Vanishing houses and time slips

a reply to: destination now

Hi Dest,
I'm not far from E.Kilbride,and quite often used to pop down to Ayr for a walk round the shops.
I vaguely remember that card shop, but what an experience!!

Any ideas on what actually caused it yourself?

G

a reply to: Kandinsky

Thanks for your very interesting post. I have downloaded the Sadler interview and will view it ASAP. Circling a building or in one case a standing stone does seem to have some effect. As you certainly know, round dances are found in all cultures and I suspect form part of the lost, or at least little known, knowledge of humanity. The Russian work on torsion waves implies that all physical actions generate them, even subtle ones, so the effect of dozens of people going around must be the greater. Speculating further, cars are full of motor parts and wheels going round at high speeds, and I wonder if that is a factor in the numerous time distortions experienced by drivers. I do have a copy of Phantasms that I downloaded years ago but haven't yet read through. I will get the Lang book also.

Yes, the Kersey case, that MacKenzie studied in detail, is certainly a major incident. I hadn't seen your post on that and have downloaded that also. Dash's article attempts to dismiss it because of the unlikelihood of a village of that size having a butcher's shop, but since it was known to have had one at that very spot, I find the argument unconvincing.

a reply to: CarlGrove

I wonder what might have happened if you'd asked someone to direct you to Cardland?

Oh how I wish I did, there were people at the bus stop, loads of people milling around..and yes, as far as I remember, they were contemporary. I also wished I had a phone/camera with me, and the presence of mind to actually take a picture! But I have a clear memory of walking right up to the entrance of the Kyle Centre, and down to Scott's mensware, at the corner of the pedentstrianised, Carrick Street, all the time muttering..."What the heck has happened to Cardland?...Where the feck is it?" before convincing myself, that somehow I was mistaken and that there had never been a Cardland there at all, and I would have to, reluctantly, pay the premium price at Clintons.

There had been a lot going on in my life at that time (and still is) with various health issues etc, but whist my medication can make me feel nauseous and tired, it certainly hasn't ever produced an hallucinogenic effect, and I have never come across anything like this before (though have had a few paranormal experiences at a previous address, many years ago, before I was ill..I'm sure I've written about them on here) But I was actually quite stunned when I saw the photoshopped pic of the shops, and I am 100% certain that the high street was as depicted in the altered photo on that day.

Thank you for believing that I am not crazy (okay maybe just a little bit, but aren't we all?) Although at 47 years old, I have seen a few strange things in my time, and my mind is open to all sorts of concepts, overall I am a very pragmatic person, but this event really bothered me. In fact I had not actually told anyone else about it until I posted my story yesterday...which of course led me to having to explain it all to my daughter and her gf, although it was helpful as my daughter remembered a Clinton's card I had got her and she had privately been surprised that I'd spent that amount of money


But who knows? I just know that I walked into a familiar setting to do an everyday thing, and all was not as it seemed.

How I wish I could get an explanation, it's totally fascinating.

So do keep up with the research, who knows what you might come up with

a reply to: Gordi The Drummer

Nope, no idea at all! It's the only time anything like that has happened to me. Though strangely I didn't think time glitch/sliip etc at the time and take proper note of everything. I was just so stunned that the shop was not there that I sort of blanked out the weirdness at the time and sort of went onto automatic pilot.

go to cardland..get cheap card...uh oh..where's cardland..Hmm..maybe it's further up? Nope! maybe it's further down? Nope...feck, I. sure there was a cardland here...Hmm, was there? Hmm, maybe I'm wrong? Hmm..don't know!

Feck, gonna have to spend a fortune in Clintons..nvm..sigh

a reply to: destination now

It's fascinating that many people seem unable to face ambiguity and weirdness head on and the inner censor just takes over. My bet is that many more people have had things like this happen to them than ever report them or even accept inwardly that something really odd happened. I have had many (lesser) experiences of "coincidences" and recall mentioning one to a friend I had known since childhood. He energetically claimed that nothing like that had ever happened to him. A few days later we went up to London and wandered around the West End, when my friend (a professional pianist) spotted the world's biggest piano store. He just had to take me in to show me around and ended up looking at a big concert grand. The shop assistant came over and my friend explained that although he liked the piano he had now moved to Hong Kong (this was in the 1980s) and had to take into account the shipping costs. The assistant said it would cost about £2000 to ship the piano out there. By the way, he himself had lived for several years in Hong Kong. Where did my friend live? "Central." And where in Central? As you can guess he lived in the same tiny side street as had the shop assistant... Hong Kong is a huge city and the odds of that are small.

a reply to: LABTECH767

Hey: You really struck a chord for me, with this:

In my reality the sky was Blue, really Brue, a luminouse light blue but not the grey bluish greenish sky you now have, the sun was not white it was Golden or warm with a yellowish tinge.

