Virginia gives voting rights to Felons?

www.richmond.com...

I just read this and I am shocked to say the least.
Removing all political affiliation, I find myself dumbfounded by such a reckless act.
I do not understand why this would happen 200,000 felons get to vote?
I was always in fear growing up, of staying clear of felonies as they take away your guns and your vote.
Apparently not anymore.
The worst part is I know ex-felons who are good people now and living good lives, who tried to contact governors for pardons and are denied time and time again.
Now everyone in Virginia gets a free pass...

Sorry just a rant I guess...

I think saying QUOTE:
"Not long after President Abraham Lincoln celebrated emancipation with former slaves gathered not 20 yards from where I'm standing, Virginia initiated a campaign of intimation, of corruption, of violence aimed at separating African-Americans from their constitutional right to vote," McAuliffe said... is the most racist thing I heard today.

Wonderful country I live in...

a reply to: curiouspatience

Why shouldn't someone who's done their time get to vote? They're still citizens, and laws still affect them.

Virginia is one of 10 states that do not automatically restore rights upon completion of a felony sentence and one of only four states that require an application by the ex-felon and action by the governor, according to the McAuliffe administration, which cited research showing one of every five African-Americans of voting age in Virginia has lost the right to vote.

Seems like VA was behind and now they're catching up.

a reply to: curiouspatience

They are still citizens of your nation, they are still affected by the laws passed in your country and they should have the right to vote.
Imprisonment is supposed to be about punishment and REHABILITATION, one day these men and women will have served their times and repaid their debt to society, and they should have a say in what government they would want to choose.

Revoking the right of anyone to vote is a revocation of their identity as a citizen of a democratic nation.

I know it's uncomfortable, because everyone want to go with "hang them all!!!!!" but these are still Humans and they still deserve some rights.

originally posted by: curiouspatience
www.richmond.com...

I just read this and I am shocked to say the least.
Removing all political affiliation, I find myself dumbfounded by such a reckless act.
I do not understand why this would happen 200,000 felons get to vote?

They are not felons, they are ex-felons. Ex-felons.

I was always in fear growing up, of staying clear of felonies as they take away your guns and your vote.
Apparently not anymore.
The worst part is I know ex-felons who are good people now and living good lives, who tried to contact governors for pardons and are denied time and time again.

The worst part is you "know ex-felons who are good people now and living good lives," yet apparently you think they should be second-class citizens.

The real headline of that article explains why this was done... perfectly.

Pulling out all the stops for a win aren't they? What's really funny is that I have heard his name bandied about as a possible VP selection for Hillary (No link, but I live in VA and it's been hinted at in the local news a few times).

If I were one of the felons who could now vote, I would think long and hard about why nobody cared if I could vote before now. The man has been in office long enough to have done this before now.

a reply to: Cohen the Barbarian

As mentioned above, there is a political motivation behind this.

That having been said, I agree with you wholeheartedly.

I'm not kidding when I say that their 2A rights also need to be restored as used to be the case.

a reply to: curiouspatience

The issue of Felons having their right to vote restored is not new. Only 10 states never restore a Felons right to vote. Most restore after the period of incarceration + parole has been satisfied.

felonvoting.procon.org...

The only thing new here is that Virginia has modernized their process.

I personally think that even people serving time should have the right to vote.

Criminals are still citizens who are subjected to the policies enacted by elected officials... in a true democracy, why shouldn't they be allowed to vote?

a reply to: curiouspatience

I think once a person has repaid their debt to society, they should have MOST of their rights reinstated, depending on the type and degree of felony.


iTruthSeeker

ex felons should be able to do anything a normal citizen can do, as that is the whole theory behind law and punishment. you cant keep punishing someone forever for a crime once the sentence is up. its unconstitutional.
Should people currently serving a sentence have restrictions? that case can be argued, sure..really they are sort of property of the state in some regard until their time is served, but once that is done..yep, fully in favor of all civil rights restored.

And furthermore, after the time is up, records that public can access should be closed, only able to be opened by a judge (for consideration of new cases down the road). One studied fact of why many ex felons start crime again is due to a record that holds them back from reintegration with society.
America has a horrible, globally catastrophic prison culture system that needs a full overhaul. good to see virginia actually taking a step towards sanity in these regards.

originally posted by: iTruthSeeker
a reply to: curiouspatience

I think once a person has repaid their debt to society, they should have MOST of their rights reinstated, depending on the type and degree of felony.


iTruthSeeker

Agreed. any felony I personally deem bad should be forever a black mark to punish eternally. this being sex, violent, and drug offenses. the rest should be fine.
sex offenses because rapists are bad.
Violent offenses because violence is bad
and drug offenses because they quite often are the determining factor of the first two.

...seeing an issue yet? you start off immediately with a slippery slope of morality that can have arguments against any and all crimes as it meeting the morality mark.
Rights restrictions happen during the punishment phase..thats the concept of punishment. dont want someone to vote wrong, send em away for life.

originally posted by: Subaeruginosa
I personally think that even people serving time should have the right to vote.

Criminals are still citizens who are subjected to the policies enacted by elected officials... in a true democracy, why shouldn't they be allowed to vote?

