Okay --- so WHAT ARE THE NEXT STEPS?

a reply to: BuzzyWigs

Maybe on Beck's motives. I really don't have a clue (nor do I necessarily care to). The last time I listened to Glenn Beck was when he was crying about Obama having a chance at getting elected. That should give you some reference as to how much faith I put in pundits. O'Reilly's show should be called the 'reverse-spin zone,' Hannity frequently contradicts himself, and Limbaugh has been 'done' IMO for a decade. I hadn't watched Fox News for years until this election, and CNN got me so disgusted I tried to switch back.

I want truth... not accusations, not opinions, not labels... facts.

As for Bannon, yesterday the CEO of Breitbart was interviewed on Morning Edition (NPR), and he whined about how Bannon didn't mean to hurt anyone when he referred to lesbians as a 'bunch of dykes' or something rude like that.

I really can't give that much weight. If a term is offensive, it is offensive no matter who uses it. Here where I grew up, that 'N'-word was part of the common language. White folk used it, black folk used it, all it meant was 'black man.' Somewhere, somehow, someone decided it was offensive. OK, when I realized some thought that, I made a serious attempt to not use it anymore. Then it became OK for a black man, but not for a white man? What? That's textbook racism. OK for one race, but not for another... like once the front seat on the bus was OK for one race but not for another. Both were and are wrong.

The same applies to 'dyke' or any other term. If you don't like the term, quit using it!

Bannon's appointment has been wildly cheered by the White Nationalists, and Breitbart is their fave. Even if he himself isn't - these white supremacists ARE ABSOLUTELY and they "love" him, because of his racism.

Many years ago, growing up in the Deep South, I heard people say things like "we need to send black folks back to Africa" or allegations that black folk had monkey DNA... and that was wrong! I remember when a major highway had a homemade sign that said "Have your black *snip* off this mountain by sundown." And yes, they meant it. That was wrong. I thank God above those days are gone.

That is racism. Those are actions and statements used to try and remove rights and dignity from someone over their race. Today people cry racism over a word taken out of context and spoken in private, or because of a non-racial disagreement. Sorry, but that's not racism.

So when I hear someone called a racist, I want to know what they did, specifically. Did they try to lynch someone because their skin was too dark? Did they try to pass a law to make people sit on the back of the bus again? Or did they utter a word that someone has deemed to be OK for one race only, and he's got the wrong skin color? Those are vastly different things.

I'm feeling generous today, Buzzy. You get to be the first person I tell this: Trump may be doing something I think is atrocious! I heard this morning he may be considering Nicki Haley, Governor of SC, for a cabinet position. I watched that witch order the desecration of Confederate War Memorials... and I would like nothing better than to see her out of politics, out of work, living in a gutter and freezing to death because the only blanket available to her has a Confederate Battlejack on it.

Desecration of a War Memorial is an act... not just a word. I hope Trump comes to his senses or I may have a YUUUUUGE disagreement with him.

TheRedneck

I think the people need to understand what we're up against, a private political machine that took over the Republican Party lock stock and barrel, in order to see what needs to be done.

“We urge the repeal of federal campaign finance laws, and the immediate abolition of the despotic Federal Election Commission.”

“We favor the abolition of Medicare and Medicaid programs.”

“We oppose any compulsory insurance or tax-supported plan to provide health services, including those which finance abortion services.”

“We also favor the deregulation of the medical insurance industry.”

“We favor the repeal of the fraudulent, virtually bankrupt, and increasingly oppressive Social Security system. Pending that repeal, participation in Social Security should be made voluntary.”

“We propose the abolition of the governmental Postal Service. The present system, in addition to being inefficient, encourages governmental surveillance of private correspondence. Pending abolition, we call for an end to the monopoly system and for allowing free competition in all aspects of postal service.”

“We oppose all personal and corporate income taxation, including capital gains taxes.”

“We support the eventual repeal of all taxation.”

