Routine childhood diseases eliminated. Replaced with sudden death.

a reply to: thebtheb

Japan did withdraw the MMR vaccine in 1993 and started administering single shots, however, it was soon clear that there was no connection between autism and the MMR as shown by Japanese studies:

2012- The combined measles, mumps, and rubella vaccines and the total number of vaccines are not associated with development of autism spectrum disorder: the first case-control study in Asia. LINK

2005- No effect of MMR withdrawal on the incidence of autism: a total population study. LINK

Japan now administers a compulsory double MR vaccine, for Measles and Rubella. Mumps is voluntary and not free.
LINK

I am pro-vaccination but I disagree that vaccines should be compulsory. I think the UK is right by letting parents choose what they want to do. I have never stopped my children from mixing with unvaccinated friends, however, we are all healthy, I would be more careful if one of us had a compromised immune system.

And regarding Wakefield, we have discussed his fraud on two other threads, I don't really want to add it here now.

a reply to: InverseLookingGlass

Isn't the headline a bit alarmist?

Vaccines work similar to antivenoms-the sickness is part of the cure. If your child was bitten by a rattlesnake, would you deny him antivenom because you knew the very thing that could kill your child could also save their life? of course you wouldn't.

Sometimes the love for a child can overpower common sense-and if your child contracts an illness that could've been easily prevented then I'm sad to say that both you and your child will suffer which isn't fair.

originally posted by: Ironhawke
Firstly, great job in the Nazi comparison! Because wanting to wipe out disease is exactly the same as trying to take over the world and kill 6 million + people! Bravo!

I am also deeply appreciative of your efforts to help bring back fun times like whooping cough, measles,and mumps! because you know, kids today are wimps.

Sorry for the sarcasm and vitriol. I appreciate you are just looking out for your kids. I really do. But the whole anti-vaccine thing is based on naught but fear and fraudulent "research". And Jim Carrey, who is an expert in...nothing?

Cheers.

I don't believe the OP mentioned Jim Carrey, but nice deflection.

As for the Nazis - it is about the idea of dictation.

You know, when you're forced to do something against your consent, and the law protects it?

originally posted by: berenike
I recently developed a nut allergy. It's ridiculous, I've eaten or handled nuts my whole life with never a problem. I suspect the reason I now have the allergy is that I have reacted badly to a spider /insect bite.

It's not just about eating nuts, I can't be in the same room as a nut without suffering severe breathing problems. If I handle nuts the skin on my hands breaks and it looks as if I have been playing with razor blades.

I imagine it could be worse for little kids who haven't had a prior lifetime of 'immunity to nuts' - so I'm not surprised that schools are having to be extra careful.

Interesting... I wonder what sort of insect caused that for you?

A person could become allergic to red meat because of a tick bite - this is well-documented stuff. A nut allergy is certainly not out of the question.

Although, that makes me wonder - there didn't used to be a widespread problem with nut allergies. Either the kids died from it early, or something has changed. Given that you developed an allergy, I wonder if it's some sort of bacteria rather than a particular insect bite.

Could explain the number of cases... rather than some vaccine being responsible.

originally posted by: InverseLookingGlass
Disclaimer: The source for this post is my personal experience. Take it for what it is. I am informed. I claim the right of medical consent.

They are making "winners" daily --or so they think.

I'm honestly not trolling here and I agree that there should be consent but just think of this.

I bet there were tens of thousands of kids that would have wished they had the opportunity of having a polio vaccine before suffering paralysis or worse...death.

All vaccines are clearly evil.

originally posted by: WhiteHat
Vaccines and the Peanut Allergy Epidemic

Deny ignorance by informing yourself.

That is an interesting article on vaccines being related to peanut allergies. I was never sold on the vaccines cause autism thing but I was always wondering about other potential effects and also wondered about the different ways they manufactured and synthesized vaccines. In general in theory vaccines should be safe when used appropriately, however, just like all things how is the quality control? Are there regular inspections and studies? Supposedly you guys in America are expected to give your children 60+ vaccines which is ridiculous is this number true? I looked it up for my province in Canada and its 19 expected +5 to 6 optional, that's 19 to 25 max. 60+ sounds absurd.

a reply to: Ironhawke

Look at the dates when the vaccines came out. Look at graphs marking the decline of the disease by date. At the very least it should make you wonder.


