the 99 (ninety-nine) names of Allah.... a FYI

a reply to: NOTurTypical

No I am not bound by the Hadith...

If Muslims wish to follow them as guidance, who am I to complain?

I am bound by the Quran and the 5 Pillars only.

originally posted by: CharlieSpeirs
a reply to: NOTurTypical

No I am not bound by the Hadith...

If Muslims wish to follow them as guidance, who am I to complain?

I am bound by the Quran and the 5 Pillars only.

Oh, so you are one of those anti-Hadith Muslims.

Islam Today and Hadith

You are kind of going against Islam. Some Muslims might take a dim view of that, since your scholars have always said Hadith is equal and fundamental to understanding Q'uran. Please don't let yourself get into trouble, there are some Muslims who might try to harm you for that.

And besides, what I posted from that fatwa, was from Sunnah.

originally posted by: CharlieSpeirs
a reply to: NOTurTypical

No I am not bound by the Hadith...

If Muslims wish to follow them as guidance, who am I to complain?

I am bound by the Quran and the 5 Pillars only.

So the Sunnah is irrelevant? Okay, moving on. I suppose you missed my post on the last page, I'll re-post it:

Which eschatological camp are you a believer in might I ask? Are you in the camp that believes chaos and murder must first come to hasten the return of the Mahdi or are you in the camp that believes the Mahdi must first come then the bloodbath will begin? Specifically, when is the murder and rape of the Jews and Christians supposed to begin? Now before he comes or after he comes?

a reply to: WarminIndy

Yes they may well want to hurt me...

I'm not anti-Hadith, not in the sense I think you're implying...
If others wish to follow them, I say they do it at their own peril...


Also, those Scholars make a living using the Hadith...

The Saudi Scholars especially because it gives them some kind of perceived authority to manipulate Sharia & use punishments that were never mentioned in the Quran.

www.quran-islam.org...



For example...

Many, many Hadith call for death penalty for Apostacy, even some "Authentic" Hadith...

Compre that to this Quranic verse;

Surah 4:137
Those who believed, then disbelieved, believed again and then disbelieved, then went on increasing in their disbelief, Allah is not to forgive them, nor lead them on the path.



So where in this verse is this "death penalty" that Hadith promote?


Like I said, I'm not anti, but in not pro, it's a choice of each individual...
Judgement Day will be when I find out if I am deemed any less righteous.

a reply to: NOTurTypical

Didn't miss it I purposely ignored it because you were being obtuse and speaking of what you do not know...
Or you do know but decide sowing discord is more palatable to you...



There will be no "rape of Christians & Jews"



It is clearly accessible knowledge that the violence & chaos, the corruption & deceit, will be prior to the Mahdi's arrival.


There is no alternative camp within Islam.

There would be no need for the Arrivals in End Times if there was no violence, corruption & chaos to fight against.

originally posted by: CharlieSpeirs
& there was nothing divine about Jesus.

Muhammad changed the story, totally disregarded eyewitness accounts from Jesus time, to make it seem that way so the peasants would follow his new religion. Because if Jesus is God incarnate, then there is no need for Islam.

I suggest that you actually read the first hand accounts of the life of Jesus, from the time of Jesus, rather than listening to the stories made up 600+ years later by Muhammad. Muhammad wasn't there during Jesus time ... but the apostles and their followers were.

The knee should bow only to God ... and here we have every knee bowing to Jesus.

Phlippians 2:10 For this reason also, God highly exalted Him, and bestowed on Him the name which is above every name, 10so that at the name of Jesus EVERY KNEE WILL BOW, of those who are in heaven and on earth and under the earth, 11and that every tongue will confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.

And the angels themselves, who know that worship belongs to God alone, worshipped Jesus.

Hebrews 1:6 "And again, when he bringeth in the firstbegotten into the world, he saith, And let all the angels of God worship him."

originally posted by: CharlieSpeirs
a reply to: WarminIndy

Yes they may well want to hurt me...

