Doesn't the Vatican prove the Pope and catholics are not true Christians?

The issue is not only the money. We are before groundbreaking events predicted in Fatima and Malachi. Vatican knows what is coming. We don't know, although speculations abound. When the world finally knows, the events will be upon us.
Will they be just shaking of faith, or cataclysmic planetary, or both? Frankly, I want they happen sooner. The current dead end status quo won't increase faith, won't make more people to be saved. Just the opposite. Let God acts in this world, sooner, even tomorrow! It is our only hope we get out of the mess that started far not only in 20th century with one or few leaders. I am not going to do any longer review, you may check my other threads. God bless!

a reply to: crazyewok

I doubt that Jesus would approve of anything these overly dressed God wannabes are doing. Can you even imagine how many poor families the cost of just one of their getups could feed? Christian? Sorry, no. But I agree there are many who are Christian and work to that end.

a reply to: schuyler

For example, St. Peter, s dome overlooks an obelisk

And that obelisk is from Heliopolis in Egypt.
The obelisk is the phallic symbol of Osiris and the Dome represents the womb of Isis.

There is so much pagan worship going on at the Vatican that I think that alone proves Catholicism is not based on the teachings of Jesus .
Let alone, as BH posted earlier, their doctrine goes directly against what Jesus preached.

The wealth of the Vatican is one of the smaller issues I have with them.

a reply to: stosh64

Dont even get me started on the Vaticans blatant idolatry........

a reply to: crazyewok
Have you ever followed the trail of Christianity since the beginning ?
Didn't it start with the Roman emperor Constantine, it then flourished in the Roman empire until the fall of Constantinople in 1453, it was called the Orthodox church and the main place where it survives is in Russia.

Matthew 7:15-20

“Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ravenous wolves. You will know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes from thornbushes or figs from thistles? Even so, every good tree bears good fruit, but a bad tree bears bad fruit. A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, nor can a bad tree bear good fruit. Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. Therefore by their fruits you will know them."

That should tell you all you need to know about the Vatican.

Are they christians? They put themselves before others, deny scientific facts in favor of unproven dogma, and treat minorities with indifference. Yeah, they're "christian."

Same scam, different denomination.

a reply to: crazyewok

Imagine there is this organization that members donate money towards. Some donate large amounts but most only donate small and sustainable amounts. Now the thing is, there a billion of these donors. So if there is even a tiny bit of integrity in financial management of the organization, then it would obviously be wealthy.

So the organization would likely look for ways to contribute to society, for example: doing work for social justice, and support for the poor, and so on. Nonetheless, the contributions would still keep coming in.

Multiply that by 2,000 years.

a reply to: crazyewok

The Catholic Church is the product of many pagan religions, Judaism the teachings of Christ and human bureaucracy. Incense are an abomination to the Lord (according to the Bible) as is eating ham, any sea food other than fish, women wearing pants, doing any kind of business ( or arguably any work in general) on a Sunday. Anyway by definition no Catholicism is not strictly Christian, but then Christ was not against Slavery and also didn't contradict the Old testament (wich is like a horror story in so many ways) and in my opinion that in it self is reason to not want any part of the belief system -for me personally any way. I do appreciate and indeed do live by some of Christ's teachings but I'm also a Buhddist and a Taoist in many ways. Christ specifically taught against wealth and even said (according to the Bible) "it is easier to pass a camel through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom" so Catholicism with it's grand Cathedrals and wealth and power and rituals according to the Bible is an affront to God.

originally posted by: FaunaOrFlora
a reply to: crazyewok

So the only "true Christian" is the bum on the corner?

I suggest giving away all your possessions lest you be considered a "non-true Christian".

You better look that one up Bro. You have taken it out of context. You need to revisit that conversation

a reply to: crazyewok

My gripe with the socialist Globalist enforcer Pope is that he is playing the migrant crisis like a violin.
He is a mass hypocrit that tells Europe to let in millions and be charitable but sits behind 60 foot walls preaching to the choir with vaults full of plundered Gold and treasures worth billions.

He recently had a bunch of Syrian refugees brought to Italy and out of that bunch 2 were Christian which the Pope then rejected before they got to Italy and demanded 2 Moslems instead making every refugee of this bunch Moslem so he has nothing to do with charity but more to do with sensationalism.

The man is a piece of filth in my view,something is seriously wrong in the Catholic Church when a sleazy scumbag like this rules the roost.
People need to look at who they idolize and just like Political leaders the Pope is an inversion of what he is supposed to be.

You cant go to heaven unless the Pope forgives your sins




























Just kiddin

a reply to: crazyewok

Yes, and no.

I do think there is an obscene amount of wealth on display at the Vatican. However, consider that the massive amount of good that Catholic charities, hospitals, schools, and other such institutions have done and continue to do all around the world. In order to have built and to maintain and to expand that network requires being able to accrue, manage and move massive amounts of wealth from place to place.

