Bernie Sanders Platform. Dangerous...Failed...Rehashed...and NOT "Revolutionary"

a reply to: mOjOm

I hate to say it, but I believe you are right. (And for the record I DO NOT like his views. But that man does BElIEVE in what he says.

Perhaps that is worth something.

originally posted by: links234
a reply to: DBCowboy

I want economic freedom for myself and everyone who makes less than the average household income. I believe we can achieve that through Sanders' brand of democratic socialism.

You're a wage slave and you don't even know it.

I confess that this is hard for me. I have a small business and it is hard. Let me say that again. It is HARD to pay my 2 employees. A socialist approach scared the $h!t out of me AND my employees.

Sanders represents the revolution within the Democratic Party, as it pushes further away from its 20th century turn around from the original deep south party ethics (which included plantation politics) to full blown Marxism. The 20th century Democrat was largely behind the repurposing of Bernaysian public relations propaganda, such as the movement to get women to smoke cigarrettes to sell more tobacco to the bra burning of the 60s and the Tasha Yar strong female fiction characters of the 80s and 90s. Hillary represents that feminist empowerment phase, although her actual politics are more in tune with Rules for Radicals Sheep Clothing covering a CFR Trilateral Commission Style cosmopolitan ethic.

a reply to: mOjOm

None of the above is my choice. And the best choice for ME.

a reply to: BatheInTheFountain

Nicely put. Still voting Bernie tho. Just counting on the rest of the nation to oust the House and Senate of the roach infestation.

a reply to: DBCowboy

I wish people would realize there is only ONE party and they do the bidding of their corporate sponsors and those who control money.

a reply to: IlluminatiTechnician

Your post makes sense if you vote. I'm choosing not to.

originally posted by: Freenrgy2
a reply to: DBCowboy

I wish people would realize there is only ONE party and they do the bidding of their corporate sponsors and those who control money.

And everyone thinks that voting for a president, which is just a temporary position, will change anything.

The system sucks. But if you go into it KNOWING that, it helps.

It's like walking into a casino. The house has everything rigged before you even enter, in order for it to win.

Changing presidents is like changing dealers at the blackjack table.

it doesn't increase your odds of winning, but it might make you feel better if you've been losing.

a reply to: BatheInTheFountain

I was on an airport bus after a trip once and spoke to a man who had just come back from Venezuela, he was telling me about Hugo Chavez's "socialist reforms". Chavez, it seems, was throwing farmers off their land and giving it to bums. I also knew a couple who lost everything and had to flee the country. In the case of here,the current system is gamed to screw the middle and working class and funnel all the money to one percent of the population. Socialism will be just as bad. Basically the socialism we will see is if you are middle class or wealthy, Sanders will give everything you have worked for away to immigrants and freeloaders through taxation. I define freeloaders as people who dont want to work and just want to manipulate social assistance to live for free, and there are LOTS of people like this around now. It WON'T all come from the richest people because they are such a small minority even if he taxed them 99 percent the total amount of revenue won't be enough to revamp the country. He will HAVE to tax the middle class and the poor even. You can sugar coat it any way you want, but it will end up that if you have anything of value or any assets, they will be whittled away and given to people who have less. Our taxes will go WAY up. In the end everyone will be equal because we will ALL be poor. How that is different from what we have now eludes me. It wont resemble Norway or Sweden, it will resemble China or Russia under the bolsheviks. I for one dont want to roll those dice. We dont need this and we can do better than this. We need a democratic society with a regulated capitalist economy. We just need laws that protect workers and we need to set limits on what corporations can get away with. Like it or not, only capitalism is capable of generating a decent standard of living. communism never did. Socialism works in some cases in small countries with homogeneous populations but not a diverse country of 400 million. We dont need some radical lurch to the left or the right, we need rational governance and the rule of law.

