Russia puts Fear in U.S.A.

You do silence people and can under the new patriot act.
You dont need walls, you just need authority.
Your country's intel agencies are baised in thier review of iraq's WMD.

We don't silence anyone under the Patriot Act. You can still find reporters talking out about Bush, and the Patriot Act, and anything else they want. The Patriot Act has been blown completely out of proportion.

And no, our intelligence agencies were not biased when it came to Iraq. If they were, then so were all of the other intelligence agencies in the world saying the same thing. That includes Russia, France, the UK, and everyone else.

America's intelligence agency was only saying the same thing all of the other intelligence agencies, and the UN were saying.

The media is focussed on america and barely reports on anything outside its boundries.

America's media doesn't focus anymore on America then Europe does about Europe.

Originally posted by Disturbed Deliverer
We don't silence anyone under the Patriot Act. You can still find reporters talking out about Bush, and the Patriot Act, and anything else they want. The Patriot Act has been blown completely out of proportion.

I dont think it has, there is the odd rogue ones but the mojority is a diffrent story.

And no, our intelligence agencies were not biased when it came to Iraq. If they were, then so were all of the other intelligence agencies in the world saying the same thing. That includes Russia, France, the UK, and everyone else.

Hell yeah british one was!
We put him into power!
Hell MI6 said they sexed up the report.

America's intelligence agency was only saying the same thing all of the other intelligence agencies, and the UN were saying.

Uhh the UN said there where no weapons there and hadnt found any.

America's media doesn't focus anymore on America then Europe does about Europe.

Oh i can assuare you it does, the news today i saw had 2 peieces of our news, the weather and a talk about some stupid political thing but the most part was about the disaster in the indian ocean.
American news while i was there comprised of reports from inside the pentagon , war in iraq and the washington sniper.

I dont think it has, there is the odd rogue ones but the mojority is a diffrent story.

Please, tell me what exactly you don't like about the Patriot Act.

Hell yeah british one was!
We put him into power!
Hell MI6 said they sexed up the report.

The 9/11 Commission and Butler Report were government whitewashes to try and restore faith after all the no WMD claims started.

Uhh the UN said there where no weapons there and hadnt found any.

Not true at all. The UN found illegal weapons in Iraq. The UN passed resolutions stating that Saddam was in violation of sanctions. The disagreement came that the UN wanted more resolutions before war.

Oh i can assuare you it does, the news today i saw had 2 peieces of our news, the weather and a talk about some stupid political thing but the most part was about the disaster in the indian ocean.
American news while i was there comprised of reports from inside the pentagon , war in iraq and the washington sniper.

Wait, your experience with American media is when the sniper was running around shooting people? Of course there wasn't much on foreign news at that time.

The news coverage of the tsunami has been constant.

Originally posted by cyberdude78

Amerikkkanns

I sure hope that you've figured out that your horrible spelling isn't helping your credibility.

Labeling the US as murdering Zionists, and "Great Satan" isn't helping the articles credibility. Really, the article says that Venezula just got Mig-29s with plasma stealth. Nobodies even sure if plasma stealth is real, and Mig-29s definatly aren't suited for plasma stealth. This is one of the most biased articles I've ever seen. I sure hope that the author remembers his pills.

This is the kind of propaganda and

that nobody likes taking up server space.

the writer wasnt calling USA the great satan.. he was refferring to the jews who invaded isreal... And yes its true, zionists have taken over the USA...

and yes a lot of peopel hate the USA (inlcluding me) but we dont hate YOU, we hate your goverment, its not your faults, your fed bs thru the media on a weekly basis (which anyone can prove by searching on the net)

Its just so sad you people dont open your eyes to the crimes your country comits, before its too late.

Originally posted by Disturbed Deliverer
Please, tell me what exactly you don't like about the Patriot Act.

What i do or do not like about it is not important.
Tell me what is good about it?

The 9/11 Commission and Butler Report were government whitewashes to try and restore faith after all the no WMD claims started.

