Atheist, Politics and God

a reply to: Lucid Lunacy

yeah enki said go forth be fruitful and multiply
and enlil said, go forth be fruitful and don't multiply till i say you can

enlil ordered the flood event
enki saved people from the flood event.

in the sumerian version, enlil was over working the people and they went on strike
enki chastised him for over working the people.

no enki is not the son of enlil. he's the son of anu (who is called amen later in egypt and in the bible)

originally posted by: CharlieSpeirs
a reply to: Lucid Lunacy

I think this is the first time I've ever heard the term atheistic morals...

I thought morals were just, morals.



I'm similar.


God didn't give us a guide on the morals of a few (recent) things... eg Nuclear Weapons
So that's a moral issue with have to resolve with our free will/initiative.


& I'm sure there is Atheists and believers on both sides of the argument.

& many others.

Isn't it funny how god forgot to mention any of the technology that has popped up in the last 200 years?

Religious people identify themselves as sinners. How can anyone trust someone who openly admits that they are constantly sinning?
Religious folks are so bad they have to ask an all powerful deity to forgive them daily for all of the horrible things they think about and do. I assume that since god doesn't talk to me that he is fine with me as i am. I am glad that i am not burdened with such horrible manners that i need the constant attention of any gods.

For those of you who feel the presence of god and feel him telling you to be a better person, for those of you who admit to being sinners in your church services, maybe you should start being a better person. And then god won't bother you so much, like us atheists. Gods favorite people. The ones he doesn't have to bother with.

a reply to: BELIEVERpriest

The bible teaches that soul-life is breathed in at the first breath, not conception.

Jer_1:5 Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee; and before thou camest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee, and I ordained thee a prophet unto the nations.

a reply to: WakeUpBeer

I look at the human race with an evolutionary eye towards things.

desperate times called for desperate measures...

God's wrath towards evil is some hardcore suff, Heavy like Metal!

I like heavy metal too. Out of the thousands of good bands out there in heavy metal land, i can only think of a few whose subject matter would be acceptable for a devout believer in deity.

Oh wait. Your one of them there Nordic metal folks aren't you? Singing the ballads of yonder years? Tales of ancient myth and woe?

If you want your old profile back, just talk to admin.



a reply to: AinElohim

a reply to: Woodcarver

I am content with the new acct... no need to bug those fellas.

Nordic Metal? lol you mean Black Metal? I am far from it man.

I go for the philosophical content stuff...

originally posted by: AinElohim
a reply to: Grimpachi

It's all good...

Like I said, I owe this forum a lot because I absolutely devastate atheists in debate (who happen to be democrats) on my facebook.

Going off your recent posting history I would love to see this?

a reply to: Prezbo369

the communist card always works when Atheists think the can create a better world if they could just convince people that God is not real.

I am ready to do a money drive to purchase 60 acres... I want to see the atheist build this utopia and interact with the rest of the world on a microcosmic political system.

It'll be better than game of thrones or age of Empires, I will limit the population at onset.

It would make sense that christians believe monarchy is the best form of government seeing is god is king of heaven. Not much democracy going on in gods kingdom

originally posted by: AinElohim
a reply to: Prezbo369

the communist card always works when Atheists think the can create a better world if they could just convince people that God is not real.

I am ready to do a money drive to purchase 60 acres... I want to see the atheist build this utopia and interact with the rest of the world on a microcosmic political system.

It'll be better than game of thrones or age of Empires, I will limit the population at onset.

Sounds like you want to play god.

Tool and gojira then?

a reply to: AinElohim

Why is Communism always brought up when talking about atheist nations acting badly? Like one or two bad atheist countries somehow overshadows the myriad of theocratic governments that have done untold amounts of horrors on their populaces. As a counter point to the Communism point, MODERN atheist countries happen to be the most successful, happiest, and wealthiest countries in the world.

Non-religious nations have higher quality of life

They found eight factors had a significant effect on quality of life: divorce rate, public health expenditure, doctor/population ratio; per capita GDP; food supply; female and male adult literacy rate, and population with access to safe drinking water. The model crunched all these, along with the effects, and spat out a Quality of Life rating for the 43 countries they analysed.

