It's official , Jerusalem is Israel's capital - Trump

a reply to: enkilo

Die zionist hating prick die!
/*burns an enkilo poster

a reply to: Peeple

I think we can safely give enkilo the knock out victory over peeble

a reply to: enkilo

I think it's save to say then Israel won?

a reply to: gortex

I think it's more the case that they are establishing themselves in the borders they were assigned, which were not respected by the Arab & Muslim world around them. They have a right, by most interpretations, to occupy the territorial borders which were explicitly (& in part implicitly) assigned to them after WW2.

It's telling that you have made no comment of any substance regarding the indisputable fact that a Nazi philosophy & expression of political, intelligence & military aims against the state of Israel has been emphatically extant since the day the state was re-established.

The Israelis have the right to establish themselves in their historical territories, to create a buffer zone against hostile states & extra-territorial peoples around them, and to defend themselves with staunch resolve & fierce action, in the face of the unceasing waves of sabotaging hatred, bloody & wanton violence & ethno-religious persecutions which they are up against (and still suffer, daily, although in limited measure only because of their fierce resistance against the Islamic vitriol directed towards them from every conceivable direction).

The Palestine problem was deliberately left unsolved by the Nazi/Arab alliances in the nations around the state of Israel, PURELY FOR PROPAGANDA REASONS, which these bleeding heart liberals have been whining about for decades now, having fallen for the shrewd Arab/Nazi plan hook, line & sinker..!! They left the Palestine to suffer an occupation (which was necessarily heavy-handed owing to the subterfuge & terrorism which was rife within its ranks), despite having all power to resolve the matter within a heartbeat, using a planned relocation into one or multiple Arab states amongst the surrounding nations. ALL Arab/Muslim states declined to help the Palestine people ONLY because they knew it would be useful as a means of denigrating the political public relations situation of the state of Israel.

Answer these issues, which I have restated & clarified somewhat for you, and try not to throw down anything else akin to the lazy, ignorant, liberal star-grabbing (& rather pathetic) irrelevancy to which I am replying. Let's have a real conversation here.

Thanks.

a reply to: Peeple

huh?

a reply to: FlyInTheOintment

The Israelis have the right to establish themselves in their historical territories. Why? because a fairy tale says so.

a reply to: enkilo

I was proving the point that it's impossible to discuss with someone who only yells "die!" at your face and you acknowledged it is.

a reply to: Peeple

it even more impossible to discuss with someone who is wiping your people out of existence. What do you expect the Palestinians to do? Accept extinction? Look at history. No one will accept that you take their homes no matter what historical claim you may have.

a reply to: enkilo

Come on please, where do you expect the jews to go if not the land they bought and own? Where is your sympathy for them? They were nearly extinct too and their crew didn't have the land to take them in as all the others oh so empathic with the palestinians?

originally posted by: FlyInTheOintment
a reply to: TonyS

All it does is antagonize the Muslims in the ME

Israel was created as a sanctuary state for a people that was horrifically & systematically persecuted by sadist fascist murderers making up an expansionist dictatorship intent on world conquest. You'd think that the Western world would still remember that fact seventy years on, and would accommodate the fact that they want the right to own & occupy the land they were given in that deal.

True, but the way that the West did it was wrong. Instead of taking land that was ours, we took land that belonged to someone else, and gave that other group's land to the Jewish survivors.

It's a very hollow form of charity to give a gift at someone else's expense, rather than at one's own.

Nobody asked the Palis if they wanted their nation to be overrun. Imagine if some distant, alien force were to invade Earth, win a war, and then declare the USA (or whatever country you live in) to be a sanctuary state for the Mexicans. Require us to open our borders to unlimited immigration from there?

Would you resent those aliens? Would you resent the Mexicans who came and overran your nation?

And NOBODY ever seems to remember that Muslims all over the world, and particularly the Muslim Brotherhood, supported the Nazis during WW2..!!! Nazi spymasters & military generals escaped to the Middle East after the war & proceeded to help a bunch of Muslim states to set up brutal military intelligence networks, and this was emphatically the case in Egypt & Syria. Many of these states promptly declared war on the newly formed state of Israel, clearly both Muslims & Nazis were intent on 'finishing the job' of the attempted 'final solution', even though Germany failed in the first attempt..!!!

So, you think we should still be holding a grudge?

We have totally forgiven Japan. And come to think of it: we've even totally forgiven Germany itself.

But yeah. We should definitely keep holding a grudge against the Muslims!

Why can't people see that the entire world has been manipulated into fascist, antireligious sympathy?!?!?!

The Nazi International is alive & well, it seems.

Nowhere is that more true than in Israel itself.

The vanquished became the conquerors.

One group is being exterminated to create "libensraum" for the other. It's just a different group, and a different plot of land.

originally posted by: FlyInTheOintment
a reply to: gortex

I think it's more the case that they are establishing themselves in the borders they were assigned, which were not respected by the Arab & Muslim world around them. They have a right, by most interpretations, to occupy the territorial borders which were explicitly (& in part implicitly) assigned to them after WW2.

Right, but the agreement didn't say the Palis were required to leave to make room for it. ...

It's telling that you have made no comment of any substance regarding the indisputable fact that a Nazi philosophy & expression of political, intelligence & military aims against the state of Israel has been emphatically extant since the day the state was re-established.

It's also present in those that favor it.