No they where real reports about what really happened.

Not true at all. The UN found illegal weapons in Iraq. The UN passed resolutions stating that Saddam was in violation of sanctions. The disagreement came that the UN wanted more resolutions before war.

What a ton of ore?
A rogue toxin shell!

Wait, your experience with American media is when the sniper was running around shooting people? Of course there wasn't much on foreign news at that time.

THERE WAS A WAR ON!
Just cause one guy is running around with a sniper rifle killing people in one state doesnt mean they need to splash it across the news!
Britain had a violent stabber in london but it didnt get much news attention on the TV.

The news coverage of the tsunami has been constant.

Thats cause its the most massive thing that has happened in decades.

I think we have all forgotten what this topic is really about.

This topic was started to discuss this web page:
www.vialls.com...

Not whose military was stronger and who has done worse on the battlefield.

On a side note, What I would find really funny about this topic would be that if SiberianTiger's whole point in making this discussion was to cause tiffs between the members.

Originally posted by P Amaru


the writer wasnt calling USA the great satan.. he was refferring to the jews who invaded isreal... And yes its true, zionists have taken over the USA...

and yes a lot of peopel hate the USA (inlcluding me) but we dont hate YOU, we hate your goverment, its not your faults, your fed bs thru the media on a weekly basis (which anyone can prove by searching on the net)

Its just so sad you people dont open your eyes to the crimes your country comits, before its too late.

I think the key character of "brain-washed" person is that this person automatically assumes his government is equal to his country or his people and equal to him. So whatever you say or criticize about his government, he is going to take it personally.

That is what communists did years ago------and we see the same thing happening in America. As many people predicted: America will implode before others defeat it. Right start from the person like him.
While, it is not surprising, after all, they are offspring of peasants and farmers. They have been dominating this world for several years already and they obviously cannot take this responsibility anymore based on their own intelligence.

And, 50 years empire for USA, no, in fact only 15 years shall be counted after Soviet Union died in 1989�..Plus maybe 15-20 more years.........then, 40 years empire...maybe the shortest empire in human history.

Sigh...peasants, shall just be peasants. Being like a king is too much burden

What do you guys think about it?






[edit on 1-1-2005 by proteinx]

No one in history will recall the Soviets. No one will consider them any threat to America's power in the world.

No one would consider a nation where their people starved, and desperately tried to escape on par with America.

I don't like the Patriot Act because it restricts your rights in certain ways, but that is no different from what the United Nations has been trying to pull either (world taxes, riiiiight). And a world government.

Originally posted by Broadsword20068
I don't like the Patriot Act because it restricts your rights in certain ways, but that is no different from what the United Nations has been trying to pull either (world taxes, riiiiight). And a world government.

Patriot act is the turning point of American history. Democrazy legend died and stoopid dying empire either is going to destroy the world or destroy itself.

Originally posted by Disturbed Deliverer
No one in history will recall the Soviets. No one will consider them any threat to America's power in the world.

In case we are not talking to a kid, ask you a simple question:

what date is the American independence day?



Hope you wont say it is the year A.D zero.

Originally posted by Disturbed Deliverer
No one in history will recall the Soviets. No one will consider them any threat to America's power in the world.

No one would consider a nation where their people starved, and desperately tried to escape on par with America.

On the contrary the soviets stand for something that can match the american imperialistic might...They are idolised by more than you may lead yourself to believe..
On the other hand america is looked upon and will be remembered as the 'world bully' flexing its muscles whereevr it sees fit...The infamous nature of the soviets during the cold war has been adopted by the americans a the dawn of the new millenium...

P.S.: And another thing, I was reading about news coverage for the tsunami...and I noticed something....there is a vast difference between the number of bodies displayed on western news networks for 9/11 and the tsunami..I wonder why..

[edit on 2-1-2005 by Daedalus3]

Patriot act is the turning point of American history. Democrazy legend died and stoopid dying empire either is going to destroy the world or destroy itself.