I have tried to find out how it happened but unless time is circular and I have been outside the loop this is not my native reality, yes this create's a form of temporal dissassociation as I am not from this dimension or even universe which seem's to be in reality nothing less than a slightly inferior and less complex copy or even simulation of my reality but with a much less loving god and a less beautiful world governed by less than altruistic beings.

Yes to all these things you expressed so poignantly……
I, too, remember a different bible, a less punishing and judgmental paradigm, more forthright where you knew the "rules," up front. Everything seems designed as a dark trick, here.

There are portals, and they are jealously and possessively guarded. Our ability to utilize them and find our way back where we belong is controlled.

a reply to: CarlGrove

I totally agree Carl, even I would have thought nothing of it, had I not been such a regular visitor to the town, but even though I knew that the shop should have been there, I didn't conscientiously acknowledge the anomaly, preferring to assume that somehow my brain had misfired and consequently I decided to just walk away.

Ahh yes, coincidences..had many of them over the years, some rather small and others quite major, things that make you go WOW

a reply to: Kandinsky

I've been dipping into Lang's excellent book, and aside from his constant references to members of non-European ethnic groups as "savages" I seem to be in agreement with most of his comments. My personal problem with computers, arising from some eye conditions, is that I can't read a lot (e.g. a whole book) on screen -- it's easier if I print them out, which of course takes time, and now my printer has totally broken down, so I will have to get a new one ASAP. It would be worthwhile someone going back to all these old 19th C. works and systematically sifting through all the case studies, many of which are better written and more detailed than their modern equivalents. Thanks again for the reference.

a reply to: destination now

I'm thinking back to some classical psychological experiments in which people had to identify playing cards shown very briefly on a screen. After a while some of the cards appeared with the colours mismatched -- e.g. black hearts or red clubs. Some of the subjects adjusted to this rapidly but a minority grew disturbed, began to doubt that they were being shown cards, and one was reportedly hospitalised. This was in the 50s and today with all the bizarre imagery in films and TV I'm sure no-one would be at all concerned, but it does suggest that people differ in how they react to ambiguous or strange stimuli.

Hey Carl Grove:
Very interesting thread, OP.

I have experienced both of these things, though it wasn't exactly a "vanishing house." I have both seen objects and people appear and disappear. I tend to think it is a factor involving a simulation overlay on the natural existence of things, controlling these events. But I also believe in a physical reality of multiverses, separated, perhaps, by a membrane, as Kaiko and others have described, and have seen what seems like that membrane "ripped" before.

And as far as time, if we've stopped, in fact, relying upon the half life decay of nuclear active naturally occurring materials as a true passage of it, and now rely upon computers, tvs, cellphones, etc. to tell us the time, then it's totally up to some controllers of the overlay I referenced above to tell us the time, which means we really don't know it. Consider, also, the switch from the Julian Calendar long ago, t

Also, there may be still some question about neutrino affect on the decay rate and half-lie of materials….
tetra50

a reply to: tetra50

I would certainly like to hear more about your experiences!

I have no idea how these things could be explained completely in physical terms -- the virtual overlay, as you put it, seems to determine the structure of time slips and similar experiences, and yet they are clearly triggered by both physical (torsion) energies and the presence of a sensitive person. And as you get older (I'm 66 now) time certainly passes much faster. When you are young, you feel that you have lived a long time and you have almost infinite years ahead of you, but when you get to your 60s you realise your life has passed in almost an instant, and you have even less time ahead of you. If it is simulated, then the physics and energies are necessarily part of the simulation. But if it is possible to recreate the energy pattern in the lab, then could we trigger a time slip? In principle, yes, but getting all the parameters right would be very difficult.

a reply to: CarlGrove
Thanks Carl, I appreciate your response. I am somewhat wary of discussing the details of my experiences on this website, a public forum. I did some posting in a black triangle thread that I now regret, as ultimatlely certain issues in my life became worse. There is a common thread amongst UFO experiencers of the effect it has on our lives, later, in a societal sense, and otherwise.

