Cops manhandle teens at Dallas pool party after complaints from neighbors

originally posted by: texasgirl
I'm sorry, but I have many friends and clients in the Craig Ranch area and I don't see racism at all. They don't see it, either. It's middle/high class area but the people I know are white, black and hispanic. They're all lovely and get along. They're neighbors who invite eachother to parties. I know, I've been to these parties.

Please don't point the racist finger at Mckinney Craig Ranch.

My husband lived for several years in the DFW area, and knew a guy from McKinney (I don't know what part), who he states was "uncomfortable around blacks. He knew others who knew people there, and the consensus was that everyone considered it a very racist area overall. Maybe not all there are/were that way, but a lot of people saw it. And trust me, my husband will call out fake racism claims, and the like, very quickly, and see it when it's coming from the the direction as well.

Your friends can be quite wonderful people, and there could still be others int eh area that aren't. Chances are, your friends might not know the others.

Here, it seems some kids might have sneaked in, but the response was against race, instead of just that, and the cop here was very out of control. Once the kids were out of the pool area, they should simply have been allowed to leave. Wasn't that the goal?

I spent some years in Texas myself, and I don't consider the whole state "racist". Far from it. There are some everywhere, though, and often that type finds an area in which to congregate together. I grew up in the South, and the people we had as friends weren't concerned about race. Some were, though. Some from both sides.

In this case, I suspect there was some racial element involved. I don't assume that's the case, in most such claims, but it feels like it is here.

Either way, that cop was WAY out of line.

a reply to: ghaleon12

I say fire the cop deny his pension. Give him a criminal record and force him to see a psychiatrist so he can get the help he needs to address his deep seated pathologies so he doesnt go around assaulting people or is ever put into any profession where he might be in a position if authority hes obviously not capable of handling the responsibility of.

Also the cops who were herevand witnessed this assault should be punished for not arresting the cop. Hopefully they at least reported his illegal activity if not they are complicent in a federal offense- concealing a crime.

a reply to: FraggleRock

The party was also advertised on social media.

Twitter

originally posted by: Pimpish
From the video it seems pretty clear that most of the officers on the scene reacted appropriately while one thug decided he was going to take it a bit further. Only the one officer is really going crazy, the others seem like they're just doing their jobs.

You'd think if this situation were as volatile as this officer clearly thought it was, we'd see more officers acting similar. But it's like you've pointed out, he is the only officer on scene acting like a complete lunatic. Makes it even more bizarre that people would defend his actions when other officers were perfectly able to conduct themselves in such a manner that didn't require them to start assaulting teenage girls. This was one bad cop cussing out and prepared to attack anyone who didn't immediately comply.

a reply to: BASSPLYR

Yes, because trying to arrest somebody wearing body armor and multiple tools of varying lethality at hand is a super good idea.

Somebody could've said something to try and get him to throttle back. Then again he's a sergeant (I think, unless I've got the officers involved mixed up) and the others were patrolmen. Any admonishment given would've likely not been well received.

ETA - can you also cite the US code for "concealing a crime" too?

When the obviously adult male tried to approach the cops right hip I can only assume he was going for the firearm.

Being as the cop was surrounded I bet he was thinking the same thing.

As fast as the male ran when the cop spotted him I further assume he knew the cop knew his plan.

That is why the firearm was drawn. That individual escalated this event by making a play for the firearm. I am sure that will be used in the officers defense as well.

He didn't brandish the weapon. He secured it and then holstered it when it was the situation warranted it.

When anyone is told to leave a scene five times and they still continue to talk ^$%# to the cop, they simply do not get to leave the scene any more. The more you resist arrest the worse your treatment gets.

The cop explained it fairly well at the end of the video "you could have done what I told you and stayed in place.You ran like the others but you got caught. When you ran you became part of the mob and that's a crime".

As far as comparing American police to cops in the UK, why bother? They run from criminals and if it's a really bad situation they call cops with guns. Key point - guns are eventually called if the situation is bad enough. America Just cuts down on the wait time a little bit.

originally posted by: Dimithae
a reply to: LadyGreenEyes
Okay now watch this part again starting at 2:34,he is telling the guys sitting down what they did wrong yes? And there is a group of girls standing on the sidewalk and the one is running her mouth.Look at what she is wearing,it is the SAME outfit of the girl her finally AFTER several times warning her about her mouth,then grabs and throws down.