It destroyed democracy? I guess that's why we still have a free market, free speech, and free elections.

On the contrary the soviets stand for something that can match the american imperialistic might...They are idolised by more than you may lead yourself to believe..
On the other hand america is looked upon and will be remembered as the 'world bully' flexing its muscles whereevr it sees fit...The infamous nature of the soviets during the cold war has been adopted by the americans a the dawn of the new millenium...

I don't care who idolizes the Soviets. They'll be remembered like Carthage is compared to Rome, only without their Hannibal.

America has not changed since the fall of the Soviets. Europeans have, though. The Western world was united against the Soviets, without them there's a power gap, and now Europe is hoping to fill it, pitting itself against America.

You can entertain yourselves all you want with the thought of America collapsing, but you won't live to see it.

WE don't care what you care or don't care about.The answer lies in numbers. And unlike the pat where history was only written by the victorious we live in an age where pro american literature is at its all time low. Face it the majoority of the ppl on this planet dislike america, so don;t go off shooting about the soviets..

WE don't care what you care or don't care about.The answer lies in numbers. And unlike the pat where history was only written by the victorious we live in an age where pro american literature is at its all time low. Face it the majoority of the ppl on this planet dislike america, so don;t go off shooting about the soviets..

And what, the Romans were loved? It doesn't matter who people like. It matters who had the most impact, and who was the most powerful.

America has changed the world. The nations that want to rival us can only do so by becoming us. Russia and China has been forced to make a slow switch to capitalism, and ultimately democracy. Europe has been forced to join together to form a united Europe, just like our states.

America wouldn't even have had to become an "empire", and we'd still have been remember throughout history more then a nation like the Soviet Union. We've been changing the political landscape of the world since we won our independence.

Lets just stop the arguing against disturbed deliever, he is obviously been fed with propaganda.

The more wrong someone is, the easier it is to prove them wrong with facts.

Now, I've used facts. I've talked about Russia's history. I've given various reliable sources to back up my claims. I've explained all of my statements completely.

What have any of you done but say I'm wrong and talk about how America is no better and full of propaganda?

I answered your questions so what happend to your discrediting of what I answered?

I answered your questions so what happend to your discrediting of what I answered?

You didn't address my post, you just made a lot of statements on why Russia is better than America.

Whatever, though. I'll take care of your post.

How many Russian soilders died in WW2 Disturberd Diliverer?

What's the point of this? A lot of soldiers dying isn't usually a good thing. It's certainly not a testament to military power.

Russia held on to Afgan for 9 years with no problem 11,381 Soviet soilders K.I.A. 36,000 Wounded In Action (WIA) but Soviet Army ended up killing 1.2Million Afgahs that IS NOT getting your but kicked that is "literaly" Destroying the enemey, the soviets left becasue no matter how muh they beet the Afgahs they (The Afgahs) would not accept socialism so the only thing to do was to leave, or exterrminate the hole of Afgahistan

Sounds like Vietnam, except the Americans were a lot more limited because fo politics, and facing a tougher opponent who were greater in quantity, and had actual combat experience.

at this rate U.S.A. will lose 10,000 soilders in 3 more years, oh you know that the number of U.S. dead aint even close to 1400 it's 4000,

You have no reliable source for this claim. This is like me saying that 1 million Russians died in Afghanistan.

most of the socalled "civilian insurgents" in northern Iraq are the republican guard Pentagon doesn't want U.S. pop to know because they'll figure out latter on that the Iraqis made U.S. think they intimidated them into not fighting but in reality they ( republica Guard= R.G.) JUST QUICKLY SUCKED marines into the cities for some REAL bloody battles

I'm not sure what your point is. It has always been known that the Republican Guard chose to resort to Guerilla warfare after the war instead of fighting. This HAS been stated. I've even heard it on a channel like Fox, who you consider to be a source of propaganda.

now look on most U.S. Military site for official figure of T-72 destroyed tanks in Gulf War 1= (GW1) you'll see Hussen only had aroud 85 T-72's the other 540 tanks were old t-55/64's AND most of ALL those tanks were destroyed by antitank planes /helecopters not M1's as yank propaganda wants the world to beleive that big tank battle was not a big battle it was aroud 50 M1's vs. aroung 50-60 t-55/68's and a few T-72's

Really? This says you're wrong:

globalsecurity.org...

