The Mandela Effect Can No Longer Be Denied: Berenstein Was The Tip of The Iceberg

originally posted by: alienDNA
a reply to: hidingthistime

Just dont bring kids into this, thats not right on ANY level.
Not to prove or disprove. Not to use as source or what have you. Leave them out PERIOD.
Of course I get upset when you do that. Why wouldnt I. Call me overly dramatic if you want.

Seriously???? Very overly dramatic.

It is an innocent video.

You are manifacturing false intentions in quite a sinister way at this point.

Quite sick.

a reply to: tigertatzen

Ok, cool.

So, does that mean that also Jesus actual words (not just what other wrote that Jesus said) were changed and ME reaches 2000 years back?

originally posted by: Barcs

originally posted by: TombEscaper
Yet again, condescending hyperbole on your part. What is so threatening or off-putting about someone being certain of something they remember? Many people have very specific recollections of why they remember the "stein" spelling; some even have surnames with the same "stein" ending and have recollections of specific life events involved with the Berenstein spelling.

Well, to be fair, it kind of goes without saying that if 2 people believe that they have "certain" memories about an event that conflict, that at least one of them is wrong (if not both). Both cannot be right. What do you do when people have specific recollections of the "stain" spelling?

I'm not sure if it's an ego thing, but nobody wants to admit that their memory could potentially be faulty regardless of what side you represent in this thread. It's the last thing many folks consider, I've seen many people go senile, and they very often just poopoo it away and then get very upset when they are eventually confronted about it. I'm not saying this is the case with MEers, but stop claiming it's condescending to explore the logical side of things that suggests the proven fallibility of human memory is responsible for many of the similar mistakes.

It's just a little silly to me for somebody to claim they are dead certain when it comes to memory from 20+ years ago. I honestly don't think anybody is ever dead certain in older memories, not even myself. The brain is not like a hard drive where you can save and store files for years and the files are just the same as you left them. It has nothing to do with being condescending, there is valid study and research that shows how memory recollection from long periods in the past can be different from how these events actually happened.

This isn't meant as an insult or meant to imply people have bad memories or are dumb. Chances are everyone will eventually experience these types of things at one point or another in life. That's just the way memory is. Hell, I have trouble remembering things accurately just from 5-10 years ago, I would never claim that I could be certain in a memory from 20+ years ago about something I haven't even looked at since then. How many of the Berenstein people have kept up with the books and continued to read them from back then until today and how many haven't even looked at the books until you heard about ME recently and are relying on memory from decades ago? That's a legitimate question.

The problem is, this phenomenon runs much deeper than "cartoon books" that people have not thought of in 20 or 30 years. This is something that objectors generally refuse to acknowledge or address, as with many other things brought to their attention regarding all of this. This is why I keep reiterating that this is not solely a long-term memory issue.

As for those who remember "stein" vs. those who remember "stain" - Generally, the "stein" folks have been dumbfounded by this situation to the extent that they are willing to stay open to almost any possibility, including differing individual realities, convergences of multiple realities, and other unconventional viewpoints. It is no problem for a "stein" person to acknowledge that someone may remember "stain," but those who seem to have memories that the way things have always been is the way they tangibly appear now have absolutely nothing to contribute to the study of this beyond unrelenting accusations of "false memory." Again and again and again. And again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again.

But I must personally say, the more I look at this and observe the overall (stubbornly condescending) attitudes and general (linear and left-brained) philosophical approach of the "skeptics" to what is possible concerning the nature of reality, I am personally leaning less and less toward the notion of "parallel realities" and more toward some type of psy-manipulation of people who either willfully refuse to accept or are deathly afraid of contemplating the fact that true reality expands far beyond what we have been programmed to believe.

Having said that, it could be some type of combination of multiple realities AND consciousness manipulation. Literallly, anything is on the table at this point.

I'm still kind of observing the differing approaches to this situation while at the same time continuing to investigate it, and what I have come to see is that there is absolutely, unquestionably some type of " perceptual blockage" within those who can be considered "skeptics" on this issue. Almost as if they are being driven by some force that has them on "dismiss and repeat" mode. They have continuously made the same repeated accusations and rebuttals against folks who have repeatedly demonstrated to them that their accusations are false, and their rebuttals are nothing other than a shadow boxing against the wind; "punching at ghosts," if you will. There is some type of set-up within their perception that prohibits them from "getting it." A delusion of some sort. It seems to border on a deep-seated inferiority complex that translates into unfounded "special snowflake" type of accusations, an extremely condescending attitude, and a constant refusal to acknowledge many bits of solid evidence presented to them that would support the idea of something yet unexplained happening with all of this.

This has been demonstrated throughout this entire thread.

