Whatever they are, they are not normal cloud formations

a reply to: waynos

Here is another example of you filling in the blanks with guesswork. Going in circles must mean experimental spraying of contrails on purpose to you. Airliners in the hold,tankers flying a racetrack patter and AWACS and other ISTAR aircraft flying their operational route have no place in your theory.

If this was the case, why not see them more often then? If it`s just their operational route?

a reply to: Op3nM1nd3d

Oh I understand you just fine. Like I said it's all assumption, no fact. Indeed, you are ignoring the factual explanations o give your guesswork room to breathe. This does not make you clever.

As for other comment, lol indeed. I simply said that tracking and identifying the flights you can see is far easier than what you were proposing. While you are searching the web for all the airports and doing the maths (your proposal, remember) I simply track and identify the aircraft in a second. May YOU need to learn to use available resources better?

a reply to: Op3nM1nd3d

Oh I understand you just fine. Like I said it's all assumption, no fact. Indeed, you are ignoring the factual explanations o give your guesswork room to breathe. This does not make you clever.

As for other comment, lol indeed. I simply said that tracking and identifying the flights you can see is far easier than what you were proposing. While you are searching the web for all the airports and doing the maths (your proposal, remember) I simply track and identify the aircraft in a second. May YOU need to learn to use available resources better?

That aircraft one can see flying overhead could come from any one of dozens of airports. It may also be the only one from any given airport on that day, but you would trawl through all the data for it. Your idea is over complicated and unnecessary, which kind of fits your theory too

a reply to: Phage

The thing is, the formation of contrails depends on the weather.

Yes it does, but just in case if you missed it...

First, persistent contrails are line-shaped clouds that would not have formed in the atmosphere without the passage of an aircraft.

So yes it depends on the weather but would not have formed without the passage of the aircraft. Is it so hard to understand that?

Or...as someone once told me that when you almost get to the honey while picking the nest, they all come out to attack you. Am I close?

a reply to: Op3nM1nd3d

So yes it depends on the weather but would not have formed without the passage of the aircraft. Is it so hard to understand that?

No. I understand it quite well. With no airplanes there would be no contrails. The existence of contrails is a consequence of high altitude flight.

Or...as someone once told me that when you almost get to the honey while picking the nest, they all come out to attack you. Am I close?

No. That's a sort of egocentric point of view and a very strong demonstration of confirmation bias to boot.

a reply to: waynos

As for other comment, lol indeed. I simply said that tracking and identifying the flights you can see is far easier than what you were proposing. While you are searching the web for all the airports and doing the maths (your proposal, remember) I simply track and identify the aircraft in a second. May YOU need to learn to use available resources better?

lol, remember that not all flights can be tracked on your app?

Hey, whatever, you win...I lose, satisfied? I hope that makes you feel better now

originally posted by: Op3nM1nd3d
a reply to: waynos

Here is another example of you filling in the blanks with guesswork. Going in circles must mean experimental spraying of contrails on purpose to you. Airliners in the hold,tankers flying a racetrack patter and AWACS and other ISTAR aircraft flying their operational route have no place in your theory.

If this was the case, why not see them more often then? If it`s just their operational route?

It happens every day. You see them when the leave contrails. When they don't, you don't notice them. Once again, it's the weather that is the variable.

a reply to: Op3nM1nd3d.if you mean FR24 or Planefinder, then you are right.

Win? Feel better? Sorry, what are you talking about?

a reply to: Phage

No. I understand it quite well. With no airplanes there would be no contrails. The existence of contrails is a consequence of high altitude flight.

No, with no planes there would be no contrails that would make clouds in right circumstances. You are avoiding the point and you know it!

No. That's a sort of egocentric point of view and a very strong demonstration of confirmation bias to boot.

I can say the same about you as you clearly trying to convince me otherwise.

a reply to: Op3nM1nd3d

The trouble with that is that's it's impossible to say that clouds wouldn't have formed naturally anyway. If the atmospheric conditions are right to support cloud formation, they may or may not have done. One can only say that the contrail started the process, but given what we know about weather, there is a very good chance it would have clouded over by itself. One cannot make clouds exist in warm dry air.

a reply to: Op3nM1nd3d

No, with no planes there would be no contrails that would make clouds in right circumstances.