Jesus did have wealth and resources to call upon. Some of his disciples were not poor men. Judas, in fact, was the one who managed the money for the group.

And it is a popular misconception that the only true Christian is dirt poor. Rather, the true Christian gives freely and generously. Consider the tale of Zacchaeus who was a tax collector and very wealthy.

19 Jesus entered Jericho and was passing through. 2 A man was there by the name of Zacchaeus; he was a chief tax collector and was wealthy. 3 He wanted to see who Jesus was, but because he was short he could not see over the crowd. 4 So he ran ahead and climbed a sycamore-fig tree to see him, since Jesus was coming that way.

5 When Jesus reached the spot, he looked up and said to him, “Zacchaeus, come down immediately. I must stay at your house today.” 6 So he came down at once and welcomed him gladly.

7 All the people saw this and began to mutter, “He has gone to be the guest of a sinner.”

8 But Zacchaeus stood up and said to the Lord, “Look, Lord! Here and now I give half of my possessions to the poor, and if I have cheated anybody out of anything, I will pay back four times the amount.”

9 Jesus said to him, “Today salvation has come to this house, because this man, too, is a son of Abraham. 10 For the Son of Man came to seek and to save the lost.”

Luke 19: 1-10

How is it that a wealthy man could be saved after only giving up half of his wealth and swearing to pay back 4x to those he cheated? The answer is that it is not your worldly status but your inner status that matters. Zacchaeus gave freely and generously as did those men of Christ's disciples who had wealth. They did not place the money before God and their faith.

originally posted by: FaunaOrFlora
a reply to: crazyewok

So the only "true Christian" is the bum on the corner?

I suggest giving away all your possessions lest you be considered a "non-true Christian".

Although you are being sarcastic, the answer is yes. If you know how to converse with them (i.e. root out the anti-Christ spirits working through them) you can get grand truths from them, even to the point of mind-boggling prophecy. They are essentially living in the spirit world, and their bodies are acting as a mere shadow of their higher existence. Give to the poor.

This entire world that we call reality is a shadow of true existence, yet we are too chauvinistic to realize our egotistical lowliness.

originally posted by: peter vlar
He refused to live in the palace and instead chose to make a guest house his quarters. He has attacked the blatant materialism of the Church including removing Bishops who were living extravagantly and wasting money on costly renovations that were unnecessary.

He appointed someone well known for covering up child molester priests, and moving them into a new area, with authority over all economic activities of the Holy See and the Vatican City State.

a reply to: cooperton

Sorry, I don't quite buy that.

Not all homeless people are the equivalent of spirtual hermits.

They are simply people who for one reason or another have conditions that prevent them from carrying on in regular society. I'm sure a few have spiritual issues, but then you have your addicts and the mentally ill and others like them.

a reply to: crazyewok

The Vatican has massive wealth and massive buildings.

This reminds of the Bible story, 2 Samuel 7, when King David was walking around his beautiful cedar palace enjoying his wealth and peace, and decided since God only lived in a tent, that he would build a nice house for God! So, David told his prophet to tell God the good news about his new house, that he was going to built for God.

God came back in his best Yiddish accent and said "YOU are going to build a house for ME? LOL I don't think so!

originally posted by: ketsuko
a reply to: cooperton

Sorry, I don't quite buy that.

Not all homeless people are the equivalent of spirtual hermits.

They are simply people who for one reason or another have conditions that prevent them from carrying on in regular society. I'm sure a few have spiritual issues, but then you have your addicts and the mentally ill and others like them.

True, true. I was being too general. But I have had more meaningful revelations talking to homeless (or near homeless) people than I have with most pastors. Their lack of material anchors/restraints allows them an easier sense of Spirit.

originally posted by: grey580
a reply to: crazyewok

Would jesus really have approved of the Vatican?

Considering that he told peter to found his church... I'm going to assume yes.

Would he approve of what it has become? I won't assume.

Spoken like a true Catholic or ex Catholic

Do you sincerely believe that Jesus wanted a church founded on Peter a mere disciple or don't you think Jesus wanted the church founded on Jesus Himself

It's only logical to understand the meaning, that the church had already been founded, before Peter founded the Roman section of the church that tried desperately hard to engulf everyone else, if you read the text instead of letting someone else tell you what to think of the text

I think you just need to use a little common sense here. The Catholic Church the largest charity in the world. So why not sell every thing at the Vatican and give it to charity? The same reason Disney does not sell all its assets for profit. Because by keeping them they make much more money long term. Not their is a real market for Cathedrals and such anyway. It would be stupid to sell everything and end the Catholic church as a charitable organization. And frankly unless you have sold all your possessions for charity then you are in the same boat.