Stupid liberals.

a reply to: deadlyhope


are you referring to rapists feeling "protected" in entering a women's room to rape? what's stopping them now? please just answer that.

a reply to: deadlyhope

Think more fat hairy gross man that identifies as a straight male and less an androgenic person with an inner conflict. I am okay with the second choosing,

You really think trans-people just choose any day to be a different sex and gender?(rhetorical)...I get that you're attempting to placate the conservative perspective,however it's based on such unfounded fear and irrational reasoning.
There is no data that I know of that exists that implies that trans-people are at higher risk for committing rape in a public bathroom. Although they are at higher risk for suicide, I wonder why that might be....? Hmm...

Sexual predators are hyper sexual monsters, and being able to choose any restroom at any time will help them gain access to, essentially, a new parking lot, or alley or whatever other areas are known for such crimes.

So now trans-people are equatable to sexual predators...The most common places for anyone to get raped are actually inside their own homes. Something like 50-60% of rapes. I think you should be more afraid of going into your own bathroom the next time you take a dump. Learn something about rape

I still think bathrooms are just fine how they've always been. Nothing needs to change.

Then what's your problem exactly...?
You don't seem to have an issue with coed or unisex bathrooms but the moment trans-gendered people get thrown in the mix,it's a problem. Laws are already in place to penalize child molesters and rapists..

a reply to: Sremmos80

We know these creeps are opportunistic - it's the fact that they couldn't be questioned. No.. Hey, big beard man, why are you going towards the woman's restroom?

He could then wait in a stall until he was alone, if he wasn't to begin with.

I don't have the mind of a criminal though, I'm not bound to be able to come up with all the ideas a predator would.

If anyone is in fact a criminal our a profiler, chime in, please.

If you're not....your opinion on what they would or wouldn't do is just speculation and assumption - myself included.

a reply to: NateTheAnimator

Are you really this dense?

So, there's going to be a lie detector by every bathroom? Make sure every big hairy man honestly feels like a girl, otherwise it wont let him in?

I'm talking about all predators. Most are likely cis gender but I don't actually know the statistics.

I'm talking about opportunistic perverts looking to hurt people in a way that might be one day legally easier for them.

What the hell piece of legislation is going to require a person to be honest? What type of security measures are you implying, if it's to check which restroom someone used the day before?

I'm taking about Liars and predators, not trans people. Get with the topic.

a reply to: deadlyhope


and, still you can't answer - what's stopping them from doing that now???? it's probably been done before, it's illegal now and it was illegal than.

or, do you think a rapist is like - oh I can't rape her in there, i'm not allowed in the women's room.

a reply to: knoxie

It would make it easier, is what I'm saying.

So you're saying right now, a big hairy man wouldn't be questioned while on his way into the woman's restroom?

I'm implying with the wrong legislation, he could go in regardless of the people around, wait in a stall until just him and one other remain.

Currently, such a man would be questioned, rejected to use that room, etc...

This is simply an example. I'm not bound to be nearly as creative as men actually seeking to commit these crimes.

Another person on this thread mentioned more of these acts happen in empty car garages, in the privacy of the predators home and is committed against people they know. The predator is legally in those places - no one asks them why they're going to a car garage, or why they're in their own home.

It's not as if they aren't ever seen entering their own house, or never seen walking towards a car garage. Those are places they would be in any case.

For a man, a woman's restroom is not, under current or previous law, a place he was meant to be. Being seen walking towards that way, being seen by even one other person within the room itself would raise suspicion at the very least.

a reply to: deadlyhope

You never answered my question about why we don't make it harder for men to rape a woman in a parking garage by making it illegal for them to be there in the first place. Make it illegal for men to be in a parking garage - BOOM, eliminate all rapes in parking garages. Great idea, yes?

a reply to: kaylaluv

Can any people respond with logic?

I'm not going to entertain your example.

Bathrooms could be assigned as xy, xx chromosomes for the 99 percent of us that aren't Trans, and the 99.999 percent of us that aren't born with the wrong genitalia.

Speak logically, please. If 99 percent of all cars in all garages belonged to women, I'd have to come up with a better response. As of now, statistics are very much against you.

