Serious Question: Why are so Many People Afraid/Unaccepting of Transgender People?

originally posted by: new_here
a reply to: TrappedPrincess

Is a transvestite different from transgender?
If so, in your opinion, what is the motivation for a transvestite to dress as the other gender (besides comfort of clothing perhaps.) I'm sure there are various reasons and no one knows what's in everyone else's head, but just wonder what the general consensus is on that.

I'm not sure that I would simply try to go to wikipedia or a to a Webster's Dictionary to try to understand the difference.. I think that would be too short sighted.. a Transvestite chooses alternative vestment (clothing) for personal expression.. they may or may not have an alternative sexual orientation though, there are transvestites that are 100% heterosexual..

A transgender/transsexual is someone who wishes to live in appropriate physical expression: more like a transcendental issue: they have transcended their physical body and wish to move forward evolutionarily.. this is the individual who proceeds with surgery in one form or another.

A transvestite is more elusive I think, playing gender roles, role playing generally. A transsexual or transgendered person is a little more serious about identifying with their true gender identity: hence surgery, hence new gender.

originally posted by: ImaFungi

originally posted by: TrappedPrincess
I respect your opinion but all the existential and philosophical stuff personally brings me back to what in my opinion amounts to subjective this relative that I think therefore I am but everything is Imaginary and imaginary things are real too. Basically nobody here really truly now's much when it comes to the brain much like backs a reply to: ImaFungi

In the future we will have greater technology to alter the human body;

It will always be a choice of the consciousness of the body, as to what way they think they desire their body to be altered.

It is always subjectively reasoned and reasonable; tautological (I want this to occur because I want this to occur)

It cannot be objectively reasonable. (I want this to occur, because reality beyond my desire, wants this to occur)

If the latter case, was true and the truth; Than the person would be admitting to having no free will, no control over themselves; but it must be ultimately thoughts in their mind which are produced which would force them to know that they need to and are being forced to alter themselves, that it is no choice and they have control;

So they would be admitting, that there exists in their mind, the production of thoughts, which are not their own, and which they must obey;

This is extremely interesting, the nature of which should be studied and thought about.

AAAAAAAAA.... You just made my brain hurt, LOL!

originally posted by: Krazysh0t

originally posted by: TrappedPrincess
I've often wondered that myself a reply to: new_here

This may help.

Legal aspects of transsexualism in the United States

You might want to offer some information for Transsexualism in Europe or Australia, or Canada, and Argentina, just to learn about the differences.. Wikipedia is nice, but it's certainly no authority...

I have no problem with transgender people, gay people, straight people, people who love stuffed animals, etc. Whatever YOU want to do is YOUR business.

I have a problem with it though, when it is rammed down my throat and shoved in my face. I accept you for who you are. If I like you, it is because of the person YOU are. If you tell me I "MUST" like you.. then I have a problem. (PS- this is not directed at the OP).

I never understood the big deal of TG and gay people. Who cares what they do with their lives? I'm sure they aren't sitting around wondering about heterosexuals. I think a big problem in today's society is that everyone is up in everyone elses business. Live YOUR life and stop worrying about everyone else.

a reply to: Annee

To be completely honest I don't think we will make it to six armed fire breathing people. Seems a bit of a stretch to me. You did drop some deep stuff though but again who really knows the why's of the universe.

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: TrappedPrincess

Yeah no problem. Glad I could help. Education about these things is sorely lacking and we all, including myself, need better education about this issue.

Edit: Hopefully with more knowledge and better understanding people would be more sympathetic to people such as yourself and your plights.

Take care of your personal plight then, hopefully one day, someone out there in the universe will be able to bring it my attention so that I can be better educated about things that you are affected by.. those kind of issues don't have anything to do with me though buddy..

See ya KrazyShout

a reply to: tony9802

A transgender/transsexual is someone who wishes to live in the appropriate body capsule: more like a transcendental issue: they have transcended their physical body and wish to move forward evolutionarily.. this is the individual who proceeds with surgery in one form or another.