The Israelis have the right to establish themselves in their historical territories, to create a buffer zone against hostile states & extra-territorial peoples around them, and to defend themselves with staunch resolve & fierce action, in the face of the unceasing waves of sabotaging hatred, bloody & wanton violence & ethno-religious persecutions which they are up against (and still suffer, daily, although in limited measure only because of their fierce resistance against the Islamic vitriol directed towards them from every conceivable direction).

Let us be clear: events transpiring nearly 2000 years ago have ABSOLUTELY nothing to do with Israel's right to establish an apartheid stated.

The right to do so is based on the evacuation the Palis themselves undertook leading up to.... was it the 6 day war?
Or was it the war of independence? Or both?

Point is, because they fled during a time when the nation was under attack, it can rightly be said that they forsook their rights as citizens. At a minimum they lost "squatters rights". You can't leave prior to an attack, then take the side of the aggressors, and then afterward expect to be allowed back in.


I actually do sympathize with Israel's position on this particular issue.

The Palestine problem was deliberately left unsolved by the Nazi/Arab alliances in the nations around the state of Israel, PURELY FOR PROPAGANDA REASONS, which these bleeding heart liberals have been whining about for decades now, having fallen for the shrewd Arab/Nazi plan hook, line & sinker..!! They left the Palestine to suffer an occupation (which was necessarily heavy-handed owing to the subterfuge & terrorism which was rife within its ranks), despite having all power to resolve the matter within a heartbeat, using a planned relocation into one or multiple Arab states amongst the surrounding nations. ALL Arab/Muslim states declined to help the Palestine people ONLY because they knew it would be useful as a means of denigrating the political public relations situation of the state of Israel.

That's just fantasy. Only a child could really believe such a large group of people being repatriated would work for anyone. The neighbors would be unjustly required to absorb a huge refugee population they don't have room for.

If there were "just compensation" given to people who lose personal property during the relocation it would easily be in the high billions.

Compensation given when moving just 4,000 Jewish citizens out of Gaza cost Israel 1.6 billion.

en.wikipedia.org...

At the time when Israel became independent, there were over 1.3 million non Jewish people living there.

en.wikipedia.org...(region)



However............. When the palestinian population evacuated themselves in anticipation of the six day war they solved that problem for you (or maybe I'm getting my wars confused here? But I think it was the 6 day war.)

The Palis gambled and lost. You can't just welch on a bet because you lose.

They would have been more than happy to claim the spoils if they had won. And who knows what the invading armies would have done to the Jews living there? (Probably not anything very nice!!!)

If any of that seems self contradictory, well.....

Balanced views often do seem self contradictory from the perspective of extremists. I have no malice for either group that lives in Israel. They're both wrong about some things and they're both right about some things.

But on balance, I think Israel's territorial claim is stronger, so long as they leave Gaza and the West bank alone.

a reply to: Peeple

did they buy the lands from the people living there or from England who had no right to the land in the first place? What would you do if tomorrow the government decide to sell your property to someone else without your consent because the land was once owned by their ancestor? Would you accept that or try to defend your property.

a reply to: bloodymarvelous

but they will not leave Gaza and west bank alone. their intent is greater Israel.

a reply to: bloodymarvelous

in a decade or two if the situation stays the same I doubt there will be a Gaza or west bank or any Palestinians left. Considering what the jew suffered in Germany this will be absolute proof that humanity does not learn from history.

a reply to: enkilo

Okay let's run down the streets yelling death to aĺl brits until we got that out of our system and then maybe we accept this is the reality we live in.
History is good and important to learn from, but now is the reality in which we live in and in that Israel is only defending its property while their neighbours want them dead. What do you expect them to do and if they are as evil as you seem to think why aren't all palestinians dead yet?
If Israel would have the same revenge for history mentality as the palestinians do, why are they not just wiping out Germany and take their land?
Your attitude has a lot of inherent problems.

a reply to: Peeple

At the rate it is going there won't be any Palestinians left soon so they are already doing it. You keeping skirting around the issue of property because I doubt very much you would accept someone just taking what yours because of some fairy tale claim. So the Israeli have a right to defend themselves yet the Palestinians should just accept their fate. what kind of B.S is that?
yes, we must deal with the world as it is not how we want it to be but that does not mean accepting what is wrong as being right. Remember South African apartheid, it was a reality but it was still wrong.

a reply to: enkilo

Answer my questions.

It's just Trump playing to his religious base the scary thing is his speech the other day saying the Johnson act is on his list to get rid of.
I do suspect he does want to start a religious war maybe Pence in his ear.

originally posted by: enkilo
a reply to: bloodymarvelous

in a decade or two if the situation stays the same I doubt there will be a Gaza or west bank or any Palestinians left. Considering what the jew suffered in Germany this will be absolute proof that humanity does not learn from history.

Humanity certainly does learn............... Modern Germany has done much to become a decent place and many Jews live there today. You do know today a born in Germany Jewess is in the finals to become Miss Germany? One of the best allies Israel has got is Germany and has become a major supplier of military equipment including subs to protect Israel from being defeated. Humanity does learn, unfortunately some Paletinians don't.

a reply to: Peeple

my attitude is the problem. Believing that all human should be treated equally is the wrong approach?
As for not wiping out Germany, well for one their promised land isn't Deutschland. For two I think they'll find the German army a very different proposition from Hamas.