A president that is liberal for those reasons and other personal freedoms but is conservative on spending and war sounds good to me, oh we have that his name is Donald Trump. Who gets nothing but grief for saying that a trans can use whatever bathroom they like in Trump tower. Its true too, Kaitlin Jenner actually did it.

a reply to: deadlyhope

So you don't care about eliminating rapes in parking garages, I see. But you are sooo concerned with eliminating rapes in the women's room. Hmmmm. Are you concerned at all about eliminating rapes in the men's room?

a reply to: kaylaluv

Again, you are making terrible examples, and using many logical fallacies in your argument.

If you are a true champion of the cause, explain it. I used to be extremely conservative and bigoted but through conversation, studying, and such, am now a liberal.

Still not agreeing on this topic, though, and you not even staying on topic is not helping.

Location: bathroom.

No where else.

Issue : cis gender predators being given free access to any restroom they want as they pretend they are trans and it's illegal to deny them that use.

Nothing else.

I'm not suggesting how we eliminate rapes. That's an entirely different topic.

I'm suggesting that we not create new rapes, where possible.

it's not making it easier, that's baloney. there are gazillion restrooms now that can be entered without anyone seeing and rapist have had access to these all along.

you do know that conservatives are the ones who came up with these laws, right?

a reply to: deadlyhope

Are you really this dense? So, there's going to be a lie detector by every bathroom? Make sure every big hairy man honestly feels like a girl, otherwise it wont let him in?

I'm not suggesting anything...

I'm talking about opportunistic perverts looking to hurt people in a way that might be one day legally easier for them.

Laws against rape and molestation already exists in most if not all nation-states,what more do you want...?

What the hell piece of legislation is going to require a person to be honest? What type of security measures are you implying, if it's to check which restroom someone used the day before?

Again I never suggested nor implied a solution to anything...

I'm taking about Liars and predators, not trans people. Get with the topic.

You are talking about trans-gendered people though..
You're making the claim that if trans-gendered people are legally protected to use the bathrooms that they self-identify as,that this will open the door to sexual predators and child molesters who claim to be trans-gendered to use the bathrooms as a place to commit rape. I provided data that invalidates your sentiment entirely,You're more likely to be raped in your own home than in a public restroom. And you yourself even admitted you're more likely to be raped by someone of cis-gender.

So...Again what exactly is your problem here...?

a reply to: knoxie

abcnews.go.com...

That's more what I'm talking about.

Also, never said conservatives were in the right to create legislation either.

I've said multiple times I'm against any new legislation.

a reply to: NateTheAnimator


I admitted rape may be more often by cis gender.

Okay, then I'm asking, what is your way to ensure a Cis gender doesn't use the opposite facility? What is your security measure to make sure a straight cis gender man doesn't use the women's restroom?

If you have no measures, how is that not making it easier for people previously denied access, suspected, etc, access to an area they couldn't so easily get into before?

Rape and sexual assault still happen regardless of the law.

Tell me, please, how it would not be easier for a predator to wait around in a woman's restroom. Under liberal ideology, a big hairy man could sing "I'm a lady" all the way into the girls bathroom, even while traffic is normal or higher, sit in a stall for an hour, wait to be with one other and come out.

Just an example, and maybe a bad one, but tell me why that example wouldn't and couldn't happen, if everyone was given access to their "identity" restroom? ( with no way to know if they are lying or telling the truth.)

The reason it couldn't happen now is because a beard in a woman's bathroom would cause issues, maybe even a police or calling a guard or someone that could help get a nasty big man out of there. To make such calls discrimination and make such men protected..

rapist have had access to women's room all along. and, like I said above there are many that could be entered without anyone ever seeing them.

but, you think now with these new laws, they're gonna go into them all buffed up and obvious and feel protected, do you REALLY think that's gonna be a huge problem now, suddenly?

a reply to: knoxie

It opens doors that didn't previously exist.

Right now they can sneak into that bathroom when no one is around or watching or anything. Even two ladies in the bathroom might currently stop such a predator, even one person in the general area might.

New legislation may make predators feel comfortable going into the bathroom at any time.

It may be rare.. But so is being Trans. Which group should be given more thought? The fraction of a percent that actually care about this bathroom issue, or the few percent that are actively seeking ways to get their fix?

a reply to: deadlyhope

There is no logical fallacy in my statements. It is a FACT that keeping men out of parking garages will virtually eliminate women being raped by men there. You cannot deny that.

BUT, the reason we don't ban men from parking garages is that the vast majority of them are not going to rape women there. So, the reason we shouldn't ban transgenders from using the restroom of their affirmed gender is because the vast majority of men aren't going to all of a sudden start going into the women's room to rape women.