She wasn't making threats. She has a right to freedom of speech. I have watched the video more than once, and she didn't do anything to warrant arrest. She was released with no charges, as well. That says a lot.

originally posted by: Dimithae
Now watching from this point, :49 you see that indeed the police did tell 'some' of the kids to leave.But others that they wanted to question were told to stay and they didn't. That is the problem.They wanted to talk to certain kids,but they decided to do what they wanted.
*snip*
Did she go to him when he told her too? Did she lay down so he could hand cuff her? That is called resisting arrest. It doesn't matter whether you or I or the pope like it or not. When you are told by the police to come here,you do it. If you are told to shut up,YOU DO IT. She choose to challenge. She lost. The more you try to fight with the police to keep from being put on the ground and hand cuffed,the more you are resisting arrest. It does not help your case.

Unless you are under arrest for a crime, you are under no leal obligation to obey any and all orders from the police. The can't demand you to sit, or stand, or stay, and arrest you when you don't, if you didn't commit some crime. Note, not listening to them when you did nothing wrong is not a crime. link, and thanks to Pimpish for sharing this one

originally posted by: Dimithae
Yes after the cops had to chase them down and call for back up.At the beginning they could have complied and dealt with only one cop,and it would have been no big deal. He would have told those that didn't belong there to go,and when they left,it would have been over. But that didn't happen. They decided to do what they wanted. These kids had ALREADY been told by the people that lived there several times to go,and had refused. That was a private pool for the residents, not a public pool.

The goal was for them to leave, right? They left, and now that's wrong, too? I guess this isn't a free country after all,a nd we are slaves to the police.

originally posted by: Dimithae
Hold up there,you expect me to believe that if a neighbor came over to your home and was threatening bodily harm to you,that you would just chalk it up to their free speech? Give me a break. Unless you planned on going out there and hurting them yourself,you would be on the phone to the police so fast it wouldn't be funny. And you would EXPECT the police to do something about it. That is exactly what happened in this circumstance. If she would not have thought she could take on the world,she would not have got her self into such trouble. Too bad so sad. Next time do as your told and stop threatening people.

You said she was arrested for mouthing off at the cop, not for the threats. Had it been for the threats, they should have arrested her right off, instead of after she said something they didn't like. Make up your mind here.

As for the other, if someone came to my house making threats, no, I wouldn't need to call the police. The right to self defense doesn't require the police. By the way, cop friends of my mom said the same thing.

originally posted by: Dimithae
Look again at the video. At 3:17 you see the cop is trying to get her on the ground and not one,not two,but three people try to step in,if you keep watching you will see several more,that is until the other cops jump in.At 3:23 He finally pulls his gun after having to kick someone back away from him and chase both him and another guy.

“One may come to the aid of another being unlawfully arrested, just as he may where one is being assaulted, molested, raped or kidnapped. Thus it is not an offense to liberate one from the unlawful custody of an officer, even though he may have submitted to such custody, without resistance.” (Adams v. State, 121 Ga. 16, 48 S.E. 910).

Your Right of Defense Against Unlawful Arrest

Clear enough yet? She had a right to stand on a public street and speak. His actions were not lawful arrest. And, no, I don't see him having to chase anyone away from his attack on that teenager. He sits on her for several minutes, too. What was that all about? I can guess.

originally posted by: Dimithae
Now I stand by my prior statement on this. I think both this one cop and the kids both reacted wrong to this situation. I don't know what video YOU watched,but this one tells me that there were quite a few that didn't do what they were supposed to that day. Some of these kids were NOT invited,and had been let in by others. I have lived in apartment complexes before and they have rules on how many friends you can invite in at one time. Now if you want to have a big party,you have to make prior arrangements with the manager and they shut down the pool for you and your party,but otherwise,no.

The cop was definitely in the wrong. Most in the thread agree there. Not all, sadly, but most. The kids? Some, it's stated, sneaked over the fence, but we aren't told how many. Fighting broke out, but we aren't told who started it. The only video I can see (linked somewhere in the thread) shows a hair-pulling bout, and no one here can figure out who is pulling, if not both, or who started it, since the video clip doesn't show that. I do know that the woman involved didn't seem to be trying to back up, and the teenager did seem to be. We don't know, though, who was invited, and how many were approved. We don't know how many the cops arrested were invited, or not. You can have parties some places without it being shut down, and I have never seen an issue with that.

originally posted by: Dimithae
The only other thing I can say is,if you see several people coming at you at one time,and you spend time trying to figure out if they mean you harm? Your already done for. Cops are trained to NEVER let people put their hands on them. They can end up dead doing that. They worry about your intent later.

Read that above quote again. If his arrest was unlawful, which it was by all indications so far, they had a right to come to her aid. She clearly needed aid. A fourteen-year-old in a bikini, pinned and sat on by a male cop, for several minutes?? Cop or not, that's wrong.

a reply to: 200Plus

When anyone is told to leave a scene five times and they still continue to talk ^$%# to the cop, they simply do not get to leave the scene any more. The more you resist arrest the worse your treatment gets.

