Police Officer talks about his experience at Trump's rally in Tucson: AWESOME!

a reply to: Grambler

No, blocking a street is illegal trespass.

Physically attacking someone else is assault and/or battery.

You're not a "bad guy" for personally insulting me. IN fact, you didn't "personally insult me." "You" are words on a screen.

When you (or anyone else) posts personal comments regarding another poster rather than the argument, you're "breaking the law" (similar in my example to blocking the streets). If you do it often enough you will answer to "the government" (Mods and Owners) for doing so and will be punished, not because you "shut down free speech" but because you focused on me rather than my argument.

In regard to your request, I'll admit that the difference is subtle sometimes between attacking another poster and attacking their argument. That's why our Mods stay so busy. Look at what you've said in your responses to me. When are you addressing (or describing) the argument and when are you addressing (or describing) "me" the Ghost in the Machine behind the words posted?

That's the answer to your query.

originally posted by: UKTruth

originally posted by: introvert
a reply to: UKTruth

but it is only Trump who has solutions that might be hard for people to hear but are real.

What solutions are those? When I read your comment I went to his website and have not found any policy proposals he has on the terrorism/ISIS issue.

You have a lot of revision and catching up to do.

You made a specific claim, one in which Trump has real solutions. I'm simply asking what those solutions are, that you claim only Trump has.

So what are they?

originally posted by: introvert

originally posted by: UKTruth

originally posted by: introvert
a reply to: UKTruth

but it is only Trump who has solutions that might be hard for people to hear but are real.

What solutions are those? When I read your comment I went to his website and have not found any policy proposals he has on the terrorism/ISIS issue.

You have a lot of revision and catching up to do.

You made a specific claim, one in which Trump has real solutions. I'm simply asking what those solutions are, that you claim only Trump has.

So what are they?

Close borders to target groups (Muslims)
Improve screening / checks before reopening borders
Deport
Surveillance (outside current constitution)
Torture (through expanded laws)
Destroy infrastructure being used by ISIS to communicate and move around
Destroy resources (oil)
Remove the restrictions on the military and accept collateral damage

No revelations there - been said many times. I am sure you knew them but assume you just want to get into an argument. Play on your own.

originally posted by: UKTruth

originally posted by: introvert

originally posted by: UKTruth

originally posted by: introvert
a reply to: UKTruth

but it is only Trump who has solutions that might be hard for people to hear but are real.

What solutions are those? When I read your comment I went to his website and have not found any policy proposals he has on the terrorism/ISIS issue.

You have a lot of revision and catching up to do.

You made a specific claim, one in which Trump has real solutions. I'm simply asking what those solutions are, that you claim only Trump has.

So what are they?

Close borders to target groups (Muslims)
Improve screening / checks before reopening borders
Deport
Surveillance (outside current constitution)
Torture (through expanded laws)
Destroy infrastructure being used by ISIS to communicate and move around
Destroy resources (oil)
Remove the restrictions on the military and accept collateral damage

No revelations there - been said many times.

That's true. Those things have been said many times, but not just by Trump. Well, that's not entirely correct. I believe he is the only one that has stuck his foot in his mouth over torture.

So you believe torture is ok and that we can subvert our Constitution for the sake of surveillance.

What is that old saying by one of the Founders: "They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."

Forgive me if I disagree.

originally posted by: introvert

originally posted by: UKTruth

originally posted by: introvert

originally posted by: UKTruth

originally posted by: introvert
a reply to: UKTruth

but it is only Trump who has solutions that might be hard for people to hear but are real.

What solutions are those? When I read your comment I went to his website and have not found any policy proposals he has on the terrorism/ISIS issue.

You have a lot of revision and catching up to do.

You made a specific claim, one in which Trump has real solutions. I'm simply asking what those solutions are, that you claim only Trump has.

So what are they?

Close borders to target groups (Muslims)
Improve screening / checks before reopening borders
Deport
Surveillance (outside current constitution)
Torture (through expanded laws)
Destroy infrastructure being used by ISIS to communicate and move around
Destroy resources (oil)
Remove the restrictions on the military and accept collateral damage

No revelations there - been said many times.