We have had laws in states that don't allow discrimination in public restrooms when it comes to transgender people. Some of those anti-discrimination laws have been in effect for many years. Increase in sexual assaults in restrooms? Nope.

Several states and major cities have supported transgender people’s bathroom access for years. There are more than a dozen states and several cities that have non-discrimination laws that protect gender identity in public accommodations, which is a legalistic way of saying transgender people can use whatever bathrooms they want in public.

Fears about male predators have not been borne out in those places. New York City has banned discrimination based on gender identity for more than a decade. California has affirmed the rights of K-12 students to use the bathrooms and locker rooms that align with their gender identity for years. Advocates say that while there are some past examples of heterosexual men dressing up like women to gain access to women’s spaces, there’s no record of that behavior increasing when there’s an LGBT non-discrimination law on the books. “We have so many places that do prohibit discrimination where this has never come up,” says the Equality Federation’s Rebecca Isaacs. “This is a red herring.”

Police and school officials say they haven’t seen it either. Media Matters, a liberal media watchdog, has asked state leaders, law enforcement and school officials in places with these protections whether they’ve seen any increase in sexual assault or rape after passing these laws, and they have repeatedly said that they have not. “We have not seen that,” a Des Moines police department spokesman told the outlet in 2014. “I doubt that’s gonna encourage the behavior. If the behavior’s there, [sexual predators are] gonna behave as they’re gonna behave no matter what the laws are.”

And here are the real victims in all this:

In a study from UCLA’s Williams Institute, nearly 70% of transgender people said they had experienced verbal harassment in a situation involving gender-segregated bathrooms, while nearly 10% reported physical assault.

time.com...

a reply to: deadlyhope

Okay, then I'm asking, what is your way to ensure a Cis gender doesn't use the opposite facility? What is your security measure to make sure a straight cis gender man doesn't use the women's restroom?

Implement more public unisex or coed bathrooms...So we don't have to police the bathroom door entrances to check everyone's sex. Give everyone a giant stall if they'll feel more comfortable that way doing their business. Other than that I'm fine with the way things are in regards to how people and/or who specifically uses the bathroom as it is such a non-issue.

If you have no measures, how is that not making it easier for people previously denied access, suspected, etc, access to an area they couldn't so easily get into before?

Earlier you said you were not in favor of any new legislation to regulate trans-gendered people's access to public bathrooms and now here you're stating with out such measures it would make it easier for sexual predators.
Which one is it dude..

Tell me, please, how it would not be easier for a predator to wait around in a woman's restroom. Under liberal ideology, a big hairy man could sing "I'm a lady" all the way into the girls bathroom, even while traffic is normal or higher, sit in a stall for an hour, wait to be with one other and come out.

Because statistically it would be unlikely. Rape statistics More rape statistics
White cis gendered males are predominantly the sex-offenders in rape cases,should we profile them more before they head into any bathroom...?

You SEEM to be of the ilk with the most implausible idealism of preventing rape. Rape or sexual assault cannot be prevented 100% of the time. Even if a legislation were to be implemented to regulate who can or can't enter a bathroom,it doesn't stop anyone from sexually assaulting. All that can be done is to reduce the amount of sexual assault and rape incidents. Laws and policies are already in place to insure that, after that it is at the discretion of the individuals using the public restrooms. Since there has been very little and next to almost no reports of trans-gendered people or people whom claim to be trans-gendered sexually assaulting their victim in a public restroom,your slippery slope is baseless.
I would give you some credit if there actually was some data supporting what you're saying but there isn't.

a reply to: kaylaluv

Thank you, some real evidence so long as the material presented is truthful, which I have no reason to assume it's not.

Applying it to the whole nation might cause different situations than in a few examples, but I cannot say this with assurance- simply based on my opinion of the matter, which your example alone is some good evidence to make me believe my assertions are not universally correct.

I disagree with one statement in that post. Sexual predators don't often act out in really open places, in places where they can easily be caught. In the privacy of their own homes is one of the most common, and it could be argued that access to their home is the easiest, obviously, and least surveilled. Bathrooms cannot legally be surveilled. Parking garages are very private at times, easy access.

Is there really enough evidence to say that giving access to everyone, to any restroom, is not a form of a private area that would become easier access than previously?

Or is it to say, if a predator suspects a woman is alone in a restroom, the law would not stop him from following her, even currently? Would he be deterred if others were in the general area - currently? Would he be deterred from following her if others were in the general area if LGBT laws were passed?