GOP Assault on Social Security Could be 'Death Sentence' for Nation's Disabled

a reply to: pexx421

How come the "fraud and waste" always seems cut from social safety nets, health care and education, and not government contacts, military industrial complex, or the corrupt congress' pay and benefits?

You hit the nail on the head with that statement my friend. The military industrial complex, corporate welfare and bailouts, and government perks and waste are untouchable. Heaven forbid if we cut overseas military bases and equipment. If we did, we would leave America vulnerable to attack!!! The use of fear keeps the people at bay.

Sounds like commondreams is gearing up for 2016.

What are they so afraid of?

originally posted by: WeRpeons
a reply to: pexx421

How come the "fraud and waste" always seems cut from social safety nets, health care and education, and not government contacts, military industrial complex, or the corrupt congress' pay and benefits?

You hit the nail on the head with that statement my friend. The military industrial complex, corporate welfare and bailouts, and government perks and waste are untouchable. Heaven forbid if we cut overseas military bases and equipment. If we did, we would leave America vulnerable to attack!!! The use of fear keeps the people at bay.

This seems to be one common theme that seems to be repeating over and over that all politicians agree on.
Cutting Social Security, Cutting Food Stamps, Cutting Educational Spending, Cutting Infrastructure Repairs and so on.

What do they all have in common?
They do not have lobbyists fighting to keep them in place.

Why do we need lobbyists for defense contractors shelling out money to politicians for example?
They are using tax payers money to throw back at politicians to keep the circle jerk going.

originally posted by: Edumakated
a reply to: FyreByrd

The sky is falling. The sky is falling. God forbid anyone actually try to stamp out the fraud and waste in social programs.

Are you really saying that everyone on disability is defrauding the government? And that you are pleased that handicaped and disablled people of all kinds can survive without their benefits? Or that maybe they should just be homeless and die. A true republican - no wait - a libertarian perhaps.

Grant me patience.

I don't even know how to respond to such ignorance of facts and agendas.

originally posted by: nwtrucker
The assault on Social Security began when Obama cut their funds to finance Obamacare.....

Say what? Did you make that up? Source please.

Again grant me patience....

originally posted by: Sremmos80
a reply to: stosh64

This rhetoric is all fine and dandy, but it doesn't address the real issue.

There are some that abuse the system, but it is not the majority and that is what this will do.

While this may help stomp out some of the abuse, the people that actually do need it are the ones that pay the price.

It is sad that these cuts that just need to happen always come out of our safety nets and no where else.

This is not intended to 'stop abuse' whatsoever - it's intended to defund social security completely - a republican goal since the inception of this most valuable and efficient system the country has.

originally posted by: FyreByrd

originally posted by: Edumakated
a reply to: FyreByrd

The sky is falling. The sky is falling. God forbid anyone actually try to stamp out the fraud and waste in social programs.

Are you really saying that everyone on disability is defrauding the government? And that you are pleased that handicaped and disablled people of all kinds can survive without their benefits? Or that maybe they should just be homeless and die. A true republican - no wait - a libertarian perhaps.

Grant me patience.

I don't even know how to respond to such ignorance of facts and agendas.

Are you really assuming that I said "everyone on disability is defrauding the government"? I don't even know how to respond to such drivel.

originally posted by: SlapMonkey
a reply to: tom.farnhill

I don't disagree, but in the same breath, funding the military is a constitutional requirement--social safet nets are not.

But I'm a fan of the "Penny Plan," where we simply cut one cent from every dollar spent on everything--a one-percent cut across the board. Nothing will truly feel that cut that can't be made up with a little effort of fraud/waster/abuse removal in the systems.

...something about the 'common good' .....

.... and a 'resonable defence....

Your penny plan is wonderful in theory but in practise - the penny is across the board. No additional funds would be available to investigate and stop fraudulent applications. It costs money in resources and time to regulate a system.

When you cut funding to any agency, one of the first things to go is regulation and oversight of policies and practises - why do you think it's such a favorite of big business and it's boosters in congress.

You have to think more then one step ahead people.

Consequences....

originally posted by: stosh64
a reply to: FyreByrd

I really feel sorry for you stuck in your paradigm raging about the evil Republicans.

Step back and look at the bigger reality, the D & R world you live in is an illusion designed to have you do the very thing you are.

Keep raging against those evil R's like your propaganda tells you, it is as pointless as ditto heads raging against those evil D's.

Stop being the marionette, cut the strings.

You should feel sorry for the Americans who are victimized by the GOP


It’s still the truth. You just don’t like the truth


You’re the one dealing with dogma of some nonsense about “left/right paradigm”

The reality is that the GOP doesn’t give a dam about poor, disabled, and minorities... it doesn’t matter what they call themselves.

Its about issues not Alex Jones dogma

originally posted by: SlapMonkey
a reply to: tom.farnhill

I don't disagree, but in the same breath, funding the military is a constitutional requirement--social safet nets are not.

But I'm a fan of the "Penny Plan," where we simply cut one cent from every dollar spent on everything--a one-percent cut across the board. Nothing will truly feel that cut that can't be made up with a little effort of fraud/waster/abuse removal in the systems.

The penny plan is one of the most extreme plans out there due to it cutting 1% while not accounting for inflation. A 1% cut every year for 7 years puts you at 93% of the budget where it would normally be about 137%. With some simple division you'll find that you're looking at a 47% decrease in the budget. Most budgets get tight at a 20% cut over 10 years. Here you're cutting by over twice as much in less time.

It is an absolutely massive cut, out of all the budget plans proposed it is the largest one out there, and it occurs over the shortest time period.