Belgium came out top, followed by France, Denmark, Spain and Germany. The USA came in 7th, and the UK was 11th. Bottom of the pile was Sri Lanka, the Dominican Republic and, at lucky number 43, El Salvador.

So I took their data and plotted it against the World Values Survey data on how important God is in people’s lives. And this is what the plot looks like.

You probably won’t be surprised to hear that the top nations tended to be the least religious (unfortunately there’s no data on this variable for Belgium or a bunch of the other nations, which is why some are missing).

This analysis joins all the others – the least religious countries are more democratic, more peaceful, have less corruption, more telephones, do better at science, have less inequality and other problems, and are generally just less dysfunctional.

Misinformation and facts about secularism and religion

Fortunately for atheists, agnostics, and secular humanists, there is no factual basis for Plante's claim that "research has consistently found" secular individuals to be more prone to such antisocial behavior. Consider, for example, a March 2009 academic article in Sociology Compass that extensively researched the subjects raised by Plante. The article, by Phil Zuckerman of Pitzer College, is entitled "Atheism, Secularity, and Well-Being: How the Findings of Social Science Counter Negative Stereotypes and Assumptions" (link is external) and, unlike Plante's article, it cites detailed studies of the areas in question.

Zuckerman analyzed a wide array of data comparing religious nations to less religious nations and also, interestingly, religious states within the United States (i.e. "Bible-belt" states) to less religious states. While I encourage readers to examine the article directly through the link above, here are just a few of the highlights:

Secular Societies Fare Better Than Religious Societies

Consider, for instance, the latest special report just put out by the Organization for Economic Co-operation and Development (and recently summarized on the website 24/7wallstreet.com), which lists the ten states with the worst/best quality of life. According to this multivariate analysis which takes into account a plethora of indicators of societal well-being, those states in America with the worst quality of life tend to be among the most God-loving/most religious (such as Mississippi and Alabama), while those states with the best quality of life tend to among the least God-loving/least religious (such as Vermont and New Hampshire).

If you are curious as to which states are the most/least religious, simply check out the Pew Forum’s Religious Landscape Survey. It’s all there. And then you can go ahead and check out how the various states are faring in terms of societal well-being. The correlation is clear and strong: the more secular tend to fare better than the more religious on a vast host of measures, including homicide and violent crime rates, poverty rates, obesity and diabetes rates, child abuse rates, educational attainment levels, income levels, unemployment rates, rates of sexually transmitted diseases and teen pregnancy, etc. You name it: on nearly every sociological measure of well-being, you’re most likely to find the more secular states with the lowest levels of faith in God and the lowest rates of church attendance faring the best and the most religious states with the highest levels of faith in God and rates of church attendance faring the worst.

originally posted by: Krazysh0t

originally posted by: undo

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: undo

All those things were impossible at the time. That is unless you can produce the evidence that people possessed such technology back then. Because no evidence exists that says they did. Also, raising people from the dead? We still haven't conquered that barrier with our current level of technology...

have you read ezekiel 1? a hole opens in the sky and out of it flies metal wheels within wheels. lol

And? Got any remains of this "metal wheels within wheels" to prove it actually existed?

nope. just historical accounts, and of course, artistic depictions that ISIS is presently destroying or in the process of destroying. i wonder if they got to the cylinder seal collection. egads.

a reply to: Krazysh0t

you can't claim the secular countries as atheistic, since they contain real people of various degrees of religiosity, who do real work and die in real wars, to enrich the governments in question. not only that, many scientific breakthroughs arose from christian scholars and scientisits. yes they are secular countries, no they are not making this # appear out of thin air.

originally posted by: undo

originally posted by: Krazysh0t

originally posted by: undo

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: undo

All those things were impossible at the time. That is unless you can produce the evidence that people possessed such technology back then. Because no evidence exists that says they did. Also, raising people from the dead? We still haven't conquered that barrier with our current level of technology...

have you read ezekiel 1? a hole opens in the sky and out of it flies metal wheels within wheels. lol

And? Got any remains of this "metal wheels within wheels" to prove it actually existed?

nope. just historical accounts, and of course, artistic depictions that ISIS is presently destroying or in the process of destroying. i wonder if they got to the cylinder seal collection. egads.