Now this is a serious question. Please do not think I am baiting you. I promise I am not:

If 'they have transcended their physical body' then why do they feel the need to alter it?

originally posted by: DerekJR321
I have no problem with transgender people, gay people, straight people, people who love stuffed animals, etc. Whatever YOU want to do is YOUR business.

I have a problem with it though, when it is rammed down my throat and shoved in my face. I accept you for who you are. If I like you, it is because of the person YOU are. If you tell me I "MUST" like you.. then I have a problem. (PS- this is not directed at the OP).

I never understood the big deal of TG and gay people. Who cares what they do with their lives? I'm sure they aren't sitting around wondering about heterosexuals. I think a big problem in today's society is that everyone is up in everyone elses business. Live YOUR life and stop worrying about everyone else.

Is MainStreamMedia "forcing it down your throat,?" Who or what is making you feel this unusual pressure to respond in a positive way to these issues.. You should not feel pressured by anyone or anything at all, I wonder then if it might be like your University, your peers, your workplace, your newsstations that are the ones creating this type of pressure..

There's no pressure.. Just try following John Travolta a little, everything is good, no slack on me..

originally posted by: TrappedPrincess
a reply to: Annee

To be completely honest I don't think we will make it to six armed fire breathing people. Seems a bit of a stretch to me. You did drop some deep stuff though but again who really knows the why's of the universe.

Yes, who knows.

I've been traversing this current physical universe for 2 years short of 70. Been through many incarnations in the current existence. I continue to have an open mind.

Fair enough but what now? What are YOU going to do in response to all the perceived shoving of whatever it is your face? What will YOU do?a reply to: DerekJR321

originally posted by: new_here
a reply to: tony9802

A transgender/transsexual is someone who wishes to live in the appropriate body capsule: more like a transcendental issue: they have transcended their physical body and wish to move forward evolutionarily.. this is the individual who proceeds with surgery in one form or another.

Now this is a serious question. Please do not think I am baiting you. I promise I am not:

If 'they have transcended their physical body' then why do they feel the need to alter it?

Oh, that's a good point.. true transcendence would mean we no longer need carnal desire: neither flesh, nor food, nor water, and presumably that is the premise of monastic teachings.. so yes I agree, if I can conquer the desire of the flesh, that is desire for food, desire for "body" then I transcend..I can mortify the body, and reach Nirvana, etc..

In this though, there is a form of transcendence that represents gender transcendence.. I have transcended the male body, I have transcended the female body, and now I need a different type of experience.. I still wish to remain on the physical carnal realm. but I would like to learn about that experience through a difference voice, through a different subjectivity, and therefore through a different gender..

hopefully i'm making a little bit of sense.. but you are totally right, that true transcendence is a complete release of the physical dimension, preferring an entirely spiritual existence.. maybe like angels somehow.. Angels do not have gender..
that's a very good example..

originally posted by: new_here

In the future we will have greater technology to alter the human body;

It will always be a choice of the consciousness of the body, as to what way they think they desire their body to be altered.

It is always subjectively reasoned and reasonable; tautological (I want this to occur because I want this to occur)

It cannot be objectively reasonable. (I want this to occur, because reality beyond my desire, wants this to occur)

If the latter case, was true and the truth; Than the person would be admitting to having no free will, no control over themselves; but it must be ultimately thoughts in their mind which are produced which would force them to know that they need to and are being forced to alter themselves, that it is no choice and they have control;

So they would be admitting, that there exists in their mind, the production of thoughts, which are not their own, and which they must obey;

This is extremely interesting, the nature of which should be studied and thought about.

AAAAAAAAA.... You just made my brain hurt, LOL!

Oh, well I am sorry, but I am glad you quoted this because I said something a bit wrong I think.

"It cannot be objectively reasonable. (I want this to occur, because reality beyond my desire, wants this to occur)"

That is the major contention;

What I choose to want for myself.

And what is chosen to be wanted for myself.

A person who believes they are female trapped in male body;

is not saying that they want to be female;

They are saying reality wants them to be female.

And that they, are merely the messenger of realities desire, that they have no choice or control, that something beyond them selves, in their mind, is demanding that they alter their body.


