Pope Francis says Christians should apologise to gay people

a reply to: luthier

Or the American flag...

a reply to: burdman30ott6

If you say so. Thats fine.

However when the world writes religious legislation that focuses in gays say like this NC bill and all the prior death to sodomites their is a need to acknowledge that is wrong when done in the name of Christianity

Nothing in the NT recomends killing sodomites any more than killing hetero pre marital sex

The only real arguement the NT makes is regarding sex not being part of marriage and only for pleasure. Which they thought leedsto other issues. One being treating a person as a means to an end. In other words controlling lust.

a reply to: luthier

Fact is that there does not seem to be much hope on the horizon regarding humanity's power struggle.

Complete control seems inevitable given the current path we are heading along. Possibly worth remembering that absolute power corrupts absolutely through.

The people who seek such control should be careful because "they" might just get exactly what "they" wish for. And at the expense of the rest of humanity no less.

a reply to: andy06shake

And manipulating the belief system is very effective.

a reply to: luthier

"And manipulating the belief system is very effective."

Which was exactly my point, especially so when done so to suit an agenda, and a nefarious one at that.

a reply to: andy06shake

Yes. It can be anything though. Not just religion. Hell people are now using science to manipulate people faking studies and getting them published in respected journals. People read the journals expecting to have the truth and Dr's have used diagnosis and treatment of studies found to be falsified.

Which lead to the absolute importance of critical thinking.

a reply to: luthier

Not trying to suggest there are not a multitude of other type of control constructs at play other than religion. Just look at how our multi media networks influence our society by essentially telling people how to think. There is our modern day church right there. Critical thinking through far as i can tell, that would be something that most religions tend to frown upon and discourage, given that it can lead to one posing rather awkward questions.

a reply to: luthier

Not only that, look at how many teachers in educational facilities of all types use their positions as perceived authority figures to use and abuse their charges.

a reply to: andy06shake

My wife went to a Jesuit school.one of the best law schools in the country. She had a couple athiest professors in her under grad.

I would call myself a pandeist of sorts and we get along. Sure I here you though I don't want to say that doesn't exist. But the big bang and genetics among other things were developed by a Catholic priest and a Catholic monk.

a reply to: ketsuko

Very true.

If our primary school system taught a better well rounded liberal arts education and taught critical thinking it would be less a problem to be exposed to new ideas that could even be provocative

However even though you and I disagree on some things I think we can both say the age of idiocracy doesn't help

The High Sparrow has spoken

Did the Pope say he apologizes on behalf of Catholic history and the church?

Or just "suggest" Christians "should" apologize?

Big difference. A Papal Bull would be great, but even an actual apology would do.

And put great pressure on the Protestant Christian churches to either denounce and face that backlash

Or commend and face that backlash.

Silence would be little refuge either.

Jesuit genius in action. Both Popes are Jesuits for the first time ever.

a reply to: luthier

Our current understanding of the big bang theory posses more questions that it actually answers if you ask me(Possibly how science should be). And as to genetics or the manipulation of our own code, thats rather a large can of worms where religion is concerned.

I never suggested Catholic priests or Monks could not be clever people. Wonder what would have happened to those very same priests through if they had suggested such ideas only a few hundred years ago? I mean it did not work out to well for Spinoza or to a lesser degree people such as Copernicas or Galileo Galilei, lets just say the word heresy would be getting chucked around.

a reply to: andy06shake

Spinoza lived exactly how he wanted to a hermit. He is my man though. Love his work. Empericicsm brought forth deism. You have to also consider psychological evolution.

How did Nietzsche view homosexuality? Or Marx?

Then you have guys like this.
www.cbssports.com...

Vs the church in San Francisco saying the Orlando shooter did the world a favor.

It's all a confusing mess. I need a flow chart on who hates who and why and who doesn't give a crap

The only thing left now, if for the Pope to apologize to the Devil, for all the bad things that are said about him in the scriptures, and way Christians have mistreated SATAN and his followers over the ages.

As SATAN says, GOD made me this way. I can't help it. Its who I am. Accept me for who I am. Respect my individual right to exercise my freedom to act according to my will.

If gays think that had it bad, when there are a mere two or three verses that refers to gays, what do you think the poor mistreated Devil must feel, when the whole book rejects him?

From the very beginning, when the Devil informed Eve that she would not die, if she ate the fruit, the Devil has been downtrodden, and trampled under foot. It's time to end the persecution of all, even the Devil.

The Pope should show humility and compassion on the Devil, by washing his feet, and the feet of his followers.

When he does this, he will have proven definitively that Christianity is truly accepting of all.

a reply to: AMPTAH

I could be wrong but I think he is apologising that people have been putting sodomites to death and discriminating against them under the name of Christianity

Which is against the basic tennants of Christianity.

a reply to: luthier

Think there is some speculation as to Nietzsche possibly having have enjoyed several weeks of homoerotic action in Sicily. LoL

As to Carl Marx i cant seem to remember him discussing sexuality much. I have not read everything the Man ever said all the same but were Gay men not denied membership or expelled from the communist parties of the time?

Definitely a confusing mess, cant fault that statement.

a reply to: andy06shake

Marx didn't write much about it. He has a few passing comments about it being un natural bit his correspondence with Engels shows his opinions on the subject. Nietzsche did write about it so if that legend is true than he is a bit of a Ted Haggard.

Enjoyed the dialogue. I appreciate any conversation that may be heated and can be worked out amicably. I think if people can recognise points (if there are any) it helps elevate the discussion.

a reply to: luthier

Also enjoyed the dialogue and appreciate the conversation. Good evening to you.

originally posted by: TrueBrit
a reply to: cuckooold

Well, perhaps it would have been wiser for him to say that those who have been actively and vocally discriminatory toward persons of a homosexual, lesbian, bi sexual or transgender leaning, should apologise.

Those of us who do not discriminate have nothing to apologise for, and have been instrumental in upholding people from all manner of communities, without his edict or approval for years!

Bingo.

2nd