If you're being told to leave then you're clearly not under arrest and obviously cannot possibly be resisting arrest.

originally posted by: Pimpish
a reply to: texasgirl

I have been responding to those who are claiming that McKinney is racist. I've just not seen that.

With all due respect, if you're white, and I'm guessing you are (maybe I'm racist?), then you really have no idea. Of course you aren't going to have to deal with racism in a predominantly white neighborhood if you're white...



I'm not saying the area is racist, and in fact I tend to agree with you based on some real estate pages I was reading. Based on that it seems to be a somewhat diverse area without too many racism issues. Of course, that's the people, and not the cops.



I'm just making my point that if you're white and hanging out with white people, you just really don't know how other people are treated. Generally most racist people deep down know it's wrong and will hide it from other people from the same race unless they're of the same mind. At least, from my experience.

Yes, I'm white, sigh...but I have black, asian and hispanic friends.I also dated a guy in my neighborhood who was half white and half black. We all get along. My clients are white, black, hispanic and asian, too. I've been to their barbecues and other parties. This isn't just one neighborhood. These clients live in all different neighborhoods of McKinney. I'm just not seeing it. Neighbors wave and say hello here. We all talk while waiting in line at stores, restaurants, etc...

I just hate it when there's an 'incident' and automatically someone claims that this particular city is racist. It simply isn't true. Yes, there might a couple of people in a neighborhood who are racist but it isn't the norm here. People need to stop painting a town they know nothing about as racist.

originally posted by: texasgirl

originally posted by: Pimpish
a reply to: texasgirl

Someone else in the thread seems to have had different experiences there.

Her husband lived in the DFW area and doesn't say he lived in McKinney. Just says he had friends who live there and say it's racist.

And the statement "No blacks live there?" People from ALL races live in McKinney and Craig Ranch.

When he was there, it was pretty white. That was some years back, to be fair, and things could have changed. He moved from that area in '92. I know, when I was in Texas, one place we lived was almost totally white. Literally. No one there seemed to care one way or the other; it just seemed to be that way then. I'd never seen that before, growing up in the Southeast. It was a little weird to me, enough that I noticed.

a reply to: bigfatfurrytexan

They act the same way in gym clothes at the gym. Matter fact....I totally understand why Texas would be painted a red hostile state by Jade Helm 15. Like a bunch of bubba Nazis that worship war, israel, baseball, bar b q, apple pie, NFL, boobies, and white jesus under one tent. spooky folk.

I feel a SCHWARTZ(Sort of a Jewish/Christian/Nazi SWAT thingy) coming considering the presence in my neighborhood and the very well timed HELO flyovers...LEO and Military.

a reply to: texasgirl

As I said, I looked up some information on the area and I agree with you that it seems to be a somewhat diverse area with few, if any, racism issues. That's the people though, not the cops. Not knowing what was said on whatever call was made to the cops, it's hard to say, but it sure seems coincidental that every single person you can see being detained in the video is black, or at least, not white.

Of course, if they got a call that specifically called out a black person, then that would explain that, since if the suspect they're looking for is black they're obviously not looking for white people. Unfortunately no information has been released on the phone call, as far as I've been able to find.

I also think the information I posted earlier that seems to show the officer in questions youtube playlist is quite telling.

originally posted by: LadyGreenEyes

originally posted by: texasgirl

originally posted by: Pimpish

a reply to: texasgirl



Someone else in the thread seems to have had different experiences there.

Her husband lived in the DFW area and doesn't say he lived in McKinney. Just says he had friends who live there and say it's racist.



And the statement "No blacks live there?" People from ALL races live in McKinney and Craig Ranch.

When he was there, it was pretty white. That was some years back, to be fair, and things could have changed. He moved from that area in '92. I know, when I was in Texas, one place we lived was almost totally white. Literally. No one there seemed to care one way or the other; it just seemed to be that way then. I'd never seen that before, growing up in the Southeast. It was a little weird to me, enough that I noticed.

Yes, things have come a long way since 1992. McKinney is a nice place. Not as good as Frisco, in my opinion, but nice. LOL.

a reply to: Shamrock6

First off shamrock I like you, and your posts. You seem like one if the few decent LEOs out there. But what you just said perfectly illuminates the problem with the current LEO paradigm. You just Saud they can't do anything against him If he's doing anything illegal because he's your supervisor and it would damage your fitreps and career. Basically you said their only real option is to cover for the dirty cop. Essentailly turn a knowing blind eye to illegal activity and crime - wgmich would be a felony. Basically you said by default almost all cops on the force are felons guilty of being complicent to and aiding a federal offense being commited.