I agree completely about the presence of a sensitive, and don't know the answer for that, really, accept to say it seems that perhaps we are at least somewhat observed here in this overlay, and our experiences at times seem planned for.
I also know of what you speak about age as I am in my fifties, and perceive the same. But then at some point, I began to remember what most would consider "past lives," but I'm not sure I experienced them as another person, really. Strange, to say the least. But once I began remembering on that level, my perception of time changed a great deal, regardless of my perception of it in terms of growing older. It seemed, somehow, less valid in any perceptual sense.

If you wish to discuss more of my personal experiences, I would be happy to respond to private messages. Also, I will provide two links for you, which are threads of mine, detailing some of my same perceptions about time:
www.abovetopsecret.com...
and
www.abovetopsecret.com...
Btw, nice to meet you.
tetra

a reply to: CarlGrove

I'm glad you enjoyed the book, it's one of those thoughtful endeavours that invites questions.

Some years ago, the accounts in these old books prompted me to write an unsuccessful thread about apparitions. There's a short list of similar books in this link and you'll possibly enjoy the Frank Podmore one about psychical research. I certainly did although neither are easy on the eyes with dense, small script.

This account is from either the Gurney book or Pomore's:




The description of a peculiar silence is a familiar signifier in such accounts isn't it? Whether people are encountering strange 'beasties,' unfamiliar landscapes or 'old-fashioned' people, the absence of sound is often the one thing that ties them together.

a reply to: tetra50

I scanned those previous postings and got an idea. I won't comment on your specific experiences but it seems to me that the situation at the moment regarding reality/shifts/timeline changes/other dimensions, could be summed up like this:
1. For thousands of years spiritual teachers have implied or stated outright that there is another reality, and that the one we inhabit is a kind of illusion. Mystics have tried to break through into this other reality.
2. As I mentioned before, teaching stories have used a variety of analogies of our situation, implying either that we are here because of some cosmic catastrophe or that this is a kind of special school for us to learn things that we cannot experience in the higher dimension.
3. It seems that for some reason, entry into this dimension erases or distorts our memories of our previous existence, and for this reason "remembering" is a key element in spiritual progress. You and others have had spontaneous memories starting to come back to you, but lacking special training don't know how to interpret them. There are lots of warnings in the esoteric literature about having such experiences prematurely. You only have to look at people like David Icke to see where this can lead.
4. Currently the ideas being expressed by Icke and many others seem to me to be paranoid fantasies, with humans being help captive by evil illuminati and/or reptilean aliens. The traditional view, which I believe to be the correct one, is that we are held captive by our own assumptions, our emotion, our vanity, greed, etc. Instead of facing up to this we prefer to find someone or something to blame.
5. It seems to me that such experiences, including time slips, may be on the increase. This could point to some major cosmic change being underway. Or it may be that people are now more able or willing, because of the net, to come forward with their stories.
6. Yes, I'm sure we are under observation, although put that bluntly, it sounds paranoid.
7. That is a problem with past life recall -- was it your life or somebody else's? I have occasional senses, have had since childhood, of some connection with late Victorian/early Edwardian times, but nothing specific.

Yes, by all means let me have some of your experiences. My email address is in the report intro.

a reply to: CarlGrove
Hi Carl:
Good to talk to you again. Thanks for your reply.

I agree with a lot of what you say here in your assessment, generally.
I have some disagreements with nums. 3.,4. and 5.

4. Currently the ideas being expressed by Icke and many others seem to me to be paranoid fantasies, with humans being help captive by evil illuminati and/or reptilean aliens. The traditional view, which I believe to be the correct one, is that we are held captive by our own assumptions, our emotion, our vanity, greed, etc. Instead of facing up to this we prefer to find someone or something to blame.

For instance, in what you say here, about the traditional view, particularly, I somewhat agree with. However, I see a real increase in "science" making it appear that we are the hosts and total progenitors of our own reality, as though this is only due to our own choices, and actual consciousness (perceptions.)

I don't find that realistically to be true. Nor do I propose that no one takes responsibility for their choices. But some, really, may have not experienced choice in their lives the way others may have. And that's a fact, for me, for I've met them, believe that from knowing what their lives have encompassed.

And if you think we are being observed, then it's just another small step to us being controlled, as well. That's just a piece of logic. Of course, we may"prefer to find someone or something to blame." Sometimes that may be true, though.

I'll give you a "for instance," that goes right with your title of the thread, and your recognition of "sensitives." Sensitives who see what others don't and experience the same, are often marginalized by society, especially if they receive or experience information that those in power find threatening or challenging to their goals and aims. They might then, say, find themselves given a mental illness misdiagnosis, usually of schizophrenia, when that just isn't the case, and later find themselves confined to mental institutions, or even worse things happening to them. The same common thread runs through what many, many UFO experiencers find happening to them after they report their experience.
sincerely,
tetra

a reply to: Kandinsky

Your post was excellent -- short, but it got a lot of sensible responses. I've heard of many of these books and got a couple.