None of that is evidence though... It may be impressive and historically significant (showing the arts of the time), but it isn't corroborating evidence of anything.

a reply to: undo

So? Christians live in Muslim theocratic countries and contribute to those countries' well being. We still call those countries Muslim theocratic countries though. Secular governments are CLEARLY proof that god isn't needed in government as well as proof that atheists can have morality too since secular governments are atheist hotspots.

Literally ALL the data says that the more secular the country, the better off it is. America, with a large population that thinks the country is a Christian nation, actually falls below countries that don't have such populations even though we can argue that America is technically a secular country. The population of religious apparently holds the country back. This even holds out state by state in the US as shown by my third link.

Atheism is the best thing that can happen to a country despite the crap the OP is trying to sell everyone.

originally posted by: Woodcarver
Sounds like you want to play god.

No I just want to watch them build a commune, real big back in the 60's.

Tool and gojira then?

Now you're talking!

a reply to: Krazysh0t

no, what is holding the country back is the decision to undermine its financial success by taxing the hell out of the ordinary business people, mom and pop stores, innovation and patents for everything including air, squelching scientific advancements in the name of profit for a select few. marxism requires disposing of the most intelligent and productive members of society and hoarding all the profit for a handful and stealing their ideas under the guise of them being too stupid anyway. you gotta stand in awe of such hubris

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: AinElohim

Why is Communism always brought up when talking about atheist nations acting badly? Like one or two bad atheist countries somehow overshadows the myriad of theocratic governments that have done untold amounts of horrors on their populaces. As a counter point to the Communism point, MODERN atheist countries happen to be the most successful, happiest, and wealthiest countries in the world.

One or two maybe... but all since the advent of Darwin is a huge FAIL!

Non-religious nations have higher quality of life

Yes I live in a secular nation, maybe I'll repost this for my UK friends on social media... Quality of life in the USA is just fine, we still have people coming from all over the world for medical procedures. Besides I value freedom over gun security and $60 thousand dollar speeding tickets just because you're wealthy.

That's not justice or equality... it's tyranny!

www.aol.com...

a reply to: Krazysh0t


can you explain the "fiery" hole that opens in the sky in ezekiel, which appears in the distance at first, as a whirling cloud mass? or what about enoch's account of a super massive black hole? they just making this stuff up off the top of their heads?

a reply to: AinElohim

the communist card always works when Atheists think the can create a better world if they could just convince people that God is not real.

Secular society does not equal communism.

I personally think the World would be better without religion. Either way, the evidence doesn't point to secularism leading to a degradation. Nor religion facilitating the health of society.

“Norway, Iceland, Australia, Canada, Sweden, Switzerland, Belgium, Japan, the Netherlands, Denmark, and the United Kingdom are among the least religious societies on [E]arth. According to the United Nations' Human Development Report (2005) they are also the healthiest, as indicated by life expectancy, adult literacy, per capita income, educational attainment, gender equality, homicide rate, and infant mortality. Insofar as there is a crime problem in Western Europe, it is largely the product of immigration. Seventy percent of the inmates of France's jails, for instance, are Muslim. The Muslims of Western Europe are generally not atheists. Conversely, the fifty nations now ranked lowest in terms of the United Nations' [H]uman [D]evelopment [I]ndex are unwaveringly religious.

Other analyses paint the same picture: the United States is unique among wealthy democracies in its level of religious adherence; it is also uniquely beleaguered by high rates of homicide, abortion, teen pregnancy, sexually transmitted disease, and infant mortality. The same comparison holds true within the United States itself: Southern and Midwestern states, characterized by the highest levels of religious literalism, are especially plagued by the above indicators of societal dysfunction, while the comparatively secular states of the Northeast conform to European norms.”
― Sam Harris, Letter to a Christian Nation