a reply to: openminded2011

Agreed. Entirely

originally posted by: openminded2011
a reply to: BatheInTheFountain

I was on an airport bus after a trip once and spoke to a man who had just come back from Venezuela, he was telling me about Hugo Chavez's "socialist reforms". Chavez, it seems, was throwing farmers off their land and giving it to bums. I also knew a couple who lost everything and had to flee the country. In the case of here,the current system is gamed to screw the middle and working class and funnel all the money to one percent of the population. Socialism will be just as bad. Basically the socialism we will see is if you are middle class or wealthy, Sanders will give everything you have worked for away to immigrants and freeloaders through taxation. I define freeloaders as people who dont want to work and just want to manipulate social assistance to live for free, and there are LOTS of people like this around now. It WON'T all come from the richest people because they are such a small minority even if he taxed them 99 percent the total amount of revenue won't be enough to revamp the country. He will HAVE to tax the middle class and the poor even. You can sugar coat it any way you want, but it will end up that if you have anything of value or any assets, they will be whittled away and given to people who have less. Our taxes will go WAY up. In the end everyone will be equal because we will ALL be poor. How that is different from what we have now eludes me. It wont resemble Norway or Sweden, it will resemble China or Russia under the bolsheviks. I for one dont want to roll those dice. We dont need this and we can do better than this. We need a democratic society with a regulated capitalist economy. We just need laws that protect workers and we need to set limits on what corporations can get away with. Like it or not, only capitalism is capable of generating a decent standard of living. communism never did. Socialism works in some cases in small countries with homogeneous populations but not a diverse country of 400 million. We dont need some radical lurch to the left or the right, we need rational governance and the rule of law.

Really.... and why exactly would USA turn into Venezuela if it addopted a few good examples from Scandinavia? This is just bs. Its like saying if Singapore would lose its dictator it would turn into South Africa... This is just more fearmongering. Yawn.

Other than Bernie's call for nationalized healthcare, how would he even come close to a "Scandinavian" model?

We aren't Scandinavia.

And he's MORE Statist than most "Liberals" in those nations. He's a Chicago School Marxist, who admired Castro's "work", who vowed that Jesse Jackson was one of the greatest potential Presidential candidates ever...and follows closer the former South American models of Socialism than he does the Scandinavian mixed economy/capital model.

He's a hardliner, and a lifelong "social justice warrior". And the more he speaks, the more he shows his hole cards.

Venezuela might not be that far of a stretch

originally posted by: whatsup86

originally posted by: openminded2011
a reply to: BatheInTheFountain

I was on an airport bus after a trip once and spoke to a man who had just come back from Venezuela, he was telling me about Hugo Chavez's "socialist reforms". Chavez, it seems, was throwing farmers off their land and giving it to bums. I also knew a couple who lost everything and had to flee the country. In the case of here,the current system is gamed to screw the middle and working class and funnel all the money to one percent of the population. Socialism will be just as bad. Basically the socialism we will see is if you are middle class or wealthy, Sanders will give everything you have worked for away to immigrants and freeloaders through taxation. I define freeloaders as people who dont want to work and just want to manipulate social assistance to live for free, and there are LOTS of people like this around now. It WON'T all come from the richest people because they are such a small minority even if he taxed them 99 percent the total amount of revenue won't be enough to revamp the country. He will HAVE to tax the middle class and the poor even. You can sugar coat it any way you want, but it will end up that if you have anything of value or any assets, they will be whittled away and given to people who have less. Our taxes will go WAY up. In the end everyone will be equal because we will ALL be poor. How that is different from what we have now eludes me. It wont resemble Norway or Sweden, it will resemble China or Russia under the bolsheviks. I for one dont want to roll those dice. We dont need this and we can do better than this. We need a democratic society with a regulated capitalist economy. We just need laws that protect workers and we need to set limits on what corporations can get away with. Like it or not, only capitalism is capable of generating a decent standard of living. communism never did. Socialism works in some cases in small countries with homogeneous populations but not a diverse country of 400 million. We dont need some radical lurch to the left or the right, we need rational governance and the rule of law.