That case you quote is a fascinating one. A glimpse into a very different dimension, maybe?

I agreed with your conclusion that hallucination is no sort of answer to experiences like these. It annoyed me somewhat that MacKenzie, in his otherwise good survey of time slips, automatically used that term to describe such experiences, clearly assuming that since people cannot travel in time, such incidents must be hallucinations. I tried to enter the field with no preconceptions, and when I found how common Type 4s have become, I adopted the time travel approach as a working hypothesis. So far I haven't seen anything to rule it out.

Silence is a not infrequent characteristic of time slips, but more often than not sounds appropriate to the past or future environment have been noted. In a few cases, sounds only have been noticed.

a reply to: tetra50

I agree with what you say, that observation implies the possibility of control. I wasn't denying the possibility of control per se but merely pointing out that many people are today promulgating theories about forms of control by entities or organisations that seem to come out of poor science fiction. And I agree that science has become arrogant and dismissive of alternative viewpoints. No wonder a lot of observers of UFOs, entities, etc. keep quiet about it. And this of course makes these things much harder to investigate.

originally posted by: CarlGrove
a reply to: tetra50

4. Currently the ideas being expressed by Icke and many others seem to me to be paranoid fantasies, with humans being help captive by evil illuminati and/or reptilean aliens. The traditional view, which I believe to be the correct one, is that we are held captive by our own assumptions, our emotion, our vanity, greed, etc. Instead of facing up to this we prefer to find someone or something to blame.

While this is slightly OT, I am happy to read this sort of reasoning here on ATS.
I think what may have happened to Icke is that he was so shocked by the savage public reaction to his "revelation" (the "Son of God" TV-interview), so relentlessly ridiculed, that he decided - perhaps as an instinctive reaction under extreme stress - to go ALL THE WAY and make it "legit" by creating a whole system of belief of his own. That way, the ridicule of that first "outrageous" claim would drown under the weight of the rest, plus the naysayers could from then on be qualified en masse as evil-doers, ignorants and so on.
And it seemed to have worked. Very profitably, too.
(N. B. I hold no grudge towards Icke. I respect his intellect and I feel sorry for the disproportionate amount of ridicule he suffered. My opinion of his devotees is a different matter.)

5. It seems to me that such experiences, including time slips, may be on the increase. This could point to some major cosmic change being underway. Or it may be that people are now more able or willing, because of the net, to come forward with their stories.

I think it's the latter. People are paying more attention to such incidents, and many are coming forwrd with their own.
(Unfortunately, many are also making up stories, but that's to be expected; the sad thing is, "hoaxes" tend to dent the credibility of such phenomena in general.)

7. That is a problem with past life recall -- was it your life or somebody else's? I have occasional senses, have had since childhood, of some connection with late Victorian/early Edwardian times, but nothing specific.

THIS is exactly why I'll never be convinced that there is such a thing as "reincarnation". Many people seem unaware of how little we really do know about the nature of information (and ourselves as receivers of information). Personally I find Sheldrake's (and many others' before him) ideas about a collective "reservoir" of information, into which we all tap and contribute, much more convincing.
Some people argue that the information (about their supposed "past lives") feels simply "too personal" to be someone else's.
But why? It is perfectly possible for a person to feel the pain - or joy - of another as, literally, their own. (I know this from personal experience. In my family we've had relatively many experiences involving seemingly extraneous information. We've never talked much about it, which leads me to believe that a certain sensitivity to such experiencing is at least as inherited as it may be nurtured.)

EDIT: I think Charlotte Moberly, of Versailles time slip fame, attributed her and Jourdain's experience to entering the memory field of Marie-Antoinette. While this doesn't explain everything, at least it's a novel (for the time) and intelligent explanation.

a reply to: AdAstra

Yes, your theory about Icke is plausible. He is a very likeable person actually, when interviewed, (I remember him reporting football matches in a very calm and almost amused way) and it's a great pity he's gone so far that he can't back down.

I've only come across a few cases where "hoax" seems likely, at least in the time slip domain, and unlike (e.g.)the alien abduction scenario.

I'm not convinced about reincarnation either, although there are a few cases which impress. If, as seems likely, we can access information potentially from any time or place, or person, then proving the contention becomes impossible.

