Parents Share 5-Year-Old Son’s Transgender Journey

a reply to: Deaf Alien

It's one of those debatable personal opinions.
I just know I saw a story/documentary that showed how much the child was suffering and struggling socially and internally knowing they could not be a girl or a boy. It caused a lot of mental anguish.

originally posted by: Acatalepsia

They are the first person I met who is a male transitioning to a female in my life, so it's a new experience for me, and I think it is a non-issue. If anything, it makes me more interested to get to know that person and to make sure they feel as comfortable and accepted as possible, especially in the workplace.

As I tell my kids and grandkids "People are their Heart".

My mom was disabled. I grew up going to a club for disabled. People are just people. They weren't all nice people either. But, it wasn't cuz they looked different.

originally posted by: Deaf Alien
a reply to: Acatalepsia

I think I would be nothing less than torture to deny a person of these drugs if it is a case that they absolutely feel they are the other gender, even at a very young age.

Not before puberty. I think they should wait until they are adults before making such huge decisions. Just my opinion.

Male to Female need hormone blockers before puberty or at the beginning.

This is one of the reasons Leelah killed herself.

a reply to: Acatalepsia

Yeah. Drug is a dangerous thing. It can cause problems with young children and cause imbalance. We have seen that happen too often.

a reply to: Annee

Yes, hormone blockers. That is part of what I meant also about starting the hormone therapies during adolescent years. Thank you.

originally posted by: Deaf Alien
a reply to: redhorse

If they have the guidance of a good counselor and of course depending on the child, I don't necessarily think letting them self identify at five is so bad either. I think it would be a rare child that would be able to. I'm only advocating a measured approach. There is evidence both ways.

Right. That's exactly what they were doing. You have to remember that the parents in the article never wanted this to happen in the first place. For some reason some people here think they want attention or are nuts. If it is just a phase then why worry at all? Let the child outgrow it. No harm done.

Well, not quite no harm, there are ways that can go wrong. If a child that young is hearing this they may feel pressure to stick with the paradigm that all of the adults have committed to even if they have "outgrown it". Especially if the adults were resistant to it initially.

I don't know that they are just attention mongering, they very well may not be. At least the parents. I am a little more inclined to look askance at the mental health professionals involved however. There are some aspects to the debate surrounding the use of the word "disorder" in the DSM V with sexual identity disorder and/or sexual dysphoria (disorder) that is fiscally motivated and just... kind of slimy.

But... there are a lot of reasons why they could be so public about this, and not all of that is bad though. The brew ha ha surrounding all of this could (only could) be highly stressful and confusing for a child that young, and that would have to be navigated pretty carefully though too. It's all such a razors edge with such a young child.

Personally, if I were a mental health professional and was presented with this situation with a kid that young, I would sure as heck send them on to someone with more experience. Waaayyyy over my head to navigate.

a reply to: Annee

Male to Female need hormone blockers before puberty or at the beginning.

This is one of the reasons Leelah killed herself.

Understood. I am just not too familiar with this. I just don't trust drugs for children before puberty.

[edit] - Ah I understand little more about hormone blockers after looking it up.
en.wikipedia.org...

We always learn something new everyday right? LOL

a reply to: redhorse

Good post. Some professionals are all for this. Others are against this stating the risks of harm this may cause children. Like Annee always said it's a relatively new study and science.

Personally, if I were a mental health professional and was presented with this situation with a kid that young, I would sure as heck send them on to someone with more experience. Waaayyyy over my head to navigate.

LOL

I hope one day there is gene therapy available to help adults (and young adults) who truly must change their outward appearance to feel at one with themselves. With the latest developments, it's looking quite possible actually, and we already know how to change adult hair and eye color.

I don't believe in a doing anything non-reversible for a child because part of growing up is dealing with the rigidness of life as it is dealt to you. The hormone blockers to avoid a pubescent girl developing full body hair and a deep voice are understandable, but can a different hormone be taken later in life if she changes her mind?

And at what point do we expect a child/person to make their "final decision" ???

Also for boys who want to be girls, if they take hormones to grow breasts, obviously that is non-reversible.

This whole concept that you can "change your mind" about what gender you are is a bit strange.

Ultimately there is a lack of meaningfulness in our society to cause so many people to be caught up on these trivialities. I feel like we could handle the majority of cases if we had more introspective spirituality, and encouraged all people to simply be who they are and embrace it.