“As an interim measure, all criminal and civil sanctions against tax evasion should be terminated immediately.”

“We support repeal of all law which impede the ability of any person to find employment, such as minimum wage laws.”

“We advocate the complete separation of education and State. Government schools lead to the indoctrination of children and interfere with the free choice of individuals. Government ownership, operation, regulation, and subsidy of schools and colleges should be ended.”

“We condemn compulsory education laws … and we call for the immediate repeal of such laws.”

“We support the repeal of all taxes on the income or property of private schools, whether profit or non-profit.”

“We support the abolition of the Environmental Protection Agency.”

“We support abolition of the Department of Energy.”

“We call for the dissolution of all government agencies concerned with transportation, including the Department of Transportation.”

“We demand the return of America's railroad system to private ownership. We call for the privatization of the public roads and national highway system.”

“We specifically oppose laws requiring an individual to buy or use so-called "self-protection" equipment such as safety belts, air bags, or crash helmets.”

“We advocate the abolition of the Federal Aviation Administration.”

“We advocate the abolition of the Food and Drug Administration.”

“We support an end to all subsidies for child-bearing built into our present laws, including all welfare plans and the provision of tax-supported services for children.”

“We oppose all government welfare, relief projects, and ‘aid to the poor’ programs. All these government programs are privacy-invading, paternalistic, demeaning, and inefficient. The proper source of help for such persons is the voluntary efforts of private groups and individuals.”

“We call for the privatization of the inland waterways, and of the distribution system that brings water to industry, agriculture and households.”

“We call for the repeal of the Occupational Safety and Health Act.”

“We call for the abolition of the Consumer Product Safety Commission.”

“We support the repeal of all state usury laws.”

From David Koch's 1980 party platform

a reply to: TheRedneck

You know what, I'm glad you reminded me about the use of the N-word in the context of Southern culture. I hadn't thought of that in years. My family has roots in a Northern state, and up there the N-word was indeed a derogatory term. My grandfather used it that way, he was racist, big time. Maybe outside of southern states that word was used as a purely derogatory term.

Both were and are wrong.

That's at the root of political correctness.

a reply to: TheRedneck

I really can't give that much weight. If a term is offensive, it is offensive no matter who uses it. Here where I grew up, that 'N'-word was part of the common language. White folk used it, black folk used it, all it meant was 'black man.' Somewhere, somehow, someone decided it was offensive. OK, when I realized some thought that, I made a serious attempt to not use it anymore. Then it became OK for a black man, but not for a white man? What? That's textbook racism. OK for one race, but not for another... like once the front seat on the bus was OK for one race but not for another. Both were and are wrong.

I get the meat and potatoes of what you are saying here but all things are not always created equal.

I may have a term of endearment that I use with my spouse or even my child, that if used by another, may be not only offensive but fighting words. Does that make it wrong?

I know people both Black and White that use the "N" word too frequently and often callously. These same people when using the word can mean it as a profanity or a term of affection.

As most of you know, I have one of the largest Heinz 57 families on this planet. For a family as large as mine, it is rare that we are as close as we are. Cultures, rituals, traditions, beliefs, are sometimes at odds, and we have done a fairly good job of either blending or ignoring those things that are too divisive.

The use of the "N" word is one that I call them out on every time. I have noticed a decrease in the use of the word, but it has not disappeared. All of my family knows that the use of the "N" word is a call to arms. They know to me they are fighting words, and most of my family don't want to go to battle with me.

a reply to: TheRedneck

That's good of you to recognize the pall cast upon us all with the appointment of a disinfo Right-Wing mouthpiece as his advisor, a Dominionist for VP, and now Sarah Palin for Sec of the Interior?!!!

Holy god.

Dykes is rude, so is the n word, and it is offensive, and BANNON KNOWS THAT.
I don't care how snowflakey you'd like to paint it - IT. IS. RUDE.