SOMETHING is causing autism, allergies, cancers, and other diseases. To immediately discount vaccines as at least being part of the issue is denying ignorance? Both sides of the debate have been caught fudging the numbers.
The fact that you can't even sue if a vaccine kills your kids doesn't make you wonder? Anytime someone forces something/anything upon me or my children it immediately sends up warning flags. People who have been vaccinated have been found to spread the very thing they are supposed to be immune to.
So sick of hearing the science is settled BS. Neither side knows for sure the long term ramifications of dozens of vaccines. Far far more serious independent study needs to be done, and for some reason we aren't getting that.

originally posted by: Raxusillian
Look at the dates when the vaccines came out. Look at graphs marking the decline of the disease by date. At the very least it should make you wonder.


SOMETHING is causing autism, allergies, cancers, and other diseases. To immediately discount vaccines as at least being part of the issue is denying ignorance? Both sides of the debate have been caught fudging the numbers.
The fact that you can't even sue if a vaccine kills your kids doesn't make you wonder? Anytime someone forces something/anything upon me or my children it immediately sends up warning flags. People who have been vaccinated have been found to spread the very thing they are supposed to be immune to.
So sick of hearing the science is settled BS. Neither side knows for sure the long term ramifications of dozens of vaccines. Far far more serious independent study needs to be done, and for some reason we aren't getting that.

How can vaccines cause peanut allergies? I do read all sorts of sites, not just reputable ones, and I remember reading (I think it was Natural news) that vaccines cause peanut allergy because they contain peanut oil, and that's not true, peanut oil is not listed anywhere in any vaccine... and why would they hide it? They tell us they contain aborted fetus cells and formaldehyde, why would they hide peanut oil?

I think allergies are on the rise because people are wrecking their immune systems in many ways: by not giving their kids proper meals cooked from scratch and they only feed them rubbish, by abusing antibiotics, by not letting children play and get dirty outside, by cleaning too much, etc. Allergies are on the rise because of 'missing microbes' in our lives!! BOOK
Also, a great site: LINK

Cancer.... there is a very simple explanation for the rise in cancer rates, see my post here: www.abovetopsecret.com...

a reply to: Raxusillian

I agree about the "something" bit...but to immediately say it's vaccines, yet discount things like artificial food additives, pollution, higher sugar consumption, prevalence of toxins such as nicotine, pharmaceuticals one takes for the side effects of other drugs, illicit drug use, as well as good old genetic roulette is like coming upon several dead bodies and immediately saying they were killed by animals. I agree, more studies should be done. But you cannot deny vaccines have played a part in eliminating certain childhood diseases, just as you cannot deny the timing of the resurgence of said diseases with the virulent explosion of the anti-vaxxer movement.

originally posted by: halfmask
That is an interesting article on vaccines being related to peanut allergies. I was never sold on the vaccines cause autism thing but I was always wondering about other potential effects and also wondered about the different ways they manufactured and synthesized vaccines. In general in theory vaccines should be safe when used appropriately, however, just like all things how is the quality control? Are there regular inspections and studies?

Yes. There is continuous monitoring of adverse effects (even made-up ones reported to VAERS), and the government funds research into the same.

Supposedly you guys in America are expected to give your children 60+ vaccines which is ridiculous is this number true?

No, it's not true. See for yourself.

a reply to: ChiefD If what you say is true, and if vaccines work so well, then the only folks that have to worry are the ones that are not vaccinated. So what's the worry?

a reply to: pointessa

en.wikipedia.org...

a reply to: Ironhawke

Oh don't misunderstand. I'm not just saying it's only vaccines. I tend to think it's the combination of our bodies being bombarded with all of the artificial crap.
I think to just dismiss one thing out of hand because we are told to is not so smart.

a reply to: FurvusRexCaeli

I call BS on the proper monitoring of side effects. Go back and read my anecdote. I was totally blown off by my pediatrician/his nurse and told that being 'fussy' was totally normal. I'm no alarmist, but there was something definitely wrong with my baby after the DTaP. I had to INSIST that they put it down as an adverse reaction in his chart AND send a report to VAERS. I could tell, even over the phone, that the nurse didn't really give a crap. So I doubt she reported it as she should.