I'm not anti-Hadith, not in the sense I think you're implying...
If others wish to follow them, I say they do it at their own peril...


Also, those Scholars make a living using the Hadith...

The Saudi Scholars especially because it gives them some kind of perceived authority to manipulate Sharia & use punishments that were never mentioned in the Quran.

www.quran-islam.org...



For example...

Many, many Hadith call for death penalty for Apostacy, even some "Authentic" Hadith...

Compre that to this Quranic verse;

Surah 4:137
Those who believed, then disbelieved, believed again and then disbelieved, then went on increasing in their disbelief, Allah is not to forgive them, nor lead them on the path.



So where in this verse is this "death penalty" that Hadith promote?


Like I said, I'm not anti, but in not pro, it's a choice of each individual...
Judgement Day will be when I find out if I am deemed any less righteous.

Are you an imam or scholar?

You know that if you are not either, then you really can't be telling us your opinion of Q'uran.

Allah is not to forgive them, nor lead them on the path

Can you tell us what the penalty for disbelief is? Can you tell us the path to which he is referring?

originally posted by: CharlieSpeirs
a reply to: NOTurTypical

Didn't miss it I purposely ignored it because you were being obtuse and speaking of what you do not know...
Or you do know but decide sowing discord is more palatable to you...



There will be no "rape of Christians & Jews"



It is clearly accessible knowledge that the violence & chaos, the corruption & deceit, will be prior to the Mahdi's arrival.


There is no alternative camp within Islam.

There would be no need for the Arrivals in End Times if there was no violence, corruption & chaos to fight against.

Did you just say there is no alternative camp within Islam..and yet you kept telling FlyersFan that you weren't Shia.

Hmmm, Sunni and Shia and Druze and all the other various forms, are you all the same camp or not?

For me the mark is egoism and being greedy taking resources from others thru systems.

Many have taken the mark of the beast. Those who have chosen the other path are allowed to know and be aware of the nature of the light/spirit within.

originally posted by: CharlieSpeirs
a reply to: FlyersFan

I'm talking about your loved ones lives not your own...

Would you let ISIS behead someone you love just so you can say "at least I didn't lie"...

To be honest I would have thought you could go to "confession" at a safer time afterwards and Jesus & the Priest would forgive you...




& like I said, it's a Shia tradition not one that is gonna be used by all Muslims to take over the world as some would lead us to believe when they say "and then...BAM."...

I don't know. Think about it ...

If some Christians captured your loved one and said convert or we will behead this person, what would you do?

a reply to: WarminIndy

Did you read what I was responding to?

Are you being a troll or ignorant?



The Mahdi's arrival is subject to the conditions of discord, deceit, corruption, violence & chaos across the board...



Who the Mahdi is & his role in End Times would entail different "camps" & are one of the main reasons for different sects!

Not the cause of the Arrival which is what I was asked about when the "camp" reference was made!

originally posted by: CharlieSpeirs
a reply to: WarminIndy

Did you read what I was responding to?

Are you being a troll or ignorant?



The Mahdi's arrival is subject to the conditions of discord, deceit, corruption, violence & chaos across the board...



Who the Mahdi is & his role in End Times would entail different "camps" & are one of the main reasons for different sects!

Not the cause of the Arrival which is what I was asked about when the "camp" reference was made!

Yes, but your different camps are both interested in the Mahdi, one to kill him and the other to place him in power.

Do you believe the Al-Mahdi will come back to break all the crosses?

a reply to: ketsuko

I have no idea how I would react!



But I'm not as cocksure as other members as to say I'd defy the demand...
I haven't been held in front of family members who are tied up, defenceless & about to be beheaded...


To say I'd just let them die rather than sacrifice my own salvation, I'm not too sure I'd be that selfish.

a reply to: CharlieSpeirs

Jesus shows us exactly what we are supposed to do.