I'm sure this post will bring out the torches and pitchforks, the cross and nails, and at this point, I really don't give a damn. I see what I see.

a reply to: TombEscaper

This post was sooo awesome, may I quote it in my thread? I have a 7 man gang up against me right now, and this answer is excellent!

originally posted by: hidingthistime
a reply to: TombEscaper

This post was sooo awesome, may I quote it in my thread? I have a 7 man gang up against me right now, and this answer is excellent!

You have free permission to do whatever you'd like with it!

originally posted by: TombEscaper

originally posted by: hidingthistime
a reply to: TombEscaper

This post was sooo awesome, may I quote it in my thread? I have a 7 man gang up against me right now, and this answer is excellent!

You have free permission to do whatever you'd like with it!

thank you! I get t oo defensive in my answers after being warn down, and that reply is great, thanks again!

a reply to: hidingthistime

I don't care about the video.. I care about your statement.. and since you cleared it up by referring to the video... why go on about it?
I'm hardly doing anything of the sort. you do that yourself quite amicably.

ok.
I wonder who of us are sick.

a reply to: hidingthistime


No problem, and I had to take a couple weeks off from posting here for the same reasons. I kept up with it though.

a reply to: hidingthistime

hardly excellent
full of lies. I'm very open minded and since I experience lots of this too, I've researched it a lot during the past week.
so how do you explain me? I don't fit in with that extremely narrow description of the "sceptics" and I certainly don't fit in with you lot either.
thank god for that.
so how do you explain me?
a perfectly open minded but grounded person.
neither sceptic or believer.

I've never said that this thing doesn't exist, the only thing I've said is that it is perfectly explainable.

in all honesty, you are the true sceptics. you refuse to believe reality so you make up your own.

originally posted by: TombEscaper
a reply to: hidingthistime


No problem, and I had to take a couple weeks off from posting here for the same reasons. I kept up with it though.

yes, I am nearly ready for a break. They are swarming lately! I wonder if it scares them, or their subconscious knows it is true so that is why they fight it so much?

I am not a flat eather, but I dont go jump from thread to thread of theirs telling them they are wrong. I dont believe it, so it doesn't interest me to talk about it either way, so I do not understand the obsession some have.

a reply to: TombEscaper

This is something that objectors generally refuse to acknowledge or address, as with many other things brought to their attention regarding all of this. This is why I keep reiterating that this is not solely a long-term memory issue.

-Give me one thing that so many of what you call "us" refuse to adress or acknowligde. ONE thing.

some type of psy-manipulation of people who either willfully refuse to accept or are deathly afraid of contemplating the fact that true reality expands far beyond what we have been programmed to believe.

- what? Where do these people like you come from to make such accusations and presumptions. You do realise, I hope, that you are lying through your teeth?
How do you know what I believe or not believe? How do you know I refuse or accept something?
Give me ONE example where what you said is true.

" perceptual blockage" within those who can be considered "skeptics" on this issue.

- Again. Give me an example where I have blocked something or refused something you consider is evidence.
Since I dont believe in wild theories I must be to you, a sceptic. Correct? So then for the sake of argument, lets just say I am a sceptic.
Give me an example so you can prove me wrong on this one too, please.

"dismiss and repeat" mode

- ok. So now youre calling "us" robots or something? We just dismiss any wild cockamaney theory you present, cause we FEEL like it? or are programmed to do so? Or what are you saying here exactly?
Again your accusing "us" of really crazy stuff here and making wild assumptions.

They have continuously made the same repeated accusations and rebuttals against folks who have repeatedly demonstrated to them that their accusations are false,

- Give me an example please. Tell me where Ive made an accusation and where someone demonstrated I was wrong.
Since Im a "sceptic" in this case, and you lot seems to think we are all like robots, then you must be able to answer my question.

There is some type of set-up within their perception that prohibits them from "getting it." A delusion of some sort.

- Thats pretty bold of you to say. We are not only robots, we are stupid robots at that. Again, what have I said in this thread that is delusional. Or any shred of evidence of me not "getting it".
One example is well enough.

And to think that other person thought your post was excellent when it is riddled with accusations, lies, presumptions and pure insanity.. well.. That speaks volumes.
So thank you for that.

a reply to: hidingthistime

ORRR... ORRRR

It could be "we" are trying to reach you? With common sense? Could it be THAT ??
But no. Of course it cant. That doesnt fit your image of "us".

I think you are taking things a little personally...

I was talking in generalities, and how i got swarmed in my thread by people who were harrassing me years ago even!

Maybe you need a break too?

a reply to: hidingthistime

Very well. I can relate to that.
But I have to disagree with one part.
The part of me taking it to personally.
You see, if I am categorized as a sceptic in this thread and Im ok with that - I do take offense with what that other person wrote.
I think you can see why, too. some of the things he wrote, that I quoted.. are ... perhaps a bit... presumptuous to say the least?

originally posted by: Ruiner1978
Given that Hawkins and others warned that Cern could mess with the fabric of reality and cause black holes, is it not a possibility?