Unless HE HIMSELF is a lesbian who considers herself a 'butch dyke', he needs to keep his offensive mouth SHUT. But now, well, Breitbart owns the country, and Trump is their "king." Surrounding himself with sycophant nutters and making it into a real-life, world-class right-wing douchebaggery of a country.

Arrogant, rude, lacking all class and manners. Yeah - and it's all the rage and "cool" now for Trump fans to gloat and patronize and finger point and stick their tongues out at liberals. Disgraceful.

I've tried, and you have done an acceptable job of the dialogue - but dismissing NPR over Breitbart is - in a word - suspect, and speaks to confirmation bias and a preference for violent and hateful rhetoric. No matter HOW BAD Clinton is, she was not all the things you all claimed -
not a pedo, not a lesbian, not a murderer, not a Satanic blood drinking spell-casting she-devil. Yes, she is (and will remain) part of the machine. So will Bernie, and so will I.

People are PISSED OFF, and scared half to death. I keep hearing that both sides think the other one is trying to destroy the country but we have to work together. Yes. It is a fresh start, of sorts, if you want an opinionated, arrogant, impulsive man-child who prides himself in using bankruptcy laws, tax code, and general asshattery along with misogyny to get his points across.

A pussy-grabbing nincompoop whose only REAL concern is that he's a superstar. And now the President of the free world? It's absurd. It will fail.
You all can gloat and primp and ride all high and mighty on your dark horse, but it's not even December yet, and he is making it even worse. Draining the swamp? Sure. Replacing alligators with crocodiles and piranhas and sycophantic conspiracy theorists who disbelieve in science, who want to force women to have children but DON"T want to have to take care of those women OR their unwanted children --- just so they have the thing. Then no one gives a rats ass anymore, and no handouts.

You all had your guns all along. Now you're going to lose your medicaid, unemployment, disability, TANF (temporary assistance for needy families), WIC (women infant and children social services and nutrition and medical attention), ER access if you for some reason lose your job and have no insurance....

yeah. Can't wait.
Talk about shooting yourselves in the foot. You think you're going to get rich now? Ha. None of us are going to get rich. Those jobs are NOT going to come back. There is not going to be any WALL.

Do you not see this? You think the GOP did a great job of refusing Obama any little thing? Now you got the Tangerine Generalisimo. Still tweeting lunacy and double-speak. NO IDEA what he's gotten himself into, and he's putting trouble-making idiots in cabinet positions.

THIS IS NOT OKAY. It's NOT OKAY.

And it's not going to fly. Do you not see that? We aren't going silently into the night. The Bernie army is still alive and well. Warren is still in the Senate (so is Bernie). Congress didn't do anything for Obama. You think the GOP will do Trump's bidding? HA! They hate him, too!

Whatever. You all broke it - you'll have to deal with it. And then who's going to be crowing and gloating?

Stop telling us "are you okay, dearest"? No. We're not. You all may think it's all rainbows and leprechauns for you now, but millions of people who have struggled for decades to get to where we are now are having the rug pulled out from under them due to nothing but HATRED, BIGOTRY, and SELFISH JEALOUSY.

Sorry, but that's how I see it.
That's how the people now protesting see it, too.

You want what's best for ME? No you bloody well don't. and You don't care if my kids and I all starve to death, die of treatable illnesses, bleed out in the ER parking lot, or waste away on the streets.

YOU DON'T GIVE A CRAP. If that is not the truth, then tell me how you think this jerk is going to "make America great again." HOW? ALL of his decisions so far are objectionable, Bannon and Palin being the worst at the moment. Pence is a Dominionist disaster waiting to happen, and millions upon millions of people depend on the few social structures we have.

it's disgraceful. So - go gloat and prune and giggle with glee at how dismayed the other half of the country is. Your team won. Good luck with that.

I'm not feeling so generous today, Redneck, and frankly I disagree entirely that he is an "answer" for what ails us. You all will see it happening before your eyes. I hope you keep in mind that this is what you get for thinking he'd grow up and be a competent leader. He's not. So he's hiring other twisted loons to do the 'thinking' for him.