Actually incorrect. When you are a guilty criminal, during your punishment phase, you are property of the DOC. They can make you wear clothes, do jobs, etc..you are basically enslaved by the state. Once you are finished your punishment, you are once again a citizen and theory is, your rights restored.
Some states allow voting while incarcerated, some dont, its fully up to the state on how they treat their "property". There are rules of course, they cant torture or murder..basically you can consider it similar to a prisoner of war. rules in place on how to treat them, but you dont need to let them have any rights of voting, sunshine, etc.

originally posted by: SaturnFX

originally posted by: iTruthSeeker
a reply to: curiouspatience

I think once a person has repaid their debt to society, they should have MOST of their rights reinstated, depending on the type and degree of felony.


iTruthSeeker

Agreed. any felony I personally deem bad should be forever a black mark to punish eternally. this being sex, violent, and drug offenses. the rest should be fine.
sex offenses because rapists are bad.
Violent offenses because violence is bad
and drug offenses because they quite often are the determining factor of the first two.

...seeing an issue yet? you start off immediately with a slippery slope of morality that can have arguments against any and all crimes as it meeting the morality mark.
Rights restrictions happen during the punishment phase..thats the concept of punishment. dont want someone to vote wrong, send em away for life.

I see what you are saying, but when we hear of a high profile shooting or killing, the suspect usually has a mile long record of felonies. Plus the sentencing is a joke because they should not have been out on the street to begin with. Do you think a person who has been charged 5 times with violent robberies and other violent gun crimes should still be able to walk into a gun store and legally buy a gun? Now if harsh sentences were doled out, then maybe the person will learn from it and indeed be born again once they are released. Tricky situation I guess.

iTruthSeeker

a reply to: curiouspatience

From your own source: "Virginia is one of 10 states that do not automatically restore rights upon completion of a felony sentence and one of only four states that require an application by the ex-felon and action by the governor"

Therefore, in my opinion, you are fear mongering. That means the other 40 automatically restore voting rights to offenders.

originally posted by: kelbtalfenek
a reply to: curiouspatience

From your own source: "Virginia is one of 10 states that do not automatically restore rights upon completion of a felony sentence and one of only four states that require an application by the ex-felon and action by the governor"

Therefore, in my opinion, you are fear mongering. That means the other 40 automatically restore voting rights to offenders.

He isn't fear mongering. He probably just didn't know. Heck I didn't know voting rights were restored in most states.


iTruthSeeker

originally posted by: iTruthSeeker
I see what you are saying, but when we hear of a high profile shooting or killing, the suspect usually has a mile long record of felonies. Plus the sentencing is a joke because they should not have been out on the street to begin with. Do you think a person who has been charged 5 times with violent robberies and other violent gun crimes should still be able to walk into a gun store and legally buy a gun? Now if harsh sentences were doled out, then maybe the person will learn from it and indeed be born again once they are released. Tricky situation I guess.

iTruthSeeker

So a bit to touch onto here.
mile long record: sounds like a sentencing issue going on here moreso than a rights issue.
I understand the kneejerk reaction to want to hammer repeat offenders, but really what needs to happen here is a individual approach.
I would be in favor of conditional rights. such as every few months for x amount of years having to pass a psychological profile that demonstrates low danger, along with typical anger managment courses and the like, and as more offenses pile up, sentences becoming increasingly longer.
But they already do anyhow. 3 strike rule can make things go quite bad for someone going through a...phase in life.

a reply to: curiouspatience

So, 200 000 ex-felon Democrats get to vote for future felon Hillary

Makes sense, in a disturbing way...

originally posted by: Subaeruginosa
I personally think that even people serving time should have the right to vote.

Criminals are still citizens who are subjected to the policies enacted by elected officials... in a true democracy, why shouldn't they be allowed to vote?

Felons CHOSE to disobey laws.
They CHOSE to not be part of the society's legal framework for civil relations between individuals.

And, with voting, you see nothing wrong with them having a say in a legal system they chose to ignore ?

originally posted by: M5xaz

originally posted by: Subaeruginosa
I personally think that even people serving time should have the right to vote.

Criminals are still citizens who are subjected to the policies enacted by elected officials... in a true democracy, why shouldn't they be allowed to vote?

Felons CHOSE to disobey laws.
They CHOSE to not be part of the society's legal framework for civil relations between individuals.

And, with voting, you see nothing wrong with them having a say in a legal system they chose to ignore ?

If you really feel like that, shouldn't the ban extend to anyone who's ever willfully broken a law? That would apply to drug use, speeding, jaywalking, joyriding, and every other crime. After all, these people also chose to ignore the legal system.

originally posted by: enlightenedservant

originally posted by: M5xaz

originally posted by: Subaeruginosa
I personally think that even people serving time should have the right to vote.

Criminals are still citizens who are subjected to the policies enacted by elected officials... in a true democracy, why shouldn't they be allowed to vote?

Felons CHOSE to disobey laws.
They CHOSE to not be part of the society's legal framework for civil relations between individuals.

And, with voting, you see nothing wrong with them having a say in a legal system they chose to ignore ?

If you really feel like that, shouldn't the ban extend to anyone who's ever willfully broken a law? That would apply to drug use, speeding, jaywalking, joyriding, and every other crime. After all, these people also chose to ignore the legal system.

Read again.

I said FELONS.

Jaywalking, to use your example, is not a felony, nor should it be.

Unless you equate jaywalking with "joyriding", e.g. stealing a car.