If you're a boy who likes pink and glitter, but drives a big diesel truck, wears lipstick and converse all-stars and gets turned on by trannies, then good for you!! Whatever floats your boat, it sure doesn't bother me! I feel like the obsession with the physical side of things is a symptom of the vane materialist weakness of our modern minds. Who you are is who you are, and has little to do with outward appearance, voice pitch, or acceptance into a 'gender'.

a reply to: Annee

With all due respect, I know what I have issues with. I don't care if people are vegan or not. That's the point. Vegans have to tell everyone they are vegan. Its like bragging rights or something. I don't need to know what you eat any more than I feel the need to describe my diet to you.

As for the parents publicizing their five year old on this journey, the child deserves some privacy to deal with an issue that is better kept private. If someone else were to reveal the name of a child under the same circumstances they would get sued or jailed or both. I don't think the parents have anything in mind other than publicity and maybe a way to make money. Drawing that much attention to a five year old isn't healthy and they know it. This sounds like liberals putting their agenda ahead of the health and welfare of their own child. They could easily have spoken about this issue, in as much detail as they chose to, without bringing their child into it. To those parents that child is nothing more than a "I voted for Obama" bumper sticker.

a reply to: Night Star

I watched a couple of the videos. I think the children are parroting what the parents or advisors have told them. These concepts are too advanced for the children having the conversations.

I know child/adolescent psych. I have studied, informally, and lived with and was engaged to a woman for many years who is a child/adolescent psych nurse with 30+ years of experience now. We talked about the subject every day. We both found it fascinating. I do not consider myself an expert in the subject but I do know much more than the average person who did not have the opportunity to discuss this topic at great length on a daily basis for more than five years with someone who knows more about it than most people could ever imagine.

It is her job to try to put fractured children back together again. She deals with it ever day. And by far the majority of them wouldn't have half the problems they have if they weren't forced to deal with issues far more mature than they are. With the exception of cases of abuse, the bottom line was pretty much the same. These children need time and privacy and compassion while they try to work out some seriously complicated issues they aren't yet capable of understanding that will have a huge impact on them for the rest of their lives. They deserve a little respect and privacy during very delicate formative years in which self discovery is supposed to be exactly that - SELF discovery. That doesn't mean the Discovery channel on tv. It means self, as in private. Once they have made THEIR decision you can take the story public if you like. But let them find their own path their own way or they will never truly learn to accept and understand who they are.

Tell me honestly - with that many authority figures telling them what is ok...probably without taking care to ensure balanced encouragement over the entire range of options, do you really think the child is able to make the decision they would have come to without all the external interference? Really? And do you see that influence as a good thing? Honestly?

originally posted by: ItCameFromOuterSpace
a reply to: Deaf Alien

What about transracial people? People born into the wrong colored body? Racial identity?
I mean, the dna doesn't matter, right?
Transracialism: Coming Soon Near You!

Did you mean Michael Jackson? ...lol

originally posted by: Vroomfondel

As for the parents publicizing their five year old on this journey, the child deserves some privacy to deal with an issue that is better kept private.

Just gonna say, I grew up in an era where anything not "normal" was still kept behind the door.

Awareness is necessary.

Obama? You're gonna make this about Obama?

We're done.

a reply to: Vroomfondel

Ya have to make this about liberals huh? Again, I say:

The conservative parents of Leelah Alcorn rejected her as a girl. They kept her transgenderism a secret for as long as they could. Even after she killed herself due to their treatment of her, they tried to hide it. Look how well their conservatism turned out for Leelah.

The child in the OP and others such as Jazz Jennings have more liberal parents who are much more open and accepting of their children's feelings. These kids seem to be doing quite well emotionally, and are quite happy with who they are.

a reply to: Vroomfondel

Tell me honestly - with that many authority figures telling them what is ok...probably without taking care to ensure balanced encouragement over the entire range of options, do you really think the child is able to make the decision they would have come to without all the external interference? Really? And do you see that influence as a good thing? Honestly?