Edit: Want to know why the Penny Plan typically stops at projects 7 years out when US budgeting typically works on the idea of cutting x billion over 10 years? It's because the penny plan is an exponentially larger cut with each passing year. At 8 years it's a 54% cut, at 9 years it's a 64% cut, and at the magic 10 year mark it's a 74% cut.

Yeah, my country has been hunting down the disabled since the 1980's. Easy prey for the GOP.

originally posted by: Edumakated
Second, the return for the money you contributed for a lot of people is quite pathetic compared to if had you paid the same money into a real investment like a 401k. Third, people are withdrawing way more than they actually put into the system because they are living way longer than the actuaries intended when the program was first developed.

If you were being intellectually consistent wouldn't you have to admit that those who invest in 401k's and take money out when they retire are also taking out way more money than they put in?

Below is a link to another version of the story. The GOP wants the President to work on a solution rather than punt the problem down the road. CommonDreams is a progressive news source that is about as fair and balanced as Fox news.

Link

originally posted by: tom.farnhill
a reply to: FyreByrd
the US war machine is soaking the money like it is going out of fashion , but it is a big circle because the more troops they send out to fight the more injured troops will be needing help when they come home and so more money will be needed not less .
the finance whizz kids are going to bankrupt the US more sooner than later and you don't need to be a mathematical genius to see it.

Yes the big evil war machine.....must drink more kool aid...ya know the education budget is larger than the defense budget and has had less success over the last 50 years. But that would probably affect women, children and minorities more so we can't touch that. I would mention social programs but I really don't have to because you already know those don't work either.

originally posted by: Aazadan

originally posted by: Edumakated
Second, the return for the money you contributed for a lot of people is quite pathetic compared to if had you paid the same money into a real investment like a 401k. Third, people are withdrawing way more than they actually put into the system because they are living way longer than the actuaries intended when the program was first developed.

If you were being intellectually consistent wouldn't you have to admit that those who invest in 401k's and take money out when they retire are also taking out way more money than they put in?

Honestly, the fact you are even trying to make this point disqualifies you from further debate as you have zero credibility left. If you don't know the difference between investing your own money in a 401k and withdrawing from social security, you are not capable of having a reasoned discussion on this topic. Seriously.

I am not trying to be dismissive, but WTF? Are you really serious?

originally posted by: doobydoll
a reply to: FyreByrd

This is already well under way in the UK.

The disabled are now being attacked in the streets just because they claim benefits and are labeled 'scroungers' by government and the media.

Terminal cancer patients with a prognosis of more than 6 months are being told they have to find work and their benefits sanctioned if they don't, without any consideration of any treatments they are undergoing.

Working families with children on poverty wages are having their housing benefits cut, and they are being evicted and made homeless at the unprecedented rate of 8,000 families a day here.

People with mental health problems and disabled people are committing suicide. A diabetic man was found dead in his home, his benefits had been stopped, his electricity had been cut off, there was no food in his house, he had just a few pennies in his bank account, his fridge contained his insulin but no food, but there was no electricity to run the fridge where his insulin was supposed to be kept cool. The coroner said an autopsy found that there was no food at all in the man's stomach and he hadn't eaten in days, he'd starved to death.

Starved to death in 21st century UK. Shocking.

Meanwhile, MP's are giving themselves pay rises, taking £millions from party donors, living in luxury off the taxpayer quid, stalling criminal investigations, and destroying incriminating evidence so they can escape justice and continue shagging our kids.

Every apple in the barrel is rotten to the core and maggot-riddled, an establishment rife with vileness, corruption, and iniquity. It's obscene. With such criminal, corrupt, amoral cretins in charge, is there any wonder my country is a toilet.

I had no idea - that's appalling.

originally posted by: Edumakated
a reply to: FyreByrd

The sky is falling. The sky is falling. God forbid anyone actually try to stamp out the fraud and waste in social programs.

There is a diffrence between cracking down on fraud and waste and slashing money to true disabled people who are struggling.

originally posted by: SlapMonkey
a reply to: tom.farnhill

I don't disagree, but in the same breath, funding the military is a constitutional requirement--social safet nets are not.

But I'm a fan of the "Penny Plan," where we simply cut one cent from every dollar spent on everything--a one-percent cut across the board. Nothing will truly feel that cut that can't be made up with a little effort of fraud/waster/abuse removal in the systems.

There is funding a military for defence.

And there is funding a global empire with a millitary force 10x the size of the next milirary competitor.

originally posted by: crayzeed
All I can sat to you is welcome to the jungle.
This has been happening in the UK for the past 9 months. Although Manfromeurope was using sarcasm it is reality in the UK where (coincidentally an American firm, Atos, has been assessing the disabled) they have threw paraplegics off disabilities because the can work. Reason, they can be fitted with a headset and work in call centres.
Not withstanding that nearly all of British call centres are based in India.
Some decisions by Atos have lead to people committing suicide because disability payments are their only source of income and they can see no other alternative.
Welcome to the corporate world, Especially America where the ethos is"if you can't earn your money you don't deserve any".

I really had no idea it was so bad across the pond. Next it will be work houses again.

Mahatma Ghandi who said, "A nation's greatness is measured by how it treats its weakest members."

Churchill said that you measure the degree of civilisation of a society by how it treats its weakest members.

Truman said a society will be judged by how it treats its weakest members.

originally posted by: Edumakated
Honestly, the fact you are even trying to make this point disqualifies you from further debate as you have zero credibility left. If you don't know the difference between investing your own money in a 401k and withdrawing from social security, you are not capable of having a reasoned discussion on this topic. Seriously.

I am not trying to be dismissive, but WTF? Are you really serious?

I'm aware in the differences between how they work. What I'm asking is why is it ok for one to allow a person to withdraw far more than they put in but not the other? It seems to me that it should be a completely valid outcome for both.