With no planes there would be no contrails. Contrails only come from airplanes. Actually that's not true, boats also produce contrails, of a sort.
www.livescience.com...

You are avoiding the point and you know it!

What point? That contrails are created intentionally? I've addressed that. I asked you how you know that is happening.

I can say the same about you as you clearly trying to convince me otherwise.

What?

a reply to: waynos

The trouble with that is that's it's impossible to say that clouds wouldn't have formed naturally anyway. If the atmospheric conditions are right to support cloud formation, they may or may not have done. One can only say that the contrail started the process, but given what we know about weather, there is a very good chance it would have clouded over by itself. One cannot make clouds exist in warm dry air.

True, that`s why a further research is needed or should I say was needed.

a reply to: Phage

With no planes there would be no contrails. Contrails only come from airplanes. Actually that's not true, boats also produce contrails, of a sort.

As far as I know, we are talking about airplanes, did I miss something?

What point? That contrails are created intentionally? I've addressed that. I asked you how you know that is happening.

The point where the planes create contrails that create clouds in right circumstances. And yes they are created intentionally...not all the time though, only for experiments. Regular traffic are just implemented results of those experiments.

What?

Nevermind...we wouldn`t be able to come to common ground

a reply to: Op3nM1nd3d

As far as I know, we are talking about airplanes, did I miss something?

No. I added something, that not only planes produce contrails. But, as I said, without planes, there would be no airplane produced contrails. No matter what the weather conditions are.

Regular traffic are just implemented results of those experiments.

No. Regular traffic is the result of commerce, mostly. You know, people and stuff going from here to there. Efficiently.

a reply to: Op3nM1nd3d


And yes they are created intentionally...not all the time though, only for experiments. Regular traffic are just implemented results of those experiments.

What is it about contrails that you are hung up on them being created deliberately. Why do you think this?

originally posted by: INEVERQUIT
I am not a meteorologist or a person that studies different cloud formations.

However those who are meteorologists and study cloud formations are quite certain what they are. They have been studying them for decades.

For example

Its up to you whether or not you beleive them though ...

originally posted by: Op3nM1nd3d
a reply to: payt69

Hey, can you please paste to me where I said chemtrails? Youtube clip was just a reference to my proposed assumption to what might be happening. Contrails, chemtrails...matters not. What`s behind this phenomena is what we should be looking at.

Well you may have noticed that contrails are usually preceded by commercial airliners flying from A to B. If you know anything about how a jet interacts with the conditions found at cruise altitude, you should expect contrails to happen. So that's what's happening: passengengers and cargo being fown from A to B.

So can you explain to me if they all know the physics and we all know physics behind contrails, then why is that they are doing it on purpose? You know, unscheduled private planes (plural) planting intentional trails above the specific area in specific conditions? I mean, what`s the point of it? You seriously don`t believe the geoengineering theory, do you?

You're begging the question. Provide evidence that unscheduled private planes are planting anything on purpose, and maybe we can look into that. As for now, any plane, private or not, flying in those condtions will create contrails.

Geoengineering is being proposed as a last resort remedy to global warming. But that's all it is for now: a proposal. There are too many unknown variables to start any action though, so it's not happening.

Oh and I really hope you can discern chemtrails as a word and chemtrails as a name given to the phenomena because there is a difference to it. Usually the ones, who know it all, bring up the poisonous gas assocation which is just a poor attempt at diverting the subject into coo-coo direction, right?

I don't have to do anything to move it into coocoo direction, chemmies do an excellent job of that themselves. As for the distinction between the word and the name, well that may be all clear in YOUR mind, but you're going to have to explain that further too.

As for your inquiry, please read this. Note that this sheet is from 1999 so many things have advanced since then. After you`ve done that and have learned of the basics and the official part of the story, you might want to read further. Note that some of these are so called fringe scientists but here it is all about the idea and the possibility of its exploitation.