What I saw in the vids of Jazz that I have seen, is someone who was born a male and is not only happy as a female, but thriving. She is vibrant, feminine, charming and intelligent. She is extremely comfortable as a female and was not at all happy being a male. The parents did not push her into the decision, it what she chose for herself. Just as in other videos of transgender kids, the parents did not push them into the decision or try to influence them to be something they don't want to be. The parents sought medical advise and waited or are waiting for the child to be older before having the child take hormone blockers or have any kind of surgery. I see happy kids and compassionate and loving parents here.

a reply to: kaylaluv
a reply to annee:

I am not making it about Obama or liberals. Liberals did that. You cant possibly deny that this is far more a liberal agenda than a conservative. I have no doubt at all the parents are outspoken liberals. This is just another soapbox for them.

I am not saying what is normal and what isn't. I am not saying that anything not considered normal should be kept behind the door. But there is a right time and a wrong time to share the experience and promote the awareness. You can give the children the time and space they need to figure out who they are and how they are going to live their lives without shamelessly promoting it and your own parenting. Once the children have grown, put it on tv or youtube or whatever you want. Just give the children a chance to be children, learn about themselves and become who they are without putting them in s spotlight and making them a topic of conversation. This isn't a "look at how accepting we are" opportunity. Its a "let my children grow up and learn about themselves in peace" opportunity.

Liberal or conservative, educated or ignorant, you cant possibly believe that making these children the center of attention during what should be a very private experience of self-discovery is a good thing. Putting them in a spotlight, surrounding them with authority figures telling them its ok for a boy to be a girl or a girl to be a boy, and then standing back and pretending they made their own choice is BS. Give them some room, some time, some support, answer their questions, love them no matter what. Then when all is said and done, if you feel the need to promote it publicly for whatever reason, go ahead. But give children a chance to be children and just learn these things naturally in their own time their own way. Don't put a camera in front of them and surround them with people saying its ok...its ok... Don't make performers out of children just trying to figure out who they are.

What is so wrong with keeping very personal issues like this personal until the child is old enough and informed enough to decide if they want their personal journey publicized? If its about awareness, you can still do your part after the child is grown. If its about shameless opportunism, I guess you have to do it now, huh...

Just wanted to share this video of Jazz as a teenager, still happy and vibrant in the choice she made for herself.

a reply to: Night Star

It is possible the events occurred exactly as you described. It is also possible that the video is just the end result of a lot of suggestion and influence the cameras were not present for. I doubt that all these children fit into one of these catagories only. I suspect they are fairly well divided. And the likelihood of ever knowing for sure which is which is very little.

I still don't see what is wrong with keeping it private until the child is old enough to decide if they want their private journey of self discovery made public. Being a kid is hard enough. To add gender identity issues and then put it all in a spotlight is just too much. The children deserve better.

Throughout this thread I have maintained that the issue I have is not with transgendered people but with publicizing and exploiting them, especially as children. I think the journey of self discovery should be private. Once the child is old enough to decide for themselves if they want that journey made public you can use it to bring awareness to as many people as you like. But the children deserve a chance to be children first and learn about themselves without a spotlight on them and people influencing their decisions.

I lived with and was engaged to a child/adolescent psych nurse for little over five years. When I met her I was of the opinion that homosexuality was a product of environment and was a choice people made. Hearing about young children who grew up in a verified neutral influence environment and always felt one way or the other changed my opinion to a great degree. But my fiancé also agreed there were instances where the environment was so positive toward homosexuality that choice was almost not an option. Their childhood was not one of discovery as much as indoctrination. If it truly is not a choice but ingrained in the person, then the preferences or influences of the parents or society would not matter, but it has been observed that in some cases they do. That influence could result in someone who is genuinely attracted to the same sex or someone who is genuinely attracted to the controversy and attention. In other words, sometimes it is a choice.

If the end result of all the attention and publicity was a happy healthy well adjusted person, then I am all for it. But it isn't. Some come through ok, some don't. And it shouldn't be an issue at all. It is a private thing, especially where children are concerned. Once they are grown up they can decide if they want their personal journey to be made public or not. But while they are children, let them find out who they are without having to be in a spotlight or the topic of documentaries.

originally posted by: Night Star
Just wanted to share this video of Jazz as a teenager, still happy and vibrant in the choice she made for herself.

Thanks. I know about Jazz.

The subject of this thread is not the first or only Trans child who's come forth publicly.

Heres a good site: www.genderwarriors.com...

Here's an article from 2010 about Trans Kids Camp: www.slate.com...