catalonian parliament declares independence from Spain

a reply to: yuppa

Opinion polls (I know they're complete trash but still worth a look) show a respectable and healthy lead for the pro-independence camp in the run up to the referendum.

source

I actually think the heavy crackdown from Madrid will have swayed some former anti-independence folks into the pro-camp by now.

originally posted by: gortex
a reply to: AngryCymraeg

Agreed , 43% of potential voters backing the vote is hardly a majority which is probably what Spain will focus on.

Should be few % more due to the dozens of closed election places.

Second thing, If You dont voted in Your country most important referendum You should have problem to Yourself no to results or turmoil. This is democracy right? You have right to vote and right to not vote. And I am sure everyone in Catalonia knows about the referendum, so that was their OWN decision to not vote. We have to always pay the price of our mistakes.

Also on that 43% voter turnout - that's pretty standard if not good for a western country.

Meaning typically the outright majority winners of an election have less than 25% of the voters populace actually voting for them.

100 voters - 43 vote - 22 for A and 21 for B A wins but with only 20% of available votes.
100 voters - 43 vote - 25 for A and 18 for B A wins huge landslide and claim they have huge historical backing but still only 25% of people voted for them.

At least that's the way I see it and with all the gerrymandering those results can be skewed even further.

a reply to: szino9
Yeah true you can see why the EU wants things to remain on an economic basis. Plus it's an empir in all but name and empires don't usually voluntarily give up their lands.

Can this be an analog to what led up to WWII in the making?

History repeats itself....Certain rough similarities:

In WWII, the Spanish civil war started around the time of Hitler’s rise, 1936. Hitler and the other fascist power at the time, the Italian leader Mussolini, helped the Spanish fascists.

Today, not that I am calling Putin Hitler, but he is the placeholder for the opposition to America, in that the tension is high between the two super powers.


During WWII the US was in deep strife with Japan, now the US is in deep strife with N Korea, and potentially China.

Again, granted, these are rough similarities but they are parallel enough to draw an analog.

originally posted by: intrptr
Reminds me of Soviet style repression of Hungary.

What an ignorant statement. You really have no idea. The repression in the Soviet regimes does not come close to Catalonia and the Spanish attempts to legally apply Spanish constitutional authority. The situation is complicated, but I don't think you'll get thousands killed, extrajudicial killings, deportations and genocide. Yes, a few riots, but that'll be it.

a reply to: SprocketUK

Everything is about money. I accept independence, but can you guys survive without Spain

a reply to: Willtell

Except the EU bureaucrats are a bunch of un-elected dictatorial you-know-whats. Spain has been having economic issues that being in the EU hasn't let them attempt to solve thanks to the kleptocrats.

a reply to: ketsuko

Except this is like 80 years later with social media lol

originally posted by: ICycle2
a reply to: SprocketUK

Everything is about money. I accept independence, but can you guys survive without Spain

What is there to miss? Oranges and cars you can get from Germany and Czech with different badges. Funny dancing women, actually the football but surely that will still be played?

a reply to: PublicOpinion


Given your statement I have to ask

1) How badly did they want independence?
2) How much did they deserve it?

I witnessed with my own eyes people walk for hours through 110+ degree heat, passing corpses with blue inked thumbs. Just so that they could vote and mark their ballot by inking it with their thumb print. They deserved the right to vote for whomever they and whatever they wanted. Death was a very, very real possibility for them.

Afraid of a few bruises so they didn't vote. Cowards the lot of them.

a reply to: 200Plus

Catalonia votes amid violent clashes

Lotta cowards in uniform and riot gear, right.

Oh the fear
Oh the despair
Oh the sheer terror of people voting for independence!

If Noah had the benefit of hindsight on his ship He could've snatched two unicorns and left behind the mother#ing...

originally posted by: PublicOpinion
a reply to: yuppa

Except that many people didn't want to get a beating just for heading to the polls. Maybe, eventually. Who would've thunkt! Nice spin though, lets just deny the fact that another police state went full blown berserk again. Well. Played.

Well said.

Charges of rebellion have been filed against the Catalonian leadership. The Spanish government has moved to strip power from the Catalonian regional government. New regional elections are scheduled for December I believe.

Some European governments have stated they will not recognize Catalonian independence unless its done within accordance of Spanish law.

a reply to: paraphi

You hope. The display the police put on just to prevent voting was brutalistic and totalitarian, nonetheless.

You can down play that all you like....

They_Will_Be_Free.

a reply to: intrptr

Free like Crimea?

They need to use existing Spanish law for independence instead of unilateral action that does not have the support of the majority of the people in the affected region.

Just like Crimea.

Meanwhile, five hours ago...

a reply to: intrptr

Meanwhile 20 days ago across Russia -

Well the Franco-like Prime Minister doesn't seem to actually be doing anything tonight to enforce his rule on the Catalan Republic, other than firing all their ministers. Which I'm sure they'll pay attention to...

Guess they're waiting for tomorrow.