A question for the Pro-Life crowd.

originally posted by: Middleoftheroad

originally posted by: veracity
a reply to: Middleoftheroad

you usually put yourself in the category, no one throws you in there

Actually its the reverse. I haven't stated I'm pro-life/choice because honestly I'm in the middle somewhere with my own opinions on it. But, considering your "low-level" thinkers comment. I'd say you think you're opinion on abortions is superior to others opinions, so I won't waste any more time debating with you.

smart move

originally posted by: dawnstar
a reply to: Middleoftheroad

there are probably less late term abortions, and yet, the right to life seem to want to make it seem that every abortion is late term...

Most of the people I tend to agree with are arguing the same points. I haven't seen any poster on this site state that a woman that was raped should be forced to have the child. I also haven't seen any pro-life posters stating women that can die from medical complications should be forced to have the child to prevent an abortion. Usually, all I see them disagree with is all these irresponsible people use abortions like they were buying a condom at the store. Or what is considered a proper cutoff date for a late term abortion.

a reply to: Middleoftheroad

If someone wants to be low-life irresponsible and treat abortions as condoms, they should have every right to be low life...and the right to have the negative karma that comes with it.

Why are you so worried about other people's irresponsible behavior?

originally posted by: windword

originally posted by: Middleoftheroad

originally posted by: windword

originally posted by: Middleoftheroad

originally posted by: dawnstar
a reply to: Middleoftheroad

maybe is disdain for those who chose to give a rat's behind for anyone outside of them and theirs?

Why do you think pro-life people don't agree with abortions for women that were raped?

why do you think that all pro-choice people are pro-abortions...
why will a catholic hospital chose to let women suffer during a miscarriage till the heartbeat stops before intervening thus endangering the welfare of the mother?
why was it when that little nine year old girl that was raped by her father (maybe it was step father) did all those prolife people come onto a thread here on ats about it insisting that she should have to have those twins when it hit the news even though there was a whole crew of doctors and nurses insisting that she should have to carry them to term? why were those doctors and nurses...AND THE MOTHER of the nine year old child excommunicated from the catholic church? why did Valentina Milluzzo and Savita Halappanavar die???

I didn't say anything about pro-choice or anyone that agrees with it, so what are you on about? You would have to ask those specific Catholic people. I'm not religious, so I don't know their rules for being a member of their church. I'd be willing to bet you took the most extreme case and used it for your argument though.

How I feel, is every slut on the corner shouldn't be able to walk in and abort a baby for no reason. If medical issues arise during pregnancy and are a risk to the mother, then yes I feel abortion should be a choice for the mother. If a woman is raped and becomes pregnant, then yes they should be able to get an abortion. If the neighborhood hoe gets pregnant sleeping around like they do, then no they shouldn't be able to get an abortion. Obviously, its not all black and white like most in this thread argue it out to be.

So, you're pro-choice sometimes. But if a "slut/hoe" gets pregnant the punishment should be parenthood? Great attitude!

I know you guys are dying to throw me in a category, so put me in whatever category makes you feel better about yourself.

Okay then! I'm gonna say that you're pro-choice with exceptions to whores and sluts, who you think should be punished by being forced into motherhood.

I would say you are a triggered snowflake that is upset I won't agree with you.

a reply to: Middleoftheroad


Well, the ball is in your court. You explain why you're okay with abortion, aka murder, according to the pro-life stance, some of the time, but not other times. You explain why you think that motherhood should be a punishment for sluts and hoes.

I'll always err on the side of life. No matter what the circumstance. It's not a gray area for me. Nobody should be allowed to play God and determine if a life isn't needed/wanted/justified.

depends on what you define as "life". It can also just be an "earthsuite" or "human body".

According to reincarnation, you choose the body you want to be reborn in, you also choose your parents. If the soul is not yet in the "earthsuite"...it is NOT a life yet.

