TTip leak. Greenpeace releases documents on Monday.

Süddeutsche Zeitung (english translation)

But the export of agricultural products is not the main focus of the U.S.. Washington has also set its sights on controversial genetically modified foods that are mostly prohibited within the Europe Union. Both sides have often stressed up until now that the U.S. will respect European concerns in this matter, and that Europe’s citizens do not have to be worried about this issue. But the confidential material paints a very different picture of the situation. “It is really quite interesting to see the demands the U.S. has made,” says Klaus Müller, chairman of the Federation of German Consumer Organisations, while evaluating the documents. “Perusing the documents has shown that nearly all of our fears regarding the U.S.’ TTIP intentions for the food market have been proven to be justified.”

a reply to: earthling42

TTIP is an abominiation just like the GAT world trade agreement was but the Billderberger's want it and they will get it, it is about moving the power out of the hand's of the government's AND the people and into the hand's of the elite whom already think of you as animal's and themselve's as royalty.

It is in short about crushing you, population control though a generation cull of the population by poisoning your food with monsanto roundup glyphosphates and cancer and gene damaging geneticaly engineered weed's they call food which also dumb's you down and makes you more compliant.

They own the politician's.

IT IS A WAR for our every survival make no doubt though at the monent we have not yet fully awoken but I see a time in the future were there string's and plan's will unravel and they will be recorded by future historian's alongside the most evil men in history.


At least Green Peace are still fighting for our survival.

Surely we should also look at the official published documents :

ec.europa.eu...

Yep, sorry folks, but the claims of secrecy are false.

This particular section , link below, outlines something that has been claimed about the affect on the NHS. Clearly the claim is false and the biggest danger to the NHS is the Tory government and their pals who are being awarded contracts in secret....sorry very quietly.

trade.ec.europa.eu...

The above section also refutes a lot of claims by the brexiters on what the EU prevents us from doing!

I am not banging the drum of TTIP nor the EU what I am doing is refuting lies. We are about to make a massive change to our country. To do so based on lies would be dumb beyond belief.

a reply to: Phage

No in the UK colour is spelt like that, is that another condition of having to always use American spellings now too

originally posted by: LABTECH767
a reply to: earthling42

TTIP is an abominiation just like the GAT world trade agreement was but the Billderberger's want it and they will get it, it is about moving the power out of the hand's of the government's AND the people and into the hand's of the elite

Yep
And this is EXACTLY what is happening.
It is not capitalism either otherwise they would be pushing for rights and freedoms for all involved.

They want all the power to themselves and none for anyone else

The supranational sovereignty of an intellectual elite and world bankers is surely preferable to the national auto-determination practiced in past centuries
-- David Rockefeller

a reply to: multichild

Got to add this, just some trivia to go with your comment on how we spell colour and in the US they spell it color.
en.wikipedia.org...
www.spellzone.com...

The Yank's spell Phonetically on most word's which is actually more logical but we spell with a lot of French influence on our word's.

originally posted by: earthling42
The documents are published online.

Mods, can you please insert the link to the documents into the OP of this topic?

Thanks in advance.

Thank you.

I can't find the part about forcing GM crops to be accepted.
Anyone?

originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: earthling42

Well, that is cutting corners, products like roundup are poison.

Well. Yes, yes they are. So are insecticides.
You would have a hard time finding anyone who says otherwise.

GM crops? That's sort of different.

Those who know things don't eat GMO's

The Clinton and Bush families dined regularly on organic foods. Both wagyu and grass-fed beef were frequently used.

President Obama, as his predecessors George W. Bush and Bill Clinton, have all reportedly insisted on an organic diet. - See more at: healthimpactnews.com...
- See more at: healthimpactnews.com...

a reply to: SeaWorthy



Yea. Some people think that pesticides and stuff are bad to eat. I do too, but I'm not enough concerned about it to pay the added cost for organic stuff.

I have no problem with GM foods though.

The classified documents represent more than two-thirds of the overall TTIP text as of April, at the 13th round of TTIP negotiations in New York. They cover 13 chapters addressing issues ranging from telecommunications to regulatory cooperation, from pesticides, food and agriculture to trade barriers.