I'm not just embarrassed, I'm terrified.

a reply to: BuzzyWigs

Gee, Buzzy, calm down and breathe... you're going to give yourself an aneurysm!

Seriously, take a deep breath and clear your head. That was the most rambling, terrified, hateful post I have read in a long time, and I (hope I) know you better than that.

TheRedneck

a reply to: NightSkyeB4Dawn

I may have a term of endearment that I use with my spouse or even my child, that if used by another, may be not only offensive but fighting words.

I get what you are saying, and if it were a case of someone saying "I am offended by that word; please don't use it around me," I could completely understand. But this has become a case of "I am offended by that word. Don't use it EVER, even in private, or I'm going to take everything you own and destroy your name at the same time. Others can use it with impunity, but don't you even think of using it!" That's overboard.

All I am asking is that we stop the witch hunt. A word is simply a vehicle used to convey a thought. Context plays an enormous role, as you point out. But we have to all remember that our interpretation of word into thought may be in a different context than that which was intended.

Here's an example: Typically when face to face, I'll call a man "boss" or "hoss" (slang version of "haus," Mexican for friend as I understand it) and a woman "darlin'". I had to quit with the "darlin'" because one student questioned it after I had given her a tutoring session. Now, she could have simply told me "That makes me uncomfortable" and I would have quietly explained that I had no intention of making her uncomfortable, it was intended as a figure of speech only, and I would try to refrain from using it around her in the future. Done. But apparently she felt more comfortable going to a Dean with her complaint. No problem for me really, other than it being a pain for a few weeks trying to break an old habit.

Now I have no general term for a woman. And that actually makes it harder for me to communicate with women, because I don't have the luxury of addressing them in a friendly tone without remembering their name. With a man, I'll throw a "hoss" or "boss" in there if I'm having a mental block at the time. It's cool.

Now assume I am sitting at a HR desk interviewing applicants for a non-gender-specific job. Who do I want to talk to in more detail? The person I have to be careful of my words with, or the person I can speak freely with?

That's what a lot of people just don't seem to get. Yes, the country has eradicated a word. Yes, the country has shamed people they thought were being racist. No, it hasn't helped. Instead it has made communication more difficult and segregated the races further, not brought them closer together. It has advanced racism, not eradicated it. All it eradicated was an entry in a dictionary, and not even that fully, because some people can still use it, to remind others how crazy this whole argument is.

Oh, and it also got us Donald J. Trump for President. Can't forget that accomplishment...

TheRedneck

a reply to: BuzzyWigs

I totally agree. I think they know it's the truth but their emotional involvement in Trump has erased all reason.

So glad I don't have any kids!!

This country is on probation...did you think it was JUST about Hillary?

THAT fight was obvious,and simple.
NOW comes the REAL battles.

Found this on Facebook in one of my friend's feeds. I'm not going to share it on FB because I actually love those people and I refuse to do politics over there except an occasional video link......

But I AM going to post it here, for you all to read and consider:


"I listened as they called my President a Muslim.
I listened as they called him and his family a pack of monkeys.
I listened as they said he wasn't born here.
I watched as they blocked every single path to progress that they could.
I saw the pictures of him as Hitler.
I watched them shut down the government and hurt the entire nation twice.
I watched them turn their backs on every opportunity to open worthwhile dialog.
I watched them say that they would not even listen to any choice for Supreme Court no matter who the nominee was.
I listened as they openly said that they will oppose him at every turn.
I watched as they did just that.
I listened.
I watched.
I paid attention.
Now, I'm being called on to be tolerant.
To move forward.
To denounce protesters.
To "Get over it."
To accept this...
I will not.
I will do my part to make sure this great American mistake becomes the embarrassing footnote of our history that it deserves to be.
I will do this as quickly as possible every chance I get.
I will do my part to limit the damage that this man can do to my country.
I will watch his every move and point out every single mistake and misdeed in a loud and proud voice.
I will let you know in a loud voice every time this man backs away from a promise he made to them.
Them. The people who voted for him.
The ones who sold their souls and prayed for him to win.
I will do this so that they never forget.
And they will hear me.
They will see it in my eyes when I look at them.
They will hear it in my voice when I talk to them.
They will know that I know who they are.
They will know that I know what they are.
Do not call for my tolerance. I've tolerated all I can.
Now it's their turn to tolerate ridicule.
Be aware, make no mistake about it, every single thing that goes wrong in our country from this day forward is now Trump's fault just as much as they thought it was Obama's.
I find it unreasonable for them to expect from me what they were entirely unwilling to give."