Lets say the soul IS in the earthsuite and the earthsuite is aborted...the soul just goes into another one. No real murder there, technically...at all.

The soul usually enters right before, sometimes even after birth. I felt mine in there a couple months before.

so techinically...aborting, although holds a huge mental toll to humans, is actually not a big deal. NOt that I would just abort willy, nilly...intent is what matters with Karma, but no need to shove your own beliefs onto someone thinking you are saving a life...get over it.

originally posted by: windword
a reply to: Middleoftheroad


Well, the ball is in your court. You explain why you're okay with abortion, aka murder, according to the pro-life stance, some of the time, but not other times. You explain why you think that motherhood should be a punishment for sluts and hoes.

When did I say murder? Haha, I feel I'm arguing with my teenagers always putting words in someones mouth. I'd say if the child was created during a crime, like rape, or is likely to kill the mother during the birth, abortion should be allowed.

When did I say murder? Haha, I feel I'm arguing with my teenagers always putting words in someones mouth. I'd say if the child was created during a crime, like rape, or is likely to kill the mother during the birth, abortion should be allowed.

There you go I copied and pasted so you can read it twice and retain what I said.

Just because a woman has a child doesn't mean she has to be a mother. Have you ever heard of the word adoption?

Adoption Definition

a reply to: Middleoftheroad

umm... you must not have been involved in as many threads on abortion/reproductive rights on ATS as I have...
because some have!!!

a reply to: Middleoftheroad


The Pro-life stance is that abortion is murder. The pro-life stance is that a woman doesn't have a right to abort based on that supposed fact.

Take a side! Are you pro-life? Or, are you pro-choice?

originally posted by: windword
a reply to: Middleoftheroad


The Pro-life stance is that abortion is murder. The pro-life stance is that a woman doesn't have a right to abort based on that supposed fact.

Take a side! Are you pro-life? Or, are you pro-choice?

Neither, I disagree with different points on both sides.

originally posted by: jjkenobi
I'll always err on the side of life. No matter what the circumstance. It's not a gray area for me. Nobody should be allowed to play God and determine if a life isn't needed/wanted/justified.

What should be done?

I know if it was me and I thought someone was "playing God" by ending the existence of a human being I would act in the most forceful manner I could to stop it. If I thought a doctor was systematically killing "children", I would stop that doctor myself by any means necessary.

We can have these philosophical arguments until next Saint Swithin's Day, but until those who think they know the answer match their actions to their rhetoric, I cannot take them seriously.

I'm a conservative. I hate how many losses we've eaten because a candidate has been an abortion-is-murder disciple. It's just so goddamn disingenuous.

The abortion-is-murder crowd needs to either match their actions to their rhetoric and either prevent the "murder" or pay for the pregnancy and adopt the child at birth.

Otherwise the Left will continue to use this issue to their advantage.

[My take on the abortion issue...] www.abovetopsecret.com...

a reply to: SBMcG

Otherwise the Left will continue to use this issue to their advantage.

ummm... ya, sure... here's a little history...



could it be possible that it was the republican party that created the abortion issue as a hot topic, just so they could grow their party with the religious?

a reply to: dawnstar

ding ding ding...republican law makers do not give a sheista about babies and abortion, they just want to strengthen their following on hartstrings of dead babies and the one and only "God".

The nutty religious right is behaving just as they want.

This should not even be a "political" issue. It should be a personal issue.

a reply to: dawnstar

Just so you know where this conservative stands on the abortion issue...

www.abovetopsecret.com...

That being said, you are somewhat correct, but you got the chicken before the egg.

In 1988 I was a (very young) delegate to the Repub' state convention here in Washington. Back then, we were a caucus state where people sat around and discussed the issues and candidates before voting on who the delegate from that district would represent at the state convention.

I was a Jack Kemp (RIP) supporter. I felt that from my constitutional secular conservative standpoint, he best represented my point of view.