Ok so you're posting a link to an exteemely silly chemtrail website, and you hope to accomplish what exactly? There's no science on that page at all. All the footnotes refer to other chemmie material. A lot seems to be based on the 'owning the weather in 2025' material from 1996, which in the very beginning states:

'This report contains fictional representations of future situations/scenarios. Any similarities to real people or events, other than those specifically cited, are unintentional and are for purposes of illustration only'.

I love this sentence from the chemmie site, as it illustrates what passes as 'evidence' in the chemtrail echo chamber:

'Chemtrail activists collect evidence that the chemtrail spray contains not only germs(7) but conductive metals, blood cells,(8) carbon powders, sedatives, nano-particulates, crystalline substances, alumina particulates, barium powders, and a kind of polyethylene-silicon fiber.'

Ok so it's not scientists who collect this evidence, but activists, and then they go on to make a bunch of claims without substantiating anything.

By the way, this is kindof old hat now. Most believers are now on the geoengineering train, which is pulled by Dane Wigington and (apparently mentally troubled, see other thread) Michael J Murphy. Get with the program man!

Which brings me to the point where I say, again..., that I`m not saying this is happening but if there is a possibility of this happening, I have to assume the worst due to mankind`s lust for power and control as well as past unsuccessful or successful attemps of such wickedness...

I hope this clears it for you

Well you know mice may seem like cute and cuddly creatures, but they're actually spies for the illuminati, who work for lizard aliens from Zargon. See these aliens are planning on an invasion of planet earth, and in preparation they've employed mice to observe our behaviour, so the aliens can determine what our weak points are, and how we can be best manipulated into zombie slaves.

That should be the kind of scenario you'd have to believe if you assume the worst about anything. You never mentioned anything about the likelyhood of any given scenario. That's no part of your calculation apparently. It just needs to be really bad, and that's all it needs to be plausible for you.

Well that's called paranoia. But if that's your thing, have at it

a reply to: payt69

Hehe, you are a funny character but unfortunately I`m not getting involved into a keyboard battle For more information please read my other posts and perhaps things will come clear. It`s also funny how you skipped the first link I gave you and ONLY brought attention to the FRINGE article.

Well you know mice may seem like cute and cuddly creatures, but they're actually spies for the illuminati, who work for lizard aliens from Zargon. See these aliens are planning on an invasion of planet earth, and in preparation they've employed mice to observe our behaviour, so the aliens can determine what our weak points are, and how we can be best manipulated into zombie slaves.

Could be but I have seen no evidence that this is the case while MK ultra mind program has been already exposed a while ago. It is a distinct difference between the two unless you are unable to grasp the idea of it. But that`s your problem, not mine.

Have a nice day, Sir or Ma'am

a reply to: waynos

What is it about contrails that you are hung up on them being created deliberately. Why do you think this?

Because science knows no boundries. Wouldn`t you want to explore the possibility of manipulating weather? Even if it is just a remote attempt.

originally posted by: Op3nM1nd3d
a reply to: payt69

Hehe, you are a funny character but unfortunately I`m not getting involved into a keyboard battle

For more information please read my other posts and perhaps things will come clear. It`s also funny how you skipped the first link I gave you and ONLY brought attention to the FRINGE article.

Well I wonder what you're trying to accomplish by posting those links. They're like night and day. Do you give any credence to the fringe one? How about the FAA one?

Well you know mice may seem like cute and cuddly creatures, but they're actually spies for the illuminati, who work for lizard aliens from Zargon. See these aliens are planning on an invasion of planet earth, and in preparation they've employed mice to observe our behaviour, so the aliens can determine what our weak points are, and how we can be best manipulated into zombie slaves.

Could be but I have seen no evidence that this is the case while MK ultra mind program has been already exposed a while ago. It is a distinct difference between the two unless you are unable to grasp the idea of it. But that`s your problem, not mine.

Have a nice day, Sir or Ma'am

MK ultra has as much to do with mice as it has with chemtrails. If you can use MKUltra to substantiate chemtrails, then I can use it to substantiate my mice theory.

I don't see how MKUltra provides any basis to believe in chemtrails.. but maybe those are the wonderful intricacies that come with the chemtrail territory