How many more are like me? How many had a baby screaming bloody murder for several hours and didn't even try to report it? Maybe Jackson screaming WAS just normal 'fussy'....but according to research- that I had to do on my own- it could have very well been encephalitis. There would be no way to know without an MRI at the time of the inflammation. And a subsequent dose of whatever he was reacting to could have made it worse. Maybe, maybe not. But I'm not taking that chance. My son is a beautiful, happy, energetic, intelligent guy and I intend to keep it that way. I'll take whooping cough over brain damage any day.

a reply to: FurvusRexCaeli

PS The government also funds pay outs to families suffering from adverse vaccine reactions...that's right, a government branch designed for this one purpose: to bypass the court system. That right there should send up major red flags.

originally posted by: ladyvalkyrie
a reply to: FurvusRexCaeli

I call BS on the proper monitoring of side effects. Go back and read my anecdote.

Why? When did anecdotes get promoted over data? Let's say your anecdote is true, that you had a bad nurse or pediatrician or whatever. What about the millions of other data points that are generated every year? Are they all due to bad nurses and pediatricians? All over the world? Every hospital, from New York to New Delhi, is staffed with really bad doctors and nurses; all the government, academic, NGO, and industry surveillance systems are worthless, but you've got it all figured out, because you have an anecdote, right? Your child was crying a lot after getting his first shot, and the internet said he had encephalitis, and for this reason we should all pay attention to your anecdote instead of millions upon millions of cases analyzed continuously by MDs and PhDs who do this for a living, right?

My son is a beautiful, happy, energetic, intelligent guy and I intend to keep it that way. I'll take whooping cough over brain damage any day.

Human beings are very bad at estimating risk. That's why we need data, to quantify risk.

Risk of infant encephalopathy due to pertussis: 4 out of 1,000

Risk of infant encephalopathy linked to pertussis vaccination: up to 0.0 to 10.5 per 1,000,000 doses

Since we're looking at infants (12 months and younger), we have to consider that each individual will receive three doses of DTaP. Assuming each dose carries the maximum assessed risk, we are looking at 0.032 cases of encephalopathy per 1,000 immunized infants. This is in contrast to 4 cases of encephalopathy per infant pertussis case. If Dr. Internet's diagnosis of your son's vaccine reaction is wrong, he is at a 100x greater risk of encephalopathy from pertussis than from the vaccine. (Not to mention all the other fun things that come with pertussis!) How confident are you in Dr. Internet's diagnosis?

Oh, while we're talking about fun things, let's look at death:

Risk of infant death due to pertussis: 16 per 1,000

Risk of infant death linked to pertussis vaccine: zero

I don't expect you to change your mind, but fence-sitters do read exchanges like this, and I want them to engage the data. Then they can decide which they trust more, science or emotional appeals from anecdotes.

a reply to: ladyvalkyrie

And it's limited and the people responsible will never be help responsible

a reply to: FurvusRexCaeli

I'm saying for every adverse reaction reported....how many go unreported? Deaths due to pertussis vaccine=0? Maybe because there are deaths attributed to sudden onset seizures or encephalitis or SIDS even....which were actually caused/exacerbated by the vaccine/vaccine components. Which takes us back to under-reporting. Or as the OP was pointing out- what if there's a correlation between vaccines and peanut allergies? When a kid dies of said allergy it would never be attributed to vaccines, when in reality it was.

If you'll read my post you'll see I'm 100% pro-vaccine. My point is- lets just be open and honest about it. Let the rabid pro-vaccine side (including docs and pharma) openly acknowledge the risks and take steps to reduce those risks. As opposed to settling for collateral damage in their pursuit for sales and herd immunity. ONE adverse reaction is too much when that ONE is YOUR child.

No one should be forced to do it- by holding education hostage or by any other means- because $20 or$20,000 or even $2,000,000 will never be enough to compensate you for the death of your child because of some thing the government forces on you.

The CDC recommended schedule is rigoddamndiculous. Hepatitis vaccine at birth???? Even if no one in the family is infected? And even if they were, the vaccine is only 40% effective?

I waited 6 months to do the first vaccine and I'm doing them one at a time until I know which ones can be tolerated. For any on-the-fencers: THIS is what I chose, and it seems like a reasonable approach. Not blanket acceptance, not blanket rejection.

a reply to: ladyvalkyrie

I do the same. Very spread out, wait to see if any reactions for a few weeks or months then next one.... They try to force me to to do more, so I say I just won't do any then, they usually back off pretty quick