That's true. Those things have been said many times, but not just by Trump. Well, that's not entirely correct. I believe he is the only one that has stuck his foot in his mouth over torture.

So you believe torture is ok and that we can subvert our Constitution for the sake of surveillance.

What is that old saying by one of the Founders: "They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."

Forgive me if I disagree.

The threat faced by the west is such that emergency measures are called for. I fully agree with and support the torture of proven terrorists.
Trump is the person who has repeatedly talked about war strategies such as taking out resources and infrastructure.
Ted Cruz talks about carpet bombing and arming one side (same mistakes made in the past),
Kasich talks about trying to get a coalition together (that won't happen - there is not the will).
Clinton has no clue at all what is going on and Bernie is against all conflict and buries is head in the sand.

a reply to: UKTruth

Fair enough.

Just promise me, we're not going to get this guy...

originally posted by: UKTruth

originally posted by: introvert

originally posted by: UKTruth

originally posted by: introvert

originally posted by: UKTruth

originally posted by: introvert
a reply to: UKTruth

but it is only Trump who has solutions that might be hard for people to hear but are real.

What solutions are those? When I read your comment I went to his website and have not found any policy proposals he has on the terrorism/ISIS issue.

You have a lot of revision and catching up to do.

You made a specific claim, one in which Trump has real solutions. I'm simply asking what those solutions are, that you claim only Trump has.

So what are they?

Close borders to target groups (Muslims)
Improve screening / checks before reopening borders
Deport
Surveillance (outside current constitution)
Torture (through expanded laws)
Destroy infrastructure being used by ISIS to communicate and move around
Destroy resources (oil)
Remove the restrictions on the military and accept collateral damage

No revelations there - been said many times.

That's true. Those things have been said many times, but not just by Trump. Well, that's not entirely correct. I believe he is the only one that has stuck his foot in his mouth over torture.

So you believe torture is ok and that we can subvert our Constitution for the sake of surveillance.

What is that old saying by one of the Founders: "They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."

Forgive me if I disagree.

The threat faced by the west is such that emergency measures are called for. I fully agree and support the torture of proven terrorists.

Proven terrorists? Well that would require a trial in which guilt is established. Are you willing to give them a trial first?

Also, when engaging in torture practices, you become a "criminal" yourself, or terrorist if you will, by breaking Geneva Convention protocols.

So let's recap: You want to subvert the US Constitution to spy on people, torture "proven" terrorists and subvert the Geneva Convention that was put in place to stop ignorant people from doing exactly what you describe?

originally posted by: introvert

originally posted by: UKTruth

originally posted by: introvert

originally posted by: UKTruth

originally posted by: introvert

originally posted by: UKTruth

originally posted by: introvert
a reply to: UKTruth

but it is only Trump who has solutions that might be hard for people to hear but are real.

What solutions are those? When I read your comment I went to his website and have not found any policy proposals he has on the terrorism/ISIS issue.

You have a lot of revision and catching up to do.

You made a specific claim, one in which Trump has real solutions. I'm simply asking what those solutions are, that you claim only Trump has.

So what are they?

Close borders to target groups (Muslims)
Improve screening / checks before reopening borders
Deport
Surveillance (outside current constitution)
Torture (through expanded laws)
Destroy infrastructure being used by ISIS to communicate and move around
Destroy resources (oil)
Remove the restrictions on the military and accept collateral damage

No revelations there - been said many times.

That's true. Those things have been said many times, but not just by Trump. Well, that's not entirely correct. I believe he is the only one that has stuck his foot in his mouth over torture.

So you believe torture is ok and that we can subvert our Constitution for the sake of surveillance.

What is that old saying by one of the Founders: "They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."

Forgive me if I disagree.

The threat faced by the west is such that emergency measures are called for. I fully agree and support the torture of proven terrorists.

