichstag to set on fire..

His "base" would support him, even if he were discovered raping baby
jesus on national television.

yes.. i'm that down on the USA..

Kev