1000 T-72's, and 1500 T-62's during the Gulf War.

And bombing only resulted in the loss of 1500 Iraqi tanks. A-10's took out about 700 more. I'm afriad the Abrams did dominate the T-72's.

remember yank when U.S. sells it's F-14/15/16 and 18's to client state it doesn't sell it with the same avionics/radar/radarjamming devices nor does U.S.A. give client states the same type of dogfighting training that U.S.A. gives to it's own pilots, I'm sure you know that and if you don't than you now know it. So I'll refer to these client state F-14/15/16/18's radar/radar jammers avioncs tacts as "second rate planes/tactics/equipment

The militaries America aids are all top of the line militaries when it comes to arms and training.

To call the equipment America, or Russia sells to neighbors second rate is nonsense. T-72's weren't Russia's very beste tanks, but they were the backbone of the Russian tank force at the time. Selling the Iraqis the material wouldn't have been much of a threat.

NOW Russia does the EXACT same thing, now that you understand that understand that when U.S. was going up against Russian MiG's in GF1 it wasn't going up against Russian Tanks it was going up against second rate tanks and you now think you can deafet Rus hahahaha try it bring it on we have signed a Military pact with Serbia in 99 after Kosavo bombing try ANY military thing there and U.S. will see just how outdated Russia is bring it on, you have your chance now to prove to the world just attack Serbia again and I assure you with no doubt you'll be in a battle against a nation you will not defeat (Russia)

European troops are still in Kosovo. American troops were just withdrawn when Bush came into office. We've been interfering plenty in the Ukraine, and Russia seems relatively powerless other then a fail attempt at Yuschenko's life.

about Russia lossing a lot in kazan campaine Tzar Ivan had 6000 soilders and deafeated a 20,000 man Mongol army

There was no battle between Ivan and the Mongols. The only thing close was a standoff between Russian and a reminent of the Mongol empire, where no battle was actually fought, and the Mongols retreated as they saw the Russian army growing in size, and they ran out of supplies.

This wasn't an offensive, either. I said an offensive military operation.

Russia lost 8.6 Milion soilders in ww2 not 20= million the other 11.5Million were civilians that were killed/starved by nazi's Yanks like to imply that in was 27Million siolders Rus never had 27Million soilders, we lost that much because we took on the majority of hittlers army of look at the battle in the eastern front Germany concintrated most of thier forces in Russia the western front only had 5-6 Million German forces and U.S. was NOT fighting in western front by yourselves so it's not the same as what Rus was doing

America had its forces divided between the Pacific and Western front.

And by the time of D-day, half the German troops were in France.

plus Russia was not prepared for the war scince the thrice accurced commies destroyed Saint Tzar Nicholas's Army back in 1919-1922 so Rus did get caught by suprise but Rus did a major job taking on Germany and japan

Not prepared? Russia had some 5 million troops standing in the way of the Germans. Plus, there was plenty of intelligence warning of a German invasion. The Russian generals near the border themselves warned Stalin of a buildup. A German deserter even told the Russians the invasion was coming. The Russian generals could have given their troops notice at the very least no matter what Stalin thought.

And surprise only lasts so long. The Russians were forced all the way back to Moscow, and the only reason the Germans were drove back was because of the Russian winter.

The Russians had no real reason to be worried about Japan, either. The Japanese were in absolutely no position to attack, and that was painfully obvious. Stupidity isn't an excuse for not being ready.

plus U.S. did Aid Rus with a lot of equpment in return for Russia to do the hardest part of the fighting which was to take on Germany head this is the real reason U.S.A. put only 1.5Million soilders in ww2 not because U.S. has this mythilogical fighting tactics were they can use 1Million to defeat 6Million.