Proven terrorists? Well that would require a trial in which guilt is established. Are you willing to give them a trial first?

Also, when engaging in torture practices, you become a "criminal" yourself, or terrorist if you will, by breaking Geneva Convention protocols.

So let's recap: You want to subvert the US Constitution to spy on people, torture "proven" terrorists and subvert the Geneva Convention that was put in place to stop ignorant people from doing exactly what you describe?

Trials are sometimes necessary, other times not.
Spy on people - already happening just needs more focus on target groups (for example the proper resource to monitor facebook more effectively would have red flagged the San Bernadino terrorists)
Geneva Convention - time for some exceptions. You best get ready for a new world. The rules of engagement have already dramatically changed.

Please refrain from personal comments dressed up with innuendo.

Instead of the snide remarks - please provide your solutions?

a reply to: UKTruth

Trials are sometimes necessary, other times not.

In the US, for someone to be considered a "proven" terrorist or criminal a trial must take place. We have a process for a reason and that is so that we do not wrongfully label or convict someone without due process.

Spy on people - already happening just needs more focus on target groups.

Further erosion of the Constitution is not something that should even be considered.

Geneva Convention - time for some exceptions. You best get ready for a new world. The rules of engagement have already dramatically changed.

You propose a new world in which we toss-out any sense of humanity and morality in order to justify the disgusting and reprehensible treatment of human beings. Considering the list you provided earlier, it becomes more and more difficult to tell the difference between your ideology and that of those crazy ISIS bastards.

Take a look at your list. Many of those things ISIS is doing as we speak.

Please refrain from personal comments dressed up with innuendo. Instead of the snide remarks - please provide your solutions?

I believe I accurately summarized your assertions based on what you actually posted. If you take that as snide or personal, perhaps you need to review what you are posting.

originally posted by: introvert
a reply to: UKTruth

Trials are sometimes necessary, other times not.

In the US, for someone to be considered a "proven" terrorist or criminal a trial must take place. We have a process for a reason and that is so that we do not wrongfully label or convict someone without due process.

Spy on people - already happening just needs more focus on target groups.

Further erosion of the Constitution is not something that should even be considered.

Geneva Convention - time for some exceptions. You best get ready for a new world. The rules of engagement have already dramatically changed.

You propose a new world in which we toss-out any sense of humanity and morality in order to justify the disgusting and reprehensible treatment of human beings. Considering the list you provided earlier, it becomes more and more difficult to tell the difference between your ideology and that of those crazy ISIS bastards.

Take a look at your list. Many of those things ISIS is doing as we speak.

Please refrain from personal comments dressed up with innuendo. Instead of the snide remarks - please provide your solutions?

I believe I accurately summarized your assertions based on what you actually posted. If you take that as snide or personal, perhaps you need to review what you are posting.

I asked for your solutions. The back and forth on mine is done. I disagree with you.
In terms of your snide remark, you know what you were doing. I know too. Lets leave it there and hopefully we will see no more of it.

So , what should be done?

a reply to: UKTruth

UKTruth, I feel the conflict within you, let go of your hate!

Here's the solution... Just for now... Trump should table the "increase torture, ban all muslims, kill their families" idea. It's the torture and killing the families and rounding up 11 million people... Those big ideas need to be shhhhh.... Just table that for now...

Trump should get back on TV. Make the Apprentice great again. Like amazing great. Leave all this world conflict stuff to cooler heads. And then we all exhale and say things like, "Wow, I never thought I'd be so happy to have an establishment politician in the white house again."

originally posted by: spiritualzombie
a reply to: UKTruth

UKTruth, I feel the conflict within you, let go of your hate!

Here's the solution... Just for now... Trump should table the "increase torture, ban all muslims, kill their families" idea. It's the torture and killing the families and rounding up 11 million people... Those big ideas need to be shhhhh.... Just table that for now...

Trump should get back on TV. Make the Apprentice great again. Like amazing great. Leave all this world conflict stuff to cooler heads. And then we all exhale and say things like, "Wow, I never thought I'd be so happy to have an establishment politician in the white house again."