I saw this on urban legends not too long ago. The chance of Cern creating a black hole is so minuscule, it's not worth even mentioning. You need tremendous energy to sustain a black hole, what cern does would only create it for a millisecond at most, we wouldn't have to worry about it.

a reply to: hidingthistime

I've watched every video you've posted. All English speakers, mostly american.

a reply to: Barcs

If im not mistaken it was also said with a huge grain of humour, in respect to the internets conspiracy theories regarding cern.

a reply to: Agartha

The education was just fine in my day. It has fallen down fast in the last 20 years. However, I visit Europe often, especially Ireland, and I must say your 18-25 demographic is no different than ours. I'd take an American 20 something over an Irish 20 something any day. I find French 20 somethings to be among the most dumbed down. It's like they learn propaganda over science and math.

a reply to: hidingthistime

If you think it was awesome that's just more proof of the problem here. You are seeking confirmation bias.

Tomb lost all when he said:

willing to stay open to almost any possibility, including differing individual realities, convergences of multiple realities, and other unconventional viewpoints.

Because that isn't staying open minded. That is being close minded and refusing to accept that you could be wrong. The entire ME group veils this refusal as "being open minded", when in reality they are just being delusional.

a reply to: TombEscaper

Maybe some skeptics in here are being jerks. I haven't read all the posts, so I probably missed some things. The problem is, you are trying to paint all the skeptics in a negative light and are just dismissing them all, just because they mention the faulty memory thing often (even though it's still the most logical explanation thus far). You can't call yourself "open minded" when you refuse to acknowledge the possibility that you could be wrong or remembering things incorrectly. An open minded person considers all possibilities, not just the ones they like.

I'm a skeptic, but I'm also open minded, I just wish the ME people were open minded as well to the other side. This topic greatly interests me, which is why I've been doing tons of research and polling about things that have supposedly changed. It just seems the people affected will not even consider that memory can be faulty or that memory is never exact when recalling your distant past. Plus there's also the fact that people lie. It seems all evidence for some kind of Mandela effect is completely subjective because you are going 100% based on a memory rather than an objective truth. This makes it incredibly difficult to confirm or deny.

This is why I'm looking for details, big details. This is why I asked about Tiger's friend in NZ, to get to the bottom of what has allegedly changed and get specific details. IF ME is a real phenomenon that isn't just incorrect memory recall, it would not just be limited to very similar name spellings in English. Berenstain Bears should have changed in other languages as well. If it wasn't poor memory there would be multiple people confirming these same big details that I am looking for in regards to NZ moving or other major things.

For the spellings and pronunciations of names, my research has shown that the most familiar folks with the topic usually have the "correct" memories. I am seeking BIG noticeable changes, not obvious minor name spellings and pronunciation errors. I believe everyone is doing this topic a disservice by only focusing on the minor things like Berenstain and swearing that their memory is right when it's obvious that many of those things are just incorrect memory, especially since the Berenstein thing doesn't apply in other languages.

Lets focus on the big stuff, ie NZ allegedly being moved, mars being closer to the sun than earth, etc. Give us some examples that can't be dismissed as poor spelling or possible bad memory with something similar. That would be a start if folks wish to show this is more than just bad memory. There's no question that a good amount of it is. So lets drop the Berenstain Bears, Reba Mcintyre, Star wars misquotes, and other minor things. Let's get to the bottom of the major things.

And please stop appealing and pandering to fear. Skeptics aren't against it because they are afraid. That's like telling a non religious person that they don't believe because they are afraid of god. It has nothing to do with fear, bringing that up is childish. It has to do with finding the logic and reason in a situation rather than automatically assuming there is some giant Hadron Collider conspiracy, or whatever else.

originally posted by: Krneki
a reply to: tigertatzen

Ok, cool.

So, does that mean that also Jesus actual words (not just what other wrote that Jesus said) were changed and ME reaches 2000 years back?

I'm not sure what you mean. Were the altered verses in red? I don't personally believe that whomever wrote those words had any way of knowing for certain who said them...or if they were actually said at all. I think it is a legend, with some valuable life lessons, but I have serious doubts that Jesus actually said the vast majority of what is attributed to him.

Truthfully, though I remember both of those verses the old way, the Bible itself is not a great example of these effects simply because it's the written version of that childhood game "Telephone". You've got the double whammy of a book that was written in an ancient language and translated by people who could never be certain that their translation was even accurate, and that was compiled of stories that were told and retold numerous times before ink ever touched papyrus in the first place.

I would think that if a time shift were responsible, it would have to have shifted back in biblical times in order to affect the words in the Bible. But it's far more likely that something deliberate is going on...at least to me. The time shift theory just doesn't work for me...although it is certainly fascinating to think about.