Really.... and why exactly would USA turn into Venezuela if it addopted a few good examples from Scandinavia? This is just bs. Its like saying if Singapore would lose its dictator it would turn into South Africa... This is just more fearmongering. Yawn.

Um, no, its NOT BS. What is BS is the delusion that we will have some kind of cradle to grave utopia without having to pay substantially in some way for it. Scandinavia doesn't have a multi trillion dollar deficit, a ravaged industrial base, and tens of millions of illegal immigrants,factors that would make it a very steep uphill climb. Socialism will not come without a huge cost and then it will be too late and we will be stuck with whatever it turns out to be.

originally posted by: DBCowboy

originally posted by: Freenrgy2
a reply to: DBCowboy

I wish people would realize there is only ONE party and they do the bidding of their corporate sponsors and those who control money.

And everyone thinks that voting for a president, which is just a temporary position, will change anything.

The system sucks. But if you go into it KNOWING that, it helps.

It's like walking into a casino. The house has everything rigged before you even enter, in order for it to win.

Changing presidents is like changing dealers at the blackjack table.

it doesn't increase your odds of winning, but it might make you feel better if you've been losing.

"Diapers and Politicians should be changed often and for the same reasons." - Mark Twain

originally posted by: links234
a reply to: EmmanuelGoldstein

It'll be akin to FDR, the policies will be so wildly popular that no one will be willing to do away with them for the next 75 years.

At least, that's what I'm hoping for.

Akin to FDR eh ?

I can see a repeat of history.

Rounding up all the rich folks at put them in Fema camps of their day. Like what was done to the Japanese.

Then off to criminalize Gold, and Silver then confiscating it.

That wasn't enough his out right thievery of Fort Knox.

And the Piece de resistance.

Branding each and every American in this country with a number like cattle, and the creation of the largest welfare program this country has ever seen. Social Security.

No surprise FDR is one of Sanders 'heroes.

Sanders supporters sure didn't help their case with comments like that.

This country has been so successfully divided, like a glass with a nearly indistinguishably close to 50/50 amount of oil and water, that some of us have to be willing to look outside the usual sources for perspective. It's kind of like a couple that has been together so long that only a disinterested third party stands a chance of saying anything that might make a difference.

The bitterness and distrust (some justified, some not) wears at me even when I've tried to step away from it for a while and just live a quiet day. It hangs in the air wherever we go and manifests in even the most unexpected places. One of our sons took our granddaughter to the Indianapolis Zoo and, at the table of one of the snack areas, she asked the little boy about her age sitting next to her if he would like some of her french fries. No way of knowing the adult was his dad or what, but he reached over and boxed the poor little fella up side the head and said, "Get the F*ck away from those white people!"

Perspective often comes from totally unexpected places. Take a moment to read through these thoughts on politics and then try to take an honest look at what life in this country has become.

It's from the "The Green Book" by Muammar Gaddafi

If you want to buy a physical copy, it is available at Amazon but it's not cheap.

A free PDF download is available at www.bgf.nu...

Page 7 - 11

The Instrument Of Government
-- snip --

All political systems in the world today are a product of the struggle for power between alternative instruments of government. This struggle may be peaceful or armed, as is evidenced among classes, sects, tribes, parties or individuals. The outcome is always the victory of a particular governing structure – be it that of an individual, group, party or class -- and the defeat of -- the people; the defeat of genuine democracy.

Political struggle that results in the victory of a candidate with, for example, 51 per cent of the votes leads to a dictatorial governing body in the guise of a false democracy, since 49 per cent of the electorate is ruled by an instrument of government they did not vote for, but which has been imposed upon them. Such is dictatorship. Besides, this political conflict may produce a governing body that represents only a minority. For when votes are distributed among several candidates, though one polls more than any other, the sum of the votes received by those who received fewer votes might well constitute an overwhelming ajority. However, the candidate with fewer votes wins and his success is regarded as legitimate and democratic! In actual fact, dictatorship is established under the cover of false democracy. This is the reality of the political systems prevailing in the world today. They are dictatorial systems and it is evident that they falsify genuine democracy.

Continued...