Lets try and talk about solutions.
I am waiting for those.

a reply to: UKTruth


Solution #1. Look at the big picture. Trump is causing a storm, insulting people, encouraging violence, using aggressive rhetoric, violent ideas, holding personal grudges, and doubling down whenever challenged-- so, let's not give this guy keys to the nukes.

originally posted by: UKTruth

originally posted by: introvert
a reply to: UKTruth

Trials are sometimes necessary, other times not.

In the US, for someone to be considered a "proven" terrorist or criminal a trial must take place. We have a process for a reason and that is so that we do not wrongfully label or convict someone without due process.

Spy on people - already happening just needs more focus on target groups.

Further erosion of the Constitution is not something that should even be considered.

Geneva Convention - time for some exceptions. You best get ready for a new world. The rules of engagement have already dramatically changed.

You propose a new world in which we toss-out any sense of humanity and morality in order to justify the disgusting and reprehensible treatment of human beings. Considering the list you provided earlier, it becomes more and more difficult to tell the difference between your ideology and that of those crazy ISIS bastards.

Take a look at your list. Many of those things ISIS is doing as we speak.

Please refrain from personal comments dressed up with innuendo. Instead of the snide remarks - please provide your solutions?

I believe I accurately summarized your assertions based on what you actually posted. If you take that as snide or personal, perhaps you need to review what you are posting.

I asked for your solutions. The back and forth on mine is done. I disagree with you.

So , what should be done?

My ideas for solutions are irrelevant. I have no control to affect policy.

What is important here is that the original premise of our dialogue was your statement that Trump's ideas were better than any other candidate. You listed his ideas and then continued to expand on them......making it personal and accepting them as your own.

Considering that, we can assume, if we are to believe you, that Trump wishes to subvert the Constitution, dominate the resources of other nations, bypass the Geneva Convention by torturing people and dismiss the ideals of due process.

All of this in order to bring about the "new world" you speak of.

Anything I missed?

originally posted by: introvert

originally posted by: UKTruth

originally posted by: introvert
a reply to: UKTruth

Trials are sometimes necessary, other times not.

In the US, for someone to be considered a "proven" terrorist or criminal a trial must take place. We have a process for a reason and that is so that we do not wrongfully label or convict someone without due process.

Spy on people - already happening just needs more focus on target groups.

Further erosion of the Constitution is not something that should even be considered.

Geneva Convention - time for some exceptions. You best get ready for a new world. The rules of engagement have already dramatically changed.

You propose a new world in which we toss-out any sense of humanity and morality in order to justify the disgusting and reprehensible treatment of human beings. Considering the list you provided earlier, it becomes more and more difficult to tell the difference between your ideology and that of those crazy ISIS bastards.

Take a look at your list. Many of those things ISIS is doing as we speak.

Please refrain from personal comments dressed up with innuendo. Instead of the snide remarks - please provide your solutions?

I believe I accurately summarized your assertions based on what you actually posted. If you take that as snide or personal, perhaps you need to review what you are posting.

I asked for your solutions. The back and forth on mine is done. I disagree with you.

So , what should be done?

My ideas for solutions are irrelevant. I have no control to affect policy.

What is important here is that the original premise of our dialogue was your statement that Trump's ideas were better than any other candidate. You listed his ideas and then continued expand on them......making it personal and accepting them as your own.

Considering that, we can assume, if we are to believe you, that Trump wishes to subvert the Constitution, dominate the resources of other nations, bypass the Geneva Convention by torturing people and dismiss the ideals of due process.

All of this in order to bring about the "new world" you speak of.

Anything I missed?

Yes you missed out your solutions. I take it therefore you have none?
Trump has the best solutions which are a bit mean but I agree they are needed, but you seem to have no view on what to do.
Therefore I have no idea why you are commenting unless you are just spoiling for an argument.