-Author unknown.

Says it beautifully, so all you Trump people? Get ready to reap what you've sown. It's your turn.

a reply to: BuzzyWigs

Well, at least we finally have a definitive answer to your original question.

Where do we you go from here?

Backward.

See you on the other side when (if) you get there.

TheRedneck

originally posted by: TheRedneck
a reply to: BuzzyWigs

Well, at least we finally have a definitive answer to your original question.

Where do we you go from here?

Backward.

See you on the other side when (if) you get there.

TheRedneck

You said what?


Dude. This situation will set us all back FIFTY YEARS! It's astounding, and spectacularly outrageous, that you think this is progress. O M F G.

I am halfway out the door here. I'm sure that makes you happy. It makes me sad, because you all are so completely blind to what you've done, to what is possible now........

gah.

You and my Chinese neighbor would have a great time together!

I won't pray for you, though - so as to not upset you. No one wants a liberal thinking about them!, SHHEESH!!!! OKAY I GET IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

a reply to: BuzzyWigs

I will watch his every move and point out every single mistake and misdeed in a loud and proud voice. I will let you know in a loud voice every time this man backs away from a promise he made to them. Them. The people who voted for him.

I think people have done this with almost every president, including Obama. It didn't do anything to correct the problem.

I will do this so that they never forget. And they will hear me. They will see it in my eyes when I look at them. They will hear it in my voice when I talk to them. They will know that I know who they are. They will know that I know what they are. Do not call for my tolerance. I've tolerated all I can.

Trump is not God. He doesn't have a magic wand that he can wave and suddenly command Capitol Hill. If it was that simple then all the Presidents, including Obama, should have waved that wand a long time ago.

If you want to hold all the people that voted for Trump responsible for everything that goes wrong in America then your hate and disdain is directed in the wrong direction. Your hate and disdain should be with those that voted for the previous Presidents that allowed our country to get to the point that people were willing to vote for an idiot before they were willing to allow the criminal career politicians to continue destroying our country.

Making yourself a sworn enemy to other Americans that didn't make the same choice that you did, guarantees the fall of our country. If you believe that Trump will push our country over the edge, your decision to go Hatfields and McCoys, is helping him topple it, and you are racing him to the bottom.

I can see that you are angry and that you are taking this personally. I can see you are quite passionate about Hillary not being chosen as President Elect, but going to war with the American people that didn't vote for Hillary does not sound rational. If the house is on fire, you don't try to put it out with gasoline, unless your goal is to burn the house down to the ground. I don't think that is what you want.

I am not going to tell you to calm down. I am not going to tell you to get over it. I am not even going to ask you to be tolerant. It is clear you have made up your mind on what you want to do. I am just suggesting that maybe the non-Hillary voters are not your enemy, even if you wish to make them so.

a reply to: NightSkyeB4Dawn

If you want to hold all the people that voted for Trump responsible for everything that goes wrong in America then your hate and disdain is directed in the wrong direction.

Whoa whoa whoa there a tick.

I did NOT WRITE THAT LIST.

I plucked it off of FB - and printed it here to show you all how SOME PEOPLE FEEL NOW.

The thread is "NEXT STEPS". This is one of the "next steps" happening right now.
I didn't write it. Just keep that in mind.