He was facing his own torture and death. And he knew that his mother would suffer horrendously because of it. She'd be in awful pain, emotional and spiritual and physical, as she watched him be tortured to death. And she'd have to live the rest of her life being mocked and spat on for being the mother of a condemned criminal. Jesus didn't back away from the suffering .. he didn't lie to get out of it, not even to help his own mother not suffer. He continued with His mission and He faced the suffering, knowing full well that it would be horrible for His mother and that His apostles would follow in His steps and be murdered as well.

Christians are told by Jesus Himself to pick up their cross and follow Him. That no man is worthy to be called a follower of Christ if they aren't willing to suffer for God and the truth.

originally posted by: CharlieSpeirs
a reply to: ketsuko

I have no idea how I would react!



But I'm not as cocksure as other members as to say I'd defy the demand...
I haven't been held in front of family members who are tied up, defenceless & about to be beheaded...


To say I'd just let them die rather than sacrifice my own salvation, I'm not too sure I'd be that selfish.

If you were at a school that caught on fire and 275 little girls were not wearing burqahs, would you go against Islam to save the little girls or would you allow them to die because they were in violation of an Islamic precept?

What about the others now that you can save from death? Do you?

To say I'd just let them die rather than sacrifice my own salvation, I'm not too sure I'd be that selfish

Then you aren't very Muslim.

a reply to: CharlieSpeirs

There will be no "rape of Christians & Jews"

You aren't telling the truth. The Mahdi will offer Islam to the Jews and Christians and if they accept they will be spared, if they reject they will be murdered. Your faith also says that the trees will call out "Servant of allah, there is a Jew behind me, come and murder him him."

So which camp are you? That the bloodbath is to happen now to hasten the return of the Mahdi or is the bloodbath supposed to happen after he arrives?

a reply to: CharlieSpeirs

And yet, in the time of the End, when/if it comes, all will be facing exactly that kind of choice NO MATTER WHAT your faith is, so you better start to think about exactly how much your faith means to you because we, in Christianity, are told that we should always prepare as though the End is just around the corner, tomorrow even, because we can never exactly know what we could be faced with.

originally posted by: NOTurTypical
a reply to: CharlieSpeirs

There will be no "rape of Christians & Jews"

You aren't telling the truth. The Mahdi will offer Islam to the Jews and Christians and if they accept they will be spared, if they reject they will be murdered. Your faith also says that the trees will call out "Servant of allah, there is a Jew behind me, come and murder him him."

So which camp are you? That the bloodbath is to happen now to hasten the return of the Mahdi or is the bloodbath supposed to happen after he arrives?

This is a strange type of Muslim...he doesn't accept the authority of Hadith and he would not be selfish in his salvation.

He's very strange. He can give up his salvation to save someone else, isn't that the strangest Muslim saying you have heard in a while?

originally posted by: NOTurTypical
The Mahdi will offer Islam to the Jews and Christians and if they accept they will be spared, if they reject they will be murdered.?

The mythical Mahdi fits the description of the anti-christ perfectly. And in keeping with the theme of the thread ... I'd rather have a shorter life here on earth but keep true to God, than bow to a meteor in Saudi Arabia just to have a longer life on earth.

originally posted by: ketsuko
a reply to: CharlieSpeirs

And yet, in the time of the End, when/if it comes, all will be facing exactly that kind of choice NO MATTER WHAT your faith is, so you better start to think about exactly how much your faith means to you because we, in Christianity, are told that we should always prepare as though the End is just around the corner, tomorrow even, because we can never exactly know what we could be faced with.

Yes, we are told that some would be beheaded and we were told 2,000 years ago that tribulation such has never been since the beginning will come upon the earth. We were warned that if we take this faith, that our lives would be in danger one day.

That's why this faith is a serious faith, because we know that tribulation such as the world has never seen will come and we will be persecuted for His namesake.

The Christian who truly believes in Christ knows this and gladly accepts. The difference in martyrdom for the Christians and Muslims...

Christians don't kill others to become martyrs.

A Muslim that believes they become a martyr by killing others along with themselves, the Bible calls them murderers.