It is objectively true that I want to remain living; objectively this is proven by the fact that I am remaining living;

(now I could have opposing thoughts and intentions; but objectively, I am forcing myself to remain living, thus objectively, it can be said, that I must ultimately desire to remain living; I can wonder if it is possible to be absolutely purely 50% desire to remain living and 50% desire to not; at a single moment, and what would be the result? Or if the impossibility of perfect 50 -50, produces the fact that in every moment it is only ever one or the other)

If I am standing at the bottom of a mountain, and there is a large boulder rolling directly towards me;

By virtue of the subjective and objective declaration of my desire to remain living;

Reality beyond my desire, would be forcing me to move my body, out of the path of the boulder;

In this sense; it is possible for actions to be objectively reasonable in that (I want to live, I want to move out of the way, objectively I must move out of the way to remain living, I have proved objectively to objectivity I want to remain living, reality beyond my desire, desires me to move)

Now that is sketchy and potentially wrong, even I am confused.


Here is a different example; well you see I am trying to unite the fact that aspects of subjectivity are objective, unavoidably so. Basely as in; It is objective fact, that subjectivity occurs.

The aspect of subjectivity which is ultimately hidden from objectivity, is the direct relationship between the experiencer and the realm of their experience.

No matter how hard we try with images and art and words; I cannot literally see how you see your thoughts.

But if we assume that life desires to live, because it is living, and if it truly did not desire to live, it would not be;

For example, maybe better than the boulder one;

Say I get a snake bite on my finger, and it is proven without a doubt that my finger must be removed and everyone and I agree and know it must, to prevent more damage;

The natural basic desire is not born from me; there is no reason that I want to lose my finger; but reality beyond me, is forcing me, to desire;

This is the sense in which, it is true that it is possible to go; I want this to occur, because reality wants this to occur.

Now if it really is possible, that a male exists, and in their mind, beyond their pure tautological desire (I want to do this because I want to do this because I want to do this; which is perfect and infinite reason and not reason at all at the same time; also necessary for the existence of free will, art, creation, novelty, consciousness) they cannot control at all, that they are forced by reality, to know and think and be unable to not not think, that they are a female;

Then they are claiming, that it is not their will, the 'I' of them, that thinks and chooses and desires; that wants to be female;

But that reality wants them to be female.

a reply to: honested3

I think most people have a problem because they are insecure in their sexuality. A non confident hetero male has little success with women. He views his own sexuality with awe and fear. Asking him to be open about others sexuality is too much to ask because he has yet to find peace with himself.

I will say this, I think transgender people are awesome. You guys are amazing people usually having had to deal with so much. Gay people are usually really fun to hang out with and make friends with, transgender are REAL people who life has humbled and made sincere. Transgender people are more combative if they smell negativety, but are true warriors when they need to defend others.

More power to you

originally posted by: TrappedPrincess
a reply to: Annee

To be completely honest I don't think we will make it to six armed fire breathing people. Seems a bit of a stretch to me. You did drop some deep stuff though but again who really knows the why's of the universe.

Oh it will be way beyond that. Robot bodies and such.

originally posted by: tony9802

originally posted by: new_here
a reply to: tony9802

A transgender/transsexual is someone who wishes to live in the appropriate body capsule: more like a transcendental issue: they have transcended their physical body and wish to move forward evolutionarily.. this is the individual who proceeds with surgery in one form or another.

Now this is a serious question. Please do not think I am baiting you. I promise I am not:

If 'they have transcended their physical body' then why do they feel the need to alter it?

Oh, that's a good point.. true transcendence would mean we no longer need carnal desire: neither flesh, nor food, nor water, and presumably that is the premise of monastic teachings.. so yes I agree, if I can conquer the desire of the flesh, that is desire for food, desire for "body" then I transcend..I can mortify the body, and reach Nirvana, etc..

In this though, there is a form of transcendence that represents gender transcendence.. I have transcended the male body, I have transcended the female body, and now I need a different type of experience.. I still wish to remain on the physical carnal realm. but I would like to learn about that experience through a difference voice, through a different subjectivity, and therefore through a different gender..

hopefully i'm making a little bit of sense.. but you are totally right, that true transcendence is a complete release of the physical dimension, preferring an entirely spiritual existence.. maybe like angels somehow.. Angels do not have gender..
that's a very good example..