See the problem. It's really bad actually.

Also you tacitly said of course the cops aren't going to go after a larger crime going on, besides the other guy has got body armorvand a gun too. What are We supposed to do about it, our jobs? Naw, were going to target the weakest most unable to defend themselves individual like a predator taking down the weakest victim. See how pathalogical that is? See why the rest of the civilized world doesn't see anything civilized about deeply pathalogical people commiting human rights violations at a whim and getting away with it.

originally posted by: Greathouse
You should comply with police commands .

No.

They are not in my chain of command nor did I swear any oath of loyalty to them.

They seem to think that are Gods and I have flushed better than them.

originally posted by: LadyGreenEyes

originally posted by: Dimithae
a reply to: LadyGreenEyes
Okay now watch this part again starting at 2:34,he is telling the guys sitting down what they did wrong yes? And there is a group of girls standing on the sidewalk and the one is running her mouth.Look at what she is wearing,it is the SAME outfit of the girl her finally AFTER several times warning her about her mouth,then grabs and throws down.

She wasn't making threats. She has a right to freedom of speech. I have watched the video more than once, and she didn't do anything to warrant arrest. She was released with no charges, as well. That says a lot.

And yet, right there in the state of Texas, we have Houston v Hill, a somewhat similar situation, wherein the city of Houston decided that they could arrest you for not shutting up when a cop told you to shut up:

"The Houston ordinance is much more sweeping than the municipal ordinance struck down in Lewis. It is not limited to fighting words nor even to obscene or opprobrious language, but prohibits speech that "in any manner . . . interrupt[s]" an officer.10 The Constitution does not allow such speech to be made a crime.11 The freedom of individuals verbally to oppose or challenge police action without thereby risking arrest is one of the principal characteristics by which we distinguish a free nation from a police state"

That little gem? It's from the Supreme Court. Who ruled that you do NOT, indeed, have to shut up when a Texas cop says to.

eta: If Texas LEOs don't know that, then they're incompetent. If they do and arrest you for not shutting up when they say, then they're criminals in costumes, posing as LEOs.

Either way, if Officer Jackass is shown to be in the wrong, and his on-scene buddies are competent to KNOW that he's in the wrong, and they had time to stop him and did not, then they've failed their legal duty to intervene. All of them should be suspended.

a reply to: VforVendettea

You're right only smart people should comply with police commands. But if you think it's worth getting beat up or shot over by all means exercise your right .

a reply to: LadyGreenEyes

Excellent, excellent link there btw. Know your right people. The current LEO paradigm makes a living circumventing your rights hoping you dont know any better about the fact you are being wronged while at the same time commiting multiple felonies to hide said wrongdoing. It's systemic and it needs to change. Before the most embarrassing thing about our country becomes our largely criminal LEO community.

originally posted by: texasgirl

originally posted by: LadyGreenEyes
When he was there, it was pretty white. That was some years back, to be fair, and things could have changed. He moved from that area in '92. I know, when I was in Texas, one place we lived was almost totally white. Literally. No one there seemed to care one way or the other; it just seemed to be that way then. I'd never seen that before, growing up in the Southeast. It was a little weird to me, enough that I noticed.

Yes, things have come a long way since 1992. McKinney is a nice place. Not as good as Frisco, in my opinion, but nice. LOL.

That's a good thing. Seems possible, though, that some racism is still around, if the claims of the teens about "Section 8 housing" are true. Most of Texas is pretty nice, I know. I spent, as I said, years there. West and South Texas, in my case, but it isn't like some want to paint it, with most of the state being white, BBQ-worshiping types, whatever that even means. I completely understand your response. I get annoyed when people try to pain the whole South as "backwoods, inbred, redneck, racist, uneducated", and so forth. Hear that all the time! No worries, in any case. I completely get your point. Just sharing what he knew from his years in the area. Long time back, though, as I said!

originally posted by: Pimpish
a reply to: texasgirl



As I said, I looked up some information on the area and I agree with you that it seems to be a somewhat diverse area with few, if any, racism issues. That's the people though, not the cops. Not knowing what was said on whatever call was made to the cops, it's hard to say, but it sure seems coincidental that every single person you can see being detained in the video is black, or at least, not white.



Of course, if they got a call that specifically called out a black person, then that would explain that, since if the suspect they're looking for is black they're obviously not looking for white people. Unfortunately no information has been released on the phone call, as far as I've been able to find.



I also think the information I posted earlier that seems to show the officer in questions youtube playlist is quite telling.

My response to you was from the white person hanging out with only white people part of your post, which doesn't apply to me. My second paragraph in my post was not addressing you specifically, just a frustration about a town being unfairly labeled racist.