But back then, the Republican Party on a national level, was facing a takeover by single-issue Evangelical voters supporting televangelist Pat Robertson. Because Washington was one of the few caucus states left, the Robertson faction saw our state as easy pickins.

On caucus day, the Robertson supporters descended on our district like locusts. It wasn't a caucus at that point -- they were just there to cast what was essentially a primary vote for Robertson. I was able to switch a few Bush supporters to Kemp, as I recall a couple Dole and Haig supporters as well, but the Robertson people held fast.

AS the final votes were cast, to keep our district from going to the convention with a vote for Pat Robertson, all of us supporting other candidates agreed to vote for George H.W. Bush, and somehow, I got elected to go to Olympia.

Long story short, the abortion-is-murder single-issue lunatics were never a significant part of the Republican Party before 1988 and Pat Robertson, and to the credit of the RNC, have had minimal influence over the Republican platform ever since.

Without a doubt the Party is pro-life and anti-abortion, but they long ago stopped focusing on that political hot potato.

I am still quite active in the local chapter here and can tell you that most Republicans in these part share my constitutional view of the abortion issue, and my political view that the issue itself is toxic to our party.

just one more video...



all in the name of "the right to life" and freedom of religion!!!

a reply to: SBMcG

regardless of weather it was the republicans or the religious right that initiated this grand marriage..
to say that it's the left that is taking advantage of it politically I don't see as correct..
the left might be gaining support from those of us who aren't as keen to have religion so entwined into our gov't and those of us who believe that a women should have some say as to what happens to her own body, but that's just a reactionary measure.

originally posted by: dawnstar
a reply to: SBMcG

regardless of weather it was the republicans or the religious right that initiated this grand marriage..
to say that it's the left that is taking advantage of it politically I don't see as correct..
the left might be gaining support from those of us who aren't as keen to have religion so entwined into our gov't and those of us who believe that a women should have some say as to what happens to her own body, but that's just a reactionary measure.

Are you one of those people who can't accept a win?

I am not religious. I agree with you 100% that I don't want religion in politics.

I agree that a woman should have complete control over her body. That doesn't mean I have to like the practice of abortion.

The Left would be stupid not to take advantage of this issue when they can. I can't think of the last abortion-is-murder nut who ran on the Republican ticket -- I think it was dirtbag Vitter from Louisiana...

Anyway, most Republicans, and certainly President Trump, don't feel that way. I don't either.

originally posted by: LesMisanthrope
Giving women control over their own bodies is both a moral and practical duty. But it is unmistakable that human life is being terminated in abortions.

Abortions should be allowed for rape victims and anyone else up until the baby becomes feasable and able to live on its own.(unless to save the womans life after) But rape victims should be given day after pills as part of treatment. If they were held captive and have went too far C sections to remove the fetus and tube incubate it till its viable at no cost.

As to people having sex unprotected and are ir responsible..screw you. Its your own fault and you should pay for your mistake by at least birthing it to give it away. Some people need to learn the hard way.

a reply to: yuppa

Yet another person who is fine with children being born, but does not care much what happens after, as long as it does not cost him anything.

The inconsistency in your argument is massive. You want children, babies no less, to be placed into the adoption system, a system which routinely cranks out a procession of psychopaths, because no one bothers to properly check the psychology of the prospective new parents, in a deep enough manner, leading to abusive parents creating dangerously damaged children and eventually adults, who will, as is the nature of these things, invariably either suffer torment the rest of their days, or worse, pass their sickness on to someone else later on in life.

But never mind that harsh reality, never mind the details yuppa, because your entitlement and lack of empathy has greater weight than reality, obviously... yes, fantastic logical consistency. Top bloody marks!

I despair, I really do.

Its attitudes like yours which prevent problems from being solved in this world. Your lack of empathy is staggering, your lack of awareness of the implications of what you are saying is mind boggling. You literally have no idea what you are talking about, none whatsoever.