Thank you, that makes more sense to me. I cannot fully comprehend, because I cannot relate to this need to transcend my gender (ie: have not 'walked in those shoes.) Hence it still is a foreign concept to my understanding. I say that with no disrespect. Just Truth.

Anyway, on my way to eat Wednesday Night Supper at the church, as I myself have not 'transcended' the physical realm either, LOL...

To anyone else who replied to me: Thank-you and I'm not ignoring you... I'll be back in a bit.

a reply to: ImaFungi

I don't know but I think you may be stumbling onto something. Since the word transcendence has been I dropped I will mention that I astrally projected once as a child right around the time that I really started grasping the idea of who I was inside. I also lucid dreamed a lot which I actually did intentionally at the time ( I thought it was fun until...) but I didn't know the terminology or all the deep thought behind it. I just did it.

I also prayed really hard once when I was about 11 for God not to let me die until I achieved womanhood. I have survived some pretty crazy ish let me tell you...just saying.

originally posted by: new_here
a reply to: tony9802

A transgender/transsexual is someone who wishes to live in the appropriate body capsule: more like a transcendental issue: they have transcended their physical body and wish to move forward evolutionarily.. this is the individual who proceeds with surgery in one form or another.

Now this is a serious question. Please do not think I am baiting you. I promise I am not:

If 'they have transcended their physical body' then why do they feel the need to alter it?

The act of alteration is the act of trascendence, in my opinion..

originally posted by: TrappedPrincess
a reply to: ImaFungi

I don't know but I think you may be stumbling onto something. Since the word transcendence has been I dropped I will mention that I astrally projected once as a child right around the time that I really started grasping the idea of who I was inside. I also lucid dreamed a lot which I actually did intentionally at the time ( I thought it was fun until...) but I didn't know the terminology or all the deep thought behind it. I just did it.

I also prayed really hard once when I was about 11 for God not to let me die until I achieved womanhood. I have survived some pretty crazy ish let me tell you...just saying.

What do you want out of womanhood; what does womanhood mean to you?

originally posted by: new_here

originally posted by: tony9802

originally posted by: new_here
a reply to: tony9802

A transgender/transsexual is someone who wishes to live in the appropriate body capsule: more like a transcendental issue: they have transcended their physical body and wish to move forward evolutionarily.. this is the individual who proceeds with surgery in one form or another.

Now this is a serious question. Please do not think I am baiting you. I promise I am not:

If 'they have transcended their physical body' then why do they feel the need to alter it?

Oh, that's a good point.. true transcendence would mean we no longer need carnal desire: neither flesh, nor food, nor water, and presumably that is the premise of monastic teachings.. so yes I agree, if I can conquer the desire of the flesh, that is desire for food, desire for "body" then I transcend..I can mortify the body, and reach Nirvana, etc..

In this though, there is a form of transcendence that represents gender transcendence.. I have transcended the male body, I have transcended the female body, and now I need a different type of experience.. I still wish to remain on the physical carnal realm. but I would like to learn about that experience through a difference voice, through a different subjectivity, and therefore through a different gender..

hopefully i'm making a little bit of sense.. but you are totally right, that true transcendence is a complete release of the physical dimension, preferring an entirely spiritual existence.. maybe like angels somehow.. Angels do not have gender..
that's a very good example..

Thank you, that makes more sense to me. I cannot fully comprehend, because I cannot relate to this need to transcend my gender (ie: have not 'walked in those shoes.) Hence it still is a foreign concept to my understanding. I say that with no disrespect. Just Truth.

Anyway, on my way to eat Wednesday Night Supper at the church, as I myself have not 'transcended' the physical realm either, LOL...

To anyone else who replied to me: Thank-you and I'm not ignoring you... I'll be back in a bit.

Galatians 3:28
There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond(a slave) nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus;

There is only spirit..

The universe created peace, the universe created benevolence.. the universe requests peace and benevolence in response.
We all return to spirit, we all return to one.