The Americans couldn't have handled Germany alone, but we certainly had better leadership then Russia.

Disturbed Deliverer, on what planet you live?
In ww2 on D-Day(6 June, 1944), we rushing through Europe and four-fifths of the German forces were in the East. In France, the Allies faced only about 20% of the German army. The second front, however, certainly diverted German resources, and shortened the war. Allies just feared that we take entire Europe after war. And after your landings you get hard times because Germans shortly started offence on your front and Cherchill asked us for large attack on Eastern front to save your a$$es, and we saved lifes of your soldiers.

In 1964-1968 USA lost more than 3400+ aircrafts(including 31 B-52), you killed only 345 MIG's, and only 16 russians died in this war(3 from diseases), where the hundreds you've talked about? You lost more than 58000 soldiers, yeah, you are just great.

Iraq had some of the latest and best new Russian toys.

About "latest" russian equipment in Iraq - yeah, I laugh a lot, you consider those AK-47 as latest equipment? Maybe you name what latest and best Russian toys they have? As for russian tanks, well, every idiot says that without air support, tanks - easy targets.


Now about russian history(that you does not know at all), we have more than 1000 year history of wars, it's hard to describe all of them, majority of this wars started by our opponents, other wars was preemptive, I don't start talking about all of them, because it takes much time, so I only point on some wars of XIX century in Asian Region:

1804-1813 - war with Persia - Persian army outnumbers Russian army in that region, we crushed them, Russia gains Dagestan, North Azerbaijan

1806-1812 - war with Turkey(started by them) - we capture fortresses: Isakcha, Tulcha, Badabag, Machin, Ismail, Brailov, Silstria, annexation of Besarabia. We almost destroyd their fleet in Afon battle, not a single russian ship was demaged.

1817-1864 - Caucasian wars - Russia gains Chechnya, Mountain Dagestan, North-West Caucasus, also we gain Gilan, Mazenderan, Astrabad, Karlym Kaheti we fight against Turkey and Iran, they were supported by England, France and other European countries

1826-1826 - another war with Persia(Iran) - they outnumbered us again(in 3 times) and again they lost, we gain Echmidizin, Abbasabad, Nahichevan, Tebriz, Urmin, Ardebil, after peace treaty we gets Erivan and Nahichevan khanate, East Armenia. Persian yoke over Kaukasian people eliminated.

1828-1829 - war with Turkey - well, actually we fight with european nations for control over dying Osman Empire. Greece request Russia for help to gain independence. After blitzkrieg Russian forces surround Constantinople. Turkey signed peace treaty: Russia gains Caucasian coast of Black Sea and Aholcid. Greece gained independence, Serbia, Moldova, Valahia gained autonomy from Turkey


1853-1856 - war with Osman Empire for domination in Middle East, after we destroy their fleet, England, France, Sardinia, Sweden, Austria declare war to Russia to prevent us from full domination in that region. After peace treaty Russia withdraw Black Sea fleet, only in 1870 we quit from this treaty.

1869-1887 - Russia gains all Middle Asia

1877-1878 - Russia declare war to Turkey, after this war Balkan nations granted independence from Turkey: Bulgaria freed, full independence for Romania, Serbia, Monte-Negro

That's just a small part of our wars and only in that region, we always fought with powerful enemies, not with a poor nations like you. Our military prove it's power for years.

Well, this thread getting stupid - people like Disturbed Deliverer are widespread in US, they filled with half-truths, blind patriotism built on propaganda, and total confidence that US always right. Because of such people and your policy US are being hated by the most of the world. Well, enjoy your last days on the top of the world, you are like USSR before it's falling, exactly the same situation: you allienate your allies, your economy "grows" extensively, you are in local conflict that suck dry your power, you waste your resources on crap, you maniplute your own people, and you elect this idiot for another term, oh yeah, Russia support your course to falling,we hope that you find WMD in Iran, yeah.