One last time. What are your solutions?

originally posted by: introvert

originally posted by: UKTruth

originally posted by: introvert

originally posted by: UKTruth

originally posted by: introvert
a reply to: UKTruth

but it is only Trump who has solutions that might be hard for people to hear but are real.

What solutions are those? When I read your comment I went to his website and have not found any policy proposals he has on the terrorism/ISIS issue.

You have a lot of revision and catching up to do.

You made a specific claim, one in which Trump has real solutions. I'm simply asking what those solutions are, that you claim only Trump has.

So what are they?

Close borders to target groups (Muslims)
Improve screening / checks before reopening borders
Deport
Surveillance (outside current constitution)
Torture (through expanded laws)
Destroy infrastructure being used by ISIS to communicate and move around
Destroy resources (oil)
Remove the restrictions on the military and accept collateral damage

No revelations there - been said many times.

That's true. Those things have been said many times, but not just by Trump. Well, that's not entirely correct. I believe he is the only one that has stuck his foot in his mouth over torture.

So you believe torture is ok and that we can subvert our Constitution for the sake of surveillance.

What is that old saying by one of the Founders: "They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."

Forgive me if I disagree.

Torture OUTSIDE the US does not apply to constitutional scrutiny. They ar enot citizens or visitors to our country so they have no recourse in America UNLESS brought to the US.

Surveillance? Outside in public IS constituitional because its public. also using certain devices to eavesdrop from the street is also OK,but cant be used in a court of law itself.

Closing borders? If they are stopped before coming into the US its not un constituitional or unlawful because until they clear customs they aren a visitor officially.

originally posted by: spiritualzombie
a reply to: UKTruth


Solution #1. Look at the big picture. Trump is causing a storm, insulting people, encouraging violence, using aggressive rhetoric, violent ideas, holding personal grudges, and doubling down whenever challenged-- so, let's not give this guy keys to the nukes.

No, I want the alternative or better solutions to stop terrorism like we saw today in Brussels. Continuing to demonstrate hate for trump over and over again is not going to stop innocent people getting killed.

You must have something to add to the solutions for this worldwide problem?

a reply to: UKTruth

Yes you missed out your solutions. I take it therefore you have none? Trump has the best solutions which are a bit mean, but you seem to have no view on what to do. Therefore I have no idea why you are commenting unless you are just spoiling for an argument.

Sure. I am just doing it for the lively debate, or an argument, as it were. I have ideas, but that was not part of the conversation. I was inquiring about those awesome ideas Trump has and you provided what was asked for.

One last time. What are your solutions?

I don't do requests and will not let you try to control the conversation after you painted yourself in to a corner. You've provided all the information I need to know and you are welcome to change the subject to my personal solutions, if you cannot properly defend what you have stated about yourself and Trump.

a reply to: yuppa

Torture OUTSIDE the US does not apply to constitutional scrutiny. They ar enot citizens or visitors to our country so they have no recourse in America UNLESS brought to the US.

The Geneva Convention is not part of the Constitution.

Surveillance? Outside in public IS constituitional because its public. also using certain devices to eavesdrop from the street is also OK,but cant be used in a court of law itself.

The member in question said "outside current constitution".

Closing borders? If they are stopped before coming into the US its not un constituitional or unlawful because until they clear customs they aren a visitor officially.

That was not a point of contention.

originally posted by: introvert
a reply to: UKTruth

Yes you missed out your solutions. I take it therefore you have none? Trump has the best solutions which are a bit mean, but you seem to have no view on what to do. Therefore I have no idea why you are commenting unless you are just spoiling for an argument.

Sure. I am just doing it for the lively debate, or an argument, as it were. I have ideas, but that was not part of the conversation. I was inquiring about those awesome ideas Trump has and you provided what was asked for.

One last time. What are your solutions?

I don't do requests and will not let you try to control the conversation after you painted yourself in to a corner. You've provided all the information I need to know and you are welcome to change the subject to my personal solutions, if you cannot properly defend what you have stated about yourself and Trump.

So youre going to be a hypocrite and take your ball and go home huh?