Jorgo Riss, director of Greenpeace EU, said: “These leaked documents confirm what we have been saying for a long time: TTIP would put corporations at the centre of policy-making, to the detriment of environment and public health. We have known that the EU position was bad, now we see the US position is even worse. A compromise between the two would be unacceptable.”

Greenpeace identified four main issues of concern:

LONG STANDING ENVIRONMENTAL PROTECTION IS DROPPED
The “General Exceptions” rule, enshrined in the GATT agreement of the World Trade Organisation (WTO), is absent from the text. This nearly 70-year-old rule allows nations to restrict trade “to protect human, animal and plant life or health", or for "the conservation of exhaustible natural resources" [2].

NO PLACE FOR CLIMATE PROTECTION IN TTIP
If the goals of the Paris Summit to keep temperatures increase under 1.5 degrees are to be met, trade should not be excluded from CO2 emissions reduction specifications. But nothing about climate protection can be found in the obtained texts.

PRECAUTIONARY PRINCIPLE IS FORGOTTEN
The US wants the EU to replace the EU’s hazard approach with ‘risk management’, disregarding the precautionary principle, [3] which is enshrined in the EU Treaty but is never mentioned in the consolidated text.

OPEN DOOR FOR CORPORATE LOBBYING
The leaked documents suggest that both parties consider giving corporations much wider access and participation in decision making.

Jorgo Riss said: “The effects of TTIP would be initially subtle but ultimately devastating. It would lead to European laws being judged on their consequences for trade and investment – disregarding environmental protection and public health concerns.”

For further reading, a link to The Guardian article on the Greenpeace leaks:

www.theguardian.com...

a reply to: multichild

Hah. You can take the word colour and put it in one of the hbtq threads arouns here.

Color it is.

a reply to: onequestion

Hah. And still the US is in business...

Oh! Is that all this is about? I thought that they were going to show how the Soviet KGB funded them in the 60s thru the late 80s.

originally posted by: chr0naut

originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: chr0naut
Is trade a zero sum game?

You can't sell stuff nobody wants to buy.

Nobody will buy your stuff if they've already got it from someone else.

Perhaps it can be reduced to an equation?

really?....if your hungry enough, you'll eat anything...

originally posted by: jimmyx

originally posted by: chr0naut

originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: chr0naut
Is trade a zero sum game?

You can't sell stuff nobody wants to buy.

Nobody will buy your stuff if they've already got it from someone else.

Perhaps it can be reduced to an equation?

really?....if your hungry enough, you'll eat anything...

Rocks? Dirt? Road signs? Car tyres? People starve to the point of death and don't actually eat just anything.

... and as far as international trade goes, it is about money. If people are going hungry, they usually don't have money to pay for food. If they don't have money (or something of similar transferable value) they cannot buy.

Most of the pro-TPP people use the "the same tide raises all ships" argument. However, even in reality the metaphor breaks down because the tide which rises in one place is simultaneously lowering in another. It is, as Phage mentioned, a zero sum. So too is international trade.

Everything that goes somewhere, comes from somewhere. There is no infinite eternal growth. There cannot be. Even if we borrow against the future (credit) there comes a time of reckoning and pay-back.

The Earth is a finite closed system. Resource allocation (like trade) is, therefore, ultimately and truthfully, zero sum, an equation.

Anything that is negotiated behind close doors out of the public eye, and especially with corporations as the writers, is not something that is ever good, and this secrecy alone should raise a red flag.

The TPP is a failure of a trade deal designed to strip away any protection/rights people still have left so that corporations can have a few more dollars. This definitely needs to be stopped.

a reply to: KaibaTheJedi

The negotiations on TPP is finished and agreed on by 12 countries, before 2018 it must be ratified.

CETA (Comprehensive Economic and Trade Agreement) Can-EU is also finished and might be ratified this year.

The big difference between the other trade agreements and CETA is that ISDS has been replaced with ICS (Investment Court System).
This is an improvement compared to ISDS on several points such as transparancy, the court will be public and permanent with tenured judges.
There is also the acknowledgement of the right of governments to regulate.

Something the EU will want to have in TTIP as well, that is, if the negotiations are continued.
As it stands now, France have said that it won't continue, the German minister was also quite negative about the negotiations.
The stance of Europe citizens is quite clear, however i've not yet seen how Americans think about TTIP, what their objections are.