This is their argument. And yes, Congress DID filibister EVERY SINGLE THING. You think Trump is immune to that? The Trump supporters on here have been blaming the "LIBTARDS" and "SHRILLERY" for the last EIGHT YEARS.

Bunch of ignorant sycophantic capitalist wankers.


LOL!!!!

a reply to: BuzzyWigs

How very, very, minutely, infinitesimally you know me.

It's OK. I will pray for you. Nothing terrible either... only that you will find inner peace.

Sounds like you need it.

TheRedneck

a reply to: TheRedneck

And while we're at it, I think it would be appropriate for you to address the "analysis" of how I see your mindset.

Mine has been attacked and picked to pieces....your turn.
Address the allegations I made.

Please. I'd be happy to c/p them in a numbered fashion if you'd like.
I honestly want you to answer each of those allegations of how I think you think. Like I said earlier, we are all suspicious, hurting, and distrustful. You all gloating and trying to "soothe" us is counterproductive.

You have been maligning liberals and progressives for months on end. Now we are going to hold you accountable for what happens because now it's on YOUR WATCH.

Think it's exciting and FUN?

Ohhhohhohhhh dude. Get ready for the ride of your life. We've watched how you all do it. No "wheel" to reinvent.
Payback's a bitch.

Is that what you want?
It's not what I want - just bringing to your attention what you are facing now.

a reply to: BuzzyWigs

This is their argument. And yes, Congress DID filibister EVERY SINGLE THING. You think Trump is immune to that? The Trump supporters on here have been blaming the "LIBTARDS" and "SHRILLERY" for the last EIGHT YEARS. Bunch of ignorant sycophantic capitalist wankers.

No. I don't think he is immune. In fact I think that he will likely have a difficult time doing much of anything on Capitol Hill, unless it plays into the hands of TPTB, much like all Presidents before him.

I think the blaming of the problems of our country on one group or another by one group or another, has gone on for much longer than the last 8 years. I see this has done nothing to make things better, and continuing to put the same people back in the same positions, has done little to make those changes we say we want.

I agree that we have to be a bunch of idiots, even insane, to keep doing the same thing over and over, expecting a different result. People have to stop thinking a President is going to save us. Only we can save us, but they are doing a wonderful job of making sure that will never happen.

I know no one wants to hear what I have to say. Right now is probably the wrong time because too may people have some pretty raw feelings at this time. But we only have 4 years to get our act together. We can't waste time bickering back and forth about which candidate is the devil and which is Satan. Either way we are all going to end up in a Hell we don't want if we don't start working together on the changes that we need. The first thing we need to do is to stop the internal fighting.

a reply to: TheRedneck

LOL!!!

It's OK. I will pray for you. Nothing terrible either... only that you will find inner peace.

So, that's a
"no" - you won't answer the questions...you won't address the allegations/imaginings that I have about you?

Look, pal - I haven't known you to be conversational very long. I feel like you're being condescending and posing with pseudo-outreach in a snide and rebukeful manner.
Answer the damn list of what I suggested I think you want.

"Pray for me?" No. Answer the questions.

lame.


Holy hell indeed.

a reply to: BuzzyWigs

Congress DID filibister EVERY SINGLE THING. You think Trump is immune to that?

Funny you mention that. Some Republicans HAVE BEEN pushing to get rid of the filibuster

So far, no Senate Republican has advocated for changing Senate rules for passing legislation since Trump pulled an upset in last week’s presidential election. But many House GOP lawmakers at a “Conversations with Conservatives” event moderated by the Heritage Foundation argued it gives Democrats unfair leverage.

Scott "High on Koch" Walker has come out for doing away with filibusters.

The next steps are to keep living our lives.

It's what everyone would have been doing if Hillary had been elected. Trump is no different.

Everyone can still be toxic and wail and moan and rend their shirts, but it really will have no impact on hat Trump chooses to do.