Yes, that was Miss Moberly's pet theory, and unfortunately she could never see beyond it.

Yes, I think there may be a genetic element in sensitivity, although of course it is confounded with socialisation factors (i.e., if you are brought up in a family with at least one sensitive in it, as I was, you just accept e.g. that people can dream about tomorrow's events, and that makes it more likely that you will accept your own precognitions etc.).

a reply to: CarlGrove

Carl, since you're unlikely to return to the blog ny time soon, there is a "vanishing house" case I'd like to bring to your attention here. It is the Pye case, which happened in 1933 and was published in G. N. M. Tyrrell's The Personality of Man (1947):

"Mr. and Mrs. Clifford Pye were on holiday in Cornwall in 1933 and were travelling by bus from Wadebridge to Boscastle. As they neared Boscastle they both kept a good look-out for a suitable hotel in which to stay, and just before they reached the point at which the road drops steeply down into the village the bus stopped to set down a passenger. "

Then, according to Mr. Pye, the bus "had come to rest almost outside the gates of a rather substantial house, standing on the left-hand side of the road. It stood back from the road some twenty yards or so, there being a semi-circular drive from the gate outside which we had stopped to another gate twenty-five yards further on. The garden front was screened from the road by a hedge over which we could just see from our seats in the bus. The house was double- fronted, and of a style of architecture which I judged to date from the late 1860s or early 1870s. It had a fresh, trim appearance, and seemed to have been recently painted, the woodwork and quoins of the house being of a rather reddish, light chocolate colour. The most striking feature, however, was on the lawn, where, amongst beds of scarlet geraniums, there were several wicker or cane chairs and tables over which there were standing large garden umbrellas of black and orange. No person was seen, nor do I recollect having seen any sign notifying that it was a guest-house, though I had no doubt that such was the case. I called my wife's attention to the place and she immediately replied that it was 'just what we were looking for' but, before we could come to any decision, the bus moved off and in two or three minutes we were down in Boscastle."

The Pyes didn't like Boscastle, so the wife walked up the hill to try and book a room in the house they had seen from the bus, while the husband stayed with the luggage.
After an hour and a half the wife returned, saying she could not find the house. Mr. Pye said he would point out the guest-house to her as they returned along the road.

And then, Tyrrell writes:

On the returning bus, just as they reached the top of the hill, Mr. Pye remarked: "'It's just here on the right about fifty yards further on ', but to my astonishment there was no house. Just empty fields running across to the cliffs by Blackapit. During our stay at Trevalga, we made a thorough search of the locality, but failed to find any place even remotely resembling what we had seen. On a subsequent visit to the Trevalga guest-house, I told our experience to the proprietor, who assured me that from his knowledge there was in the neighbourhood no such house as I had described."

This is Tyrrell's explanation:

There seems to have been no telepathic agent in this case apart from Mr. and Mrs. Pye themselves; but there certainly was telepathy between them. Possibly hopeful expectation of finding a suitable hotel was the primary cause of the incident. But the important point is that the subliminal impulse, whatever its cause, acted psychologically on both percipients so as to make them see the same thing. It is very important to know that this can happen.

Those who hold that, if two or more persons see the same thing, that thing must have an independent existence, are wrong if by "independent existence" they mean independent existence in space. But they are not wholly wrong, for the psychological pattern which creates the two co-incident hallucinations may exist independently "of the percipients in the mind of a third party: or it may, as apparently in this case, be merely the common subliminal possession of the two percipients. It might conceivably extend to more than two percipients. In Canon Bourne's case [ibid., p. 46 ss.] it extended to three.

If one can imagine a pattern, originating in some mind, extending to a large number of percipients, then all those percipients might be telepathically impressed to see the same scene. The scene would have no physical reality ; but it would have a single cause which would be independent of all the percipients. And if their hallucinations were complete enough and sufficiently well correlated, they would almost certainly believe that the common cause resided in space and not in a psychological operator acting on their minds.

These facts are worth pondering because, as we shall see presently, there are states of consciousness in which created sense-imagery becomes extraordinarily full, complete and vivid.

I am now quoting (with permission) the blog author's thoughts; the square brackets are my own:

Tyrrell's explanation of the incident seems to tie in with Carl Gustav Jung's views about his own similar experience [in Ravenna]. On the other hand, it doesn't seem to explain [the Rougham case]. To begin with, [in the Rougham case] there was no perceivable 'hopeful expectation' to find the house - or any house - in any of the purported